# Combat troops not wearing helmets? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 7, 2015, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279 "2015-08-07T23:07:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2015, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/1 "2015-08-07T23:07:57Z")
I’ve seen pictures and videos of US combat troops not wearing a helmet. They just wear a regular type hat. Is there any reason for this other than just trying to carry less weight? for example [http://previous.presstv.ir/photo/20120929/mbadakhsh20120929105940063.jpg](http://previous.presstv.ir/photo/20120929/mbadakhsh20120929105940063.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2015, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/2 "2015-08-07T23:14:00Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > I’ve seen pictures and videos of US combat troops not wearing a helmet. They just wear a regular type hat. Is there any reason for this other than just trying to carry less weight? > > for example > > [http://previous.presstv.ir/photo/20120929/mbadakhsh20120929105940063.jpg](http://previous.presstv.ir/photo/20120929/mbadakhsh20120929105940063.jpg) They are usually light troops or scouts (special forces, etc) that do this, and yes, it’s to reduce weight (as well heat, since full load combat gear is heavy AND hot) and better protection from the sun. The ones I know of are called [boonie hats](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boonie_hat). > [@](#): > > U.S. military boonie hat > Vietnam era tigerstripe pattern boonie hat. > > The boonie hat was introduced to the United States Armed Forces during the Vietnam War, when U.S. Army Green Berets began wearing them in the field, along with Australian and Army of the Republic of Vietnam units.[1] These leopard spot or tigerstripe boonie hats were locally procured, the camo cloth was usually salvaged from other uniform items or with the former from a parachute or made up by the tailor. The name is derived from “boonie”, the abbreviated form of boondocks (itself originally American military slang derived from Tagalog bundok, “mountain”, during the Philippine-American War).[2][3][4][5] > > In 1967, the U.S. Army began issuing boonie hats, as the “Hat, Jungle, with Insect Net”, made of cotton and wind-resistant poplin, in olive drab, tigerstripe, and ERDL pattern.[6] It was meant to supplement and replace the patrol and baseball caps that had been in service since World War II. As the U.S. military evolved away from a garrison mentality, the boonie hat found a permanent place as part of the uniform of all services. The boonie hat has changed little through the decades since the Vietnam War and was used in the Iraq War and still in the War in Afghanistan as an alternative to the patrol cap. The U.S. military boonie hat has come in a variety of camouflage patterns; the current assortment includes Woodland, three-color desert, UCP, MultiCam, and both desert and woodland versions of MARPAT, as well as the Air Force ABU pattern.[1] The boonie hat is often worn with the wearer’s rank insignia pinned to the front, above the branch loops. > Hat, Camouflage (Tropical Combat) Type II > > In 1968 the U.S. Army authorized use of the woodland ERDL pattern (Engineering Research Development Laboratory) material, used in the 1969 and later production of hats in cotton ripstop material. These were labeled, “Hat, Camouflage (Tropical Combat) Type II” with contract dates starting in 1968. They were in use from 1968 for both the Army and Air Force, and from 1969-70 for the Marine Corps and Navy.[1] > Hat, Sun, Hot Weather > > Later boonies are called “Hat, Sun” or “Hat, Sun, Hot Weather”, which is still the designation for this type of cover. They are made in various patterns, in cotton ripstop or nylon blend cloth.[1] ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2015, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/3 "2015-08-07T23:14:25Z")
According to [wiki](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boonie_hat) the boonie hat (the type those fellas have on) was introduced in Vietnam for camouflage and comfort reasons, as well as weight. Ninja’d! ---
**Author:** ![Snnipe\_70E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5a626/32.png) [@Snnipe\_70E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snnipe_70E)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2015, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/4 "2015-08-07T23:31:03Z")
Look at the picture. By the men’s knees are the helmets. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2015, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/5 "2015-08-07T23:43:52Z")
A lot of troops don’t like wearing helmets in combat. They are not brain surgeons. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/6 "2015-08-08T00:04:56Z")
Helmets are uncomfortable; they are heavy and hot. Grunts often don’t wear them unless combat is considered a definite possibilty. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/7 "2015-08-08T00:30:04Z")
I knew a guy who was in Vietnam and things were going ok in his unit until they got a new Lieutenant who insisted they wear helmets. That was somewhat unpopular, but not as unpopular as when he decided they should start wearing small lights on their helmets so they could see each other at night. I always take “fragging” stories with a grain of salt, but supposedly that Lieutenant had an accident that solved their helmet problems. > [@Snnipe\_70E](#): > > Look at the picture. By the men’s knees are the helmets. And as a result of budget cutbacks, those eleven guys have to share two helmets. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/8 "2015-08-08T02:06:53Z")
That photo looks like it was taken “inside the wire”. I am confident that when they go out, they are buttoned up better. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/9 "2015-08-08T06:06:09Z")
They are wearing boonies for the picture, that’s it. They will put on their helmets right after. Yes helmets are heavy and hot and nobody likes wearing them. But that is not an option. Soldiers can’t even ride inside vehicles without wearing a helmet, let alone go into combat without it. Doesnt matter if its a walk through a permissive village with no chance of a firefight, the helmet will be worn. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/10 "2015-08-08T06:08:11Z")
I saw a soldier relieved of duty for not wearing eye protection (sun glasses). Imagine if someone didnt wear a helmet. Its not taken lightly. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/11 "2015-08-08T09:28:38Z")
> [@Bear\_Nenno](#): > > They are wearing boonies for the picture, that’s it. They will put on their helmets right after. > Yes helmets are heavy and hot and nobody likes wearing them. But that is not an option. Soldiers can’t even ride inside vehicles without wearing a helmet, let alone go into combat without it. Doesnt matter if its a walk through a permissive village with no chance of a firefight, the helmet will be worn. I’ve got no idea – but of course you wear a helmet inside a vehicle, not outside. The hazards are different. Helmets were mostly decorative, and to keep the rain off, until the WWI. In WWI, most of the casualties were by shelling, and the helmet offered critical protection. In WWII, I assume that there were a lot of casualties from bombing and shelling, and the helmet offered critical protection. Have they got bullet-proof helmets now? Because in WWI and WWII, helmets didn’t offer any protection against getting shot. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/12 "2015-08-08T09:48:29Z")
The web gear I was issued had straps in the back designed to hold a helmet. Useful for extended marches, especially in the Middle East. ---
**Author:** ![Bert\_Nobbins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@Bert\_Nobbins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bert_Nobbins)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/13 "2015-08-08T12:23:13Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Helmets were mostly decorative, and to keep the rain off, until the WWI. Armoured knights would probably disagree with you. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/14 "2015-08-08T13:30:17Z")
> [@Bert\_Nobbins](#): > > Armoured knights would probably disagree with you. [This guy](http://www.bradford.ac.uk/research/our-research/research-in-faculties/life-sciences/areas-centres/biological-anthropology-research-centre/projects/towton-mass-grave-project/) in particular. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/15 "2015-08-08T13:42:20Z")
> [@Fubaya](#): > > And as a result of budget cutbacks, those eleven guys have to share two helmets. 😉 [Enemy at the Gates]The one with the helmet charges ! The one without follows him somewhat more carefully ! When the first one gets shot, the second one picks up the helmet and keeps advancing ! The one with the helmet… [/EatG] [QUOTE=Melbourne] Have they got bullet-proof helmets now? Because in WWI and WWII, helmets didn’t offer any protection against getting shot. [/QUOTE] Nope. Helmets are still about shrapnel, loose earth & masonry, glancing shots, the occasional bits and pieces of your fellow man… Getting shot in the helmet dead on is still pretty much a closed casket proposition. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/16 "2015-08-08T14:15:36Z")
The helmet has two parts: the shell (the heavy metal outer piece) and the helmet liner (made of plastic and contains the suspension). You can wear the liner alone, but it will only protect to the extent that a hardhat will. It always makes me roll my eyes when I see combat troops in a movie wearing just the liner, and trying to pass it off as a full helmet. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/17 "2015-08-08T14:22:58Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > The helmet has two parts: the shell (the heavy metal outer piece) and the helmet liner (made of plastic and contains the suspension). You can wear the liner alone, but it will only protect to the extent that a hardhat will. It always makes me roll my eyes when I see combat troops in a movie wearing just the liner, and trying to pass it off as a full helmet. In what movies have you seen this? If it’s from movies about recent conflicts, perhaps this is something which is actually done in the US military given that the main reason troops use helmets is the same that construction workers and people who practice dangerous sports do. Special forces commonly wear something that resembles a hockey/skateboard helmet and they’ve been doing that since at least 1993. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/18 "2015-08-08T15:09:22Z")
What different special operations outfits wear isn’t really a good representation of the norm, but yeah they have worn smaller helmets and often lighter body armor as well (often with no ceramic plate.) Depending on what they’re doing in country the needs of a unconventional force will be far different than a typical infantryman. Not to denigrate the special operations guys but often times they have things easier than a grunt. Infantrymen are often tasked with forward force projection, basically moving around in, patrolling, and in essence “occupying territory” in places that may have enemy forces at any turn, hidden in holes in the ground, on rooftops or etc. They need heavy protective equipment because they could be shot at pretty much at any time. Some special operations units largely spend most of their time on base in between missions, where they are sent out to do things like (admittedly quite dangerous) high value target raids into a building, rescue operations, or etc. These are different than a grunt being on patrol in that they **know** they’re going to engage the enemy, but they also know they’re going to engage the enemy at relatively close range and in a scenario where they need to be fast and deadly. Heavier protective gear just weighs them down, they are trained to go in and have everyone dead quickly enough they likely won’t _need_ it anyway. Whereas a grunt is basically, by design, a big moving target for anyone in country that dislikes our military being there. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/19 "2015-08-08T15:25:13Z")
Sure. I should have made my point explicit and said that gear and methods that are first experimented with by special forces have a way of trickling down into conventional forces. Perhaps helmets optimized for weight and ventilation rather than ballistic protection is the latest manifestation of that. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2015, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279/20 "2015-08-08T15:31:22Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > Perhaps helmets optimized for weight and ventilation rather than ballistic protection is the latest manifestation of that. Ha! I wish!! [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/combat-troops-not-wearing-helmets/727279.md?page=2)