# Colorless Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [December 2, 2009, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729 "2009-12-02T18:21:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 39
**Author:** ![MentalGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/439d5e/32.png) [@MentalGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MentalGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/761 "2009-12-21T21:41:12Z")
Reading over the Day, I haven’t received a lot of heat for it, but there has been some question about my switch to Diggit from Freudian. Simply, while I think Freudian’s play could possibly be frustrated Town, I tend to lean toward her being scum. That said, I thought Diggit’s posts showed a more direct scum motivation. Freudian’s motivation simply looks as if she doesn’t want to be lynched, which would be a motivation for any player. The problem is she looks “over motivated”, I guess you would say. She is being extra defensive and snarky. That, combined with her apparent skimming in several instances, leads me to think we have a scum on our hands. That said, yesterDay, after I reviewed both of their posts, I thought Diggit was the more likely one to be scum. Of the new cases brought against players today, there are some that I see have some merit, such as Tom’s case against Mahaloth and Story’s case against Tom (although part of that case is because of his switch from Freudian to Diggit, which I also did). That said, none of them look as scummy to me as Freudian. In hindsight, I wish I had not backed off her yesterday, since in at least 2 of my last 3 games, I have caught scum just from their general behavior being off instead of any particular slip they have made. That said, I will **Vote Freudian** \*\*Vote Option 2 \*\* Generally, I prefer a shorter Day, but I would like the opportunity to try to do a bit more Story style analysis. Since I am on vacation, I should be able to post anytime I can get on, but getting control of the computer from the rest of the family can sometimes be problematic. So, a longer Day may be better in this instance. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Skeezix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aca169/32.png) [@Red\_Skeezix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Skeezix)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/762 "2009-12-21T22:05:09Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > \ > You still have a vote out on me, but as I re-read your quote: > > You more or less call Tom Scud, Tom Scum, but are still voting for me. :dubious: It is the case that I am suspicious of both you **Meeko** , and **Tom Scud**. I, however, am more suspicious of you than **Tom Scud**. That’s why you have a vote, **Meeko** and not **Tom Scud**. They only give me one vote, if I had more I’d use them all. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/763 "2009-12-21T23:02:10Z")
[oog]hey folks. i am stuck in la grange with very (and i mean very spotty connection). i finally got this site to load after about 20 tries but can’t get idle’s site to load at all. i won’t be back until wednesday at the earliest. sorry, but shit happens. can someone update the other game for me as well. thanks. [/oog] ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2009, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/764 "2009-12-21T23:42:24Z")
@ **Storyteller** > [@storyteller0910](#): > > For him to be lying, the Scum would have had to have guessed both: (1) that pedescribe was lying and was really the SK; and (2) the identity of the _real_ Vig, who they then **role-blocked last Night** , and who nonetheless has declined to counter-claim because… > > …reason to think she is Scum, other than possibly Zeriel’s death (if she is Scum, his content-free vote for her leading off Day Two may have led **Scum to think he might be the Cop** ). And shortly after, this (sorry, can’t multiquote): “I really don’t have a solid read on Freudian herself beyond that, and beyond the possibility that **Zeriel got killed because he was right about Freudian** and the Scum suspected him of being the Cop.” Bolding/snipping mine I hope I haven’t been skimming but I think **Peeker** still hasn’t told us if he was blocked last night - for all we know our RB got lucky. From the first bolded statement you seem to assume that our Vig ( **Peeker** or whoever) was blocked and **Zerial** was NKed by scum. This assumption also comes through in the next two statements. Have I misinterpreted something? ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/765 "2009-12-22T00:51:59Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > @ **Storyteller** > > And shortly after, this (sorry, can’t multiquote): > “I really don’t have a solid read on Freudian herself beyond that, and beyond the possibility that **Zeriel got killed because he was right about Freudian** and the Scum suspected him of being the Cop.” > > Bolding/snipping mine > > I hope I haven’t been skimming but I think **Peeker** still hasn’t told us if he was blocked last night - for all we know our RB got lucky. From the first bolded statement you seem to assume that our Vig ( **Peeker** or whoever) was blocked and **Zerial** was NKed by scum. This assumption also comes through in the next two statements. Have I misinterpreted something? Not at all. I have made that assumption. Assuming I didn’t lose my lunch money on the last bet I made, I’ll bet it again that it’s a good assumption. The Scum would be stupid to do anything else, and Towns have never benefited from expecting the Scum to be stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/766 "2009-12-22T02:00:44Z")
1. Are we agreed the Day ends Wednesday, then? Peeker can’t vote until then and we know he is town, so we should agree on that much anyway. 2. Story, I don’t think I have said I plan on lurking. What I said is that I won’t be able to post as much as I have in games I’ve played in and modded. I’ve tried to play and comment on things as I can and I should be able to more now I have a break from work. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/767 "2009-12-22T02:21:55Z")
**Vote Count** with either about 1 days, 23 hours, and 40 minutes to go or 7 days 23 hours and 0 minutes to go. With 16 players, it takes 10 players voting for one person to start a countdown. The vote for when to end Day will close at 11 AM CST. Unless Option 1 gains more of a consensus, I will choose Option 2 to provide time for input from all the players. (peak vote in parentheses) **2 Votes** \ ***Tom Scud** (2 #751) ToeJam (737), storyteller0910 (751) **Freudian Slit** (2 #761) Drain Bead (707), MentalGuy (761) **1 Vote** **Meeko** (1 #708) Red Skeezix (708) **Nanook of the North Shore** (1 #721) Mahaloth (721) **Mahaloth** (1 #728) Tom Scud **ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies** (1 #733) Freudian Slit (733) **0 Votes** **ToeJam** (1 #716) Tom Scud (716 723) **Drain Bead** **USCDiver** **peekercpa** **storyteller0910** **Alka Seltzer** **Red Skeezix** **MHaye** **GuiriEnEspaña** **Mental Guy** _Lynch Leader \*\* Not voting:_\* Nanook of the North Shore, USCDiver, peekercpa, Alka Seltzer, MHaye, Meeko, GuiriEnEspaña, ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies End of Day votes: **7 Votes** \*\*Option 1: Day will end on Wednesday, December 23rd at 8PM CST \*\* Drain Bead USCDiver Meeko Mahaloth peekercpa Freudian Slit GuiriEnEspaña **6 Votes** **Option 2: Day will end on Tuesday, December 29th at 8PM CST** Red Skeezix MHaye Alka Seltzer ToeJam Tom Scud MentalGuy ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/768 "2009-12-22T03:16:25Z")
Just a heads up to the group. I’m working night shift this week through Thursday morning. I’ll keep up with the reading and make a vote before the end of the Day, but I won’t be involved in any extended discussions. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Skeezix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aca169/32.png) [@Red\_Skeezix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Skeezix)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/769 "2009-12-22T05:01:28Z")
I just found out my internet access will be severly limited from tomorrow until the 27th, I’ll be checking back whenever I can. ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/770 "2009-12-22T10:04:42Z")
OK, I have some issues with parts of **Storyteller** ’s analysis of Day 2 - again sorry for not using multi-quote. Several of the cases against **Freudian** were carried over from arguments or votes made on Day 1 which you seem to ignore and I don’t see what you mean by “a lot of terrible votes for her”: 1. Re: “_I have no particular reason to think she is Scum, other than possibly Zeriel’s death (if she is Scum, his content-free vote for her leading off Day Two may have led Scum to think he might be the Cop_“ - **Zeriel** was the first to vote **FS** on Day 1 ([#230](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11860551&postcount=230), he confirmed the vote in [#382](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11871369&postcount=382) and again in [#401](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11872020&postcount=401). On Day 2 he was again the first to vote ([#512](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11881651&postcount=512)) based on his arguments from the previous day and confirmed his vote in [#661](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11899434&postcount=661). I would not consider this a “content-free” vote and, from his suspicions on her from early Day 1, I don’t see why scum would make the **Zeriel** =Cop connection. 2. Re: “_ **Skeezix** votes **Freudian Slit,** evidently because she is confident that **peeker** is telling the truth._” - **Red** expressed suspicion of **Freudian** in [#276](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11862725&postcount=276), voted in [#378](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11871286&postcount=378) and defended his vote in [#381](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11871367&postcount=381), confirmed it in [#409](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11872209&postcount=409) and only moved it after **Pedescribe** ’s SK claim while maintaining a level of suspicion on **FS**. On Day 2 he voted her in [#536](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11885016&postcount=536) for a mischaracterization of one of his posts, the iffy reasoning about trusting **Peeker** and the “vote the NK” plan and confirmed the vote in [#591](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11890383&postcount=591). 3. Re: “_Now **Drain Bead** votes for **Freudian,** basically because the latter didn’t see the peek-gets-guidance-from-the-Town plan as being as blindingly awful as many others._” - **Drain Bead** expressed her suspicions of **Freudian** early on Day 1 in [#270](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11861686&postcount=270), voted in [#298](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11865484&postcount=298) for “threadskimming and overdefensiveness” and then moved to **Pedescribe** after the counter-claim while maintaing a high level of suspicion on **FS**. On Day 2 she voted [#545](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11885575&postcount=545) citing the same reasons as Day 1 “I see no reason to move my vote from where it had been before ped was outed” in addition to **Freudian** ’s reaction to the “vote the NK” plan. And then confirmed her vote in [#656](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11897872&postcount=656) pending a claim from **Diggit** and repeated that she finds **FS** the scummiest in [#660](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11898857&postcount=660). In fact, she was also the first to vote today with another vote on **FS** in [#707](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11906616&postcount=707). 4. Re: “_ **Tom Scud,** at #561, makes another basically content-free vote for **Freudian.** _” - **Tom** ’s already repeated his reasoning for his vote – I wouldn’t consider a vote accompanied by a WoW to be “another basically content-free vote”. 5. Re: “\ ***GuiriinEspana** piles on to \*_Freudian_” - My vote ([#568](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11887305&postcount=568)) was a response to her misrepresenting a post I made after **Pedescribe** ’s claim on Day 1 and FOS-ing me in addition to previous suspicions 6. Re: “_Basically the argument here seems to be that refusing to unvote out of general principles following a role-claim is Scummy_” - **USC** voted because she FOS-ed players who unvoted, not because she didn’t unvote. 7. Re: “_Now **Mental Guy** for **Freudian** , again. Same basic reason. Doesn’t make sense. Why would Scum continue to push on a Town power role?_” – again, **MentalGuy** voted in [#584](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11889020&postcount=584) for mischaracterizing other players unvotes in addition to his previous suspicions from Day 1 [#397](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11871937&postcount=397) Now, while not all reasons are rock solid and there’s a pretty high level of OMGUS in some of these votes and yes, some of them are weak - I’m not trying to defend anyone - but you really seem to have gone out of your way to misrepresent almost every vote made on **FS**. That’s not townie behavior. I agree that the vote shifts are suspect, I agree that there’s probably one or more scum on the bandwagon, I agree with a lot of the other things you say in your post but the way you’ve approached the analysis of the **FS** bandwagon is suspicious. Add this to your assumption – you should at least have spelled out somewhere in your post that you were making an assuption - that **Peeker** was blocked and that **Zeriel** was the scum kill last Night and I think I should accompany these suspicions with a vote: **vote Storyteller** ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/771 "2009-12-22T13:03:06Z")
I have limited access atm, I’m at my parents over Christmas and New Year. I’ve caught up on the thread, but probably won’t get the chance to do any analysis today. Can we switch the deadline to the 29th please? There aren’t nearly enough votes down for a day end tomorrow. Nanook didn’t vote at all yesterday, but hasn’t posted anywhere else on the boards since the 14th (he last logged in yesterday). ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/772 "2009-12-22T13:12:20Z")
Agreed, we don’t want to rush day end. **Swich to Option 2** ---
**Author:** ![ToeJam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/773 "2009-12-22T17:22:47Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Also, Toe, if you think I switched votes to save a scummy Freudian, why are you voting for me, and not Freudian? Because though I think FS is scummy, it’s also the MOST easily manipulatable outcome as well. If I were scum, one of the BEST things one can do is to have a two way battle between two townies, driving a suspicious vote shift from one to the other. So that way you mislynch a single townie, then the next day you say “hey guys, since X was Town, and everyone moved to vote for her, it’s because Y was automatically scum!” And then you just go for an easy pile on vote on the other candidate and lynch them while trying to keep the discussions to a minimum so that nothing new is discussed- everyone just re-hashes the old arguements from the previous day and cites them as reasons to vote AGAIN for the original vote getter. It’s a tactic called “Bussing a Townie” and it’s a nefarious tactic (which works EXTREMELY well in the _Presidential elimination_ game btw- not a mafia game, but an interesting game to follow in the game thread for watching vote shifts). That’s why I wanted to analyze the shifts in the voting patterns- Scum don’t all have magic “scum tells” and there is not a single hard and fast rule that says “Scum ALWAYS do X, and X is inherently scummy”, any one pushing that sort of an agenda gets really suspicious looks from me. Because the one thing scum can use to their advantage is someone who believes that something is a hard and fast scum tell. Hence this whole “Skimming is scummy” argument. I know plenty of players who skim in these sorts of games- just what is skimming? Did anyone notice my 3 posts in day one where I secretly \*\*bolded \*\*words to spell out a hidden message or am I just kidding and did I not do such a thing and sending you on a wild goose chase? Is it skimming if you don’t know the answer to that? As scum, one of my fav. things to do was mass post repeatedly, to the point of where people would ignore my posts- and then when you didn’t see my arguments, just BAM! Skimmer! Scummy skimmer is you! Already several people have seemingly attacked \*\*storyteller \*\*for his posts in which he pretty much comes to the same conclusion I have, should I automatically label them as skimmers? I’ll be honest with you- as a townie, I have skimmed on plenty of occasions. I’m not liking the fact that seems to be a driving issue for the FS vote as it feels like people are just echoing again old points, where’s the analysis, where’s the new data points? Not a fan of it. However, I will assume you **Tom Scud** , should you turn up Scum I will DEFINITELY look at Freudian with a harder eye again. But right now, I would rather try to find the scummiest voters for the day rather than to simply focus in on the whipping post that everyone seems to have found. Plenty of people will make an argument against FS again I’m sure, I want to bring up new points to the light. ---
**Author:** ![ToeJam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/774 "2009-12-22T17:32:53Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > Now, while not all reasons are rock solid and there’s a pretty high level of OMGUS in some of these votes and yes, some of them are weak - I’m not trying to defend anyone - but you really seem to have gone out of your way to misrepresent almost every vote made on **FS**. That’s not townie behavior. I agree that the vote shifts are suspect, I agree that there’s probably one or more scum on the bandwagon, I agree with a lot of the other things you say in your post but the way you’ve approached the analysis of the **FS** bandwagon is suspicious. > > Add this to your assumption – you should at least have spelled out somewhere in your post that you were making an assuption - that **Peeker** was blocked and that **Zeriel** was the scum kill last Night and I think I should accompany these suspicions with a vote: > > **vote Storyteller** Hey, **GEE** , I gotta say I find this kinda suspicious. Why did you vote for Storyteller and not me? We both had similar conclusions, we both had similar votes, and I’m curious as to why ST get’s the heat but not me. I too believe- trust no one- assume everyone is scum and try to figure out what’s the possible scum motivation behind each action- so the whole “painting each vote in a negative light” that’s standard operating procedures. Unless the towns’ have been getting REALLY soft and stupid since I used to play, every townie should be paranoid and trying NOT to trust people but to see who is the most scummy in their actions. Also, put me in the bandwagon of “\*\*Peeks \*\*didn’t kill last night” he would be an idiot if he killed \*\*zeriel \*\*and didn’t say anything for the first 24 hours about this. Also, when someone dies, I’m more likely to assume scum did it. Because, again, assuming scum screwed up only screws with the town in the end. Consider these options: Scum Killed Z. Peek killed Z, Scum were roleblocked. Peek and Scum killed Z Peek killed Z, and Scum chose not to kill in hopes of exposing the RoleBlocker into saying they blocked Y, and thusly they can try the “bus a townie” tactic as well as get to kill the RB that night, or the Vig, since now the Doc would be be in WIFOM. Also: Peek killed Z, and Scum were not blocked but hit the doctor, who self protected. Or scum hit the Doc’s protection target. All of these are options to consider, but since Peeks didn’t man up at the very start of the day that he killed Z, I’m not going to go into the backalley thoughts and just go with the simple one: Scum WANT to target someone every night. Scum WANT people dead. Dead people help scum. Ergo Z’s death helps scum- they probably wanted him dead. Now the “Why Z?” “Why now” sorta questions- I got no answers for that, but I will say- if I see a dead body from here on out, I’m assuming scum did it, unless \*\*peeker \*\*says he did it (And \*\*Peeks \*\*I HOPE you would tell us first thing if you DO kill someone). ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/775 "2009-12-22T17:35:34Z")
Thanks for the extensive explanation of why it’s possible that a Townie could skim. I’d be even more impressed if I hadn’t mentioned the possibility in my vote of FS, and cited that possibility as part of why I unvoted. I admit, it was a crappy vote/revote; I should have switched to **Diggit** at 594 when my gut told me to; instead I waited until I felt validated by other players’ moves. Also, the reason **story** got a lot more heat than you is that he mischaracterized (and smudged) the people who had voted for **FS** in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/776 "2009-12-22T17:37:04Z")
Note: previous cross-posted with ToeJam’s post before it. I’ll note that he could easily have worked out why Guiri voted Story and not him by reading Guiri’s post and noticing what exactly he accuses story OF. ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/777 "2009-12-22T18:04:46Z")
Good to see ToeJam is back and participating. > [@Mahaloth](#): > > **Vote Nanook** **@Mahaloth** - Other than inactivity, do you have any reason to vote Nanook? > [@Mahaloth](#): > > Hey, I get it, Tom. I’m having a very hard time getting a solid read on anyone. I’m trying to look for anti-town/pro-scum activity(same thing I guess) and place my vote there. I mean, if I could find a huge scum slip or something, I’d vote that person immediately. However, I have not seen anything obviously pro-scum. Apparently, neither has anyone else, as we’ve lynched town. > … > Aside from fabricating a loose case based on huge speculation, which I think people frequently do, the only thing I can come up with is to vote for those who have stirred up issues and then sat back to watch things fly. I agree with Tom that doing little other than throwing out votes to lynch inactive players is supicious. It’s difficult to build decent cases at this stage, but we need to do the best we can with the information we have. The goal is to find scum at a better than random rate. > [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > @ **Alka** , I’m not sure why you think I’m assuming you are town. You said you regretted **not giving me a better read on you**. If you thought I was scum, you wouldn’t be concerned about giving me a read, I’d know your alignment. > [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > I’m going to go back and look hard at Alka again and see if my suspicions from yesterday have grown or faded. @ **Cookies** - You haven’t made a case against me, why do you find me suspicious? > [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > Okay, so I missed ONE post. I can’t read every single post in detail–either I can ask a question, or I can try to read the whole thread every time I’m confused. Post #67 has been mentioned several times, it’s the one that has the game setup and is essential reading. I find the late swing away from Freudian to Diggit interesting, but I’m not sure what to make of it. If Freudian is scum, I think it highly likely scum would have placed an early bus vote or two on her. If she is town, scum had several options. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/778 "2009-12-22T18:10:39Z")
The “skimming” that I consider as categorically anti-town is when players emphasize a single post or small number of posts by a player and use those posts as a platform for suspicion when in fact the targeted players’ inclusive posting history (and/or similar behavior from other players etc), if taken into account, would nullify all or part of the argument being made against the targeted player. It is absolutely anti-town for a townie to play that way because it creates a lot more analysis work for all of the other townies while simultaneously providing cover and manipulation opportunities to the scum. The other townies now have to do the due diligence that the lazy/skimming Townie player did not do, check the facts, realize that the targeted players posting context is not really as the lazy/skimming Townie presented, and THEN that same player is left wrestling with what to do with the doubts and suspicions he/she has about the lazy/skimming Townie. It is a double-edged sword when Townies do it, and that is very bad. When a Scum does it, it only cuts one way and it a relatively common behavior for them, which is just how the game is played. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/779 "2009-12-22T18:48:36Z")
> [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > Welcome to the game, **Meeko**. And a belated thanks to **Alka** as well. Thanks for helping out. > > I for one do not see **Skeez** letting up on me a little bit as suspicious. It makes me inclined to relax a bit about him as well, at least for now since we seem to be more in sync in our views. I’d like to know more about whether **Alka’s** suspicion of **Skeez** for backing off extends to me by proxy and why. Did you find his case against me compelling, **Alka**? > > I’m still trying to make sense of **Alka’s** list of questions too. > > As for **Freudian** , I’m still not sold on the case against her. I am not sure that it doesn’t boil down to folks having a general dislike of her snark and playstyle, perhaps with a few opportunistic scummy votes thrown in. > > At this point I’m looking the closest at **Alka** and **Diggit** based on what we’ve seen so far Today. This post and the strange hypothetical to pledge votes are really all I had on you, **Alka** , but you have addressed most of my concerns now that I’ve re-read a bit. I’m also realizing that with my last post I’ve pretty much talked myself into being comfortable for voting for **Freudian** at this point. She still has her vote on me in spite of the full context of my Diggit vote being pointed out to her, further weakening her case. From an information perspective, a claim or a flip from **Freudian** is going to produce a big junk of data to analyze, however it goes down. I’m probably going to catch some heat for saying that, but it is what it is. I’m probably going to catch some heat for flip-flopping a bit on her as well, but she happens to have a play style that can rub people the wrong way, and so does **peeker** , so I have been trying to mitigate for that since they were both quite active on Day 1 and we are still riding some of the ripples of those early interactions. **Vote Freudian** ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2009, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729/780 "2009-12-22T18:50:05Z")
that should be chunk of data, hopefully not junk data… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729.md?page=38) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/colorless-mafia/519729.md?page=40)