# Comey Fired! Who is covering who? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 9, 2017, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226 "2017-05-09T21:57:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/221 "2017-05-11T15:59:39Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > You didn’t have to type so many words to claim “fake news.” No, I’m not saying it’s “fake news.” Somewhere in there, there might be a (the) real reason(s) for the firing. After all, presumably at least some of the people being mentioned actually know something. But with at least five different plausible reasons mooted for the action, pointing to just one of them and saying, “that one, that’s the reason!” is not offering any real evidence that it is actually the reason. Because you cannot discern which of the proffered tidbits of insider gossip are real, and which are “fake news.” ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/222 "2017-05-11T16:01:53Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > The gist of the reporting I’ve seen is that Trump fired Comey because he felt Comey should have tamped down public discussion of the Russia investigation, focused more on leak investigations, and that (as I suggested earlier) he was particularly outraged by Comey’s congressional testimony about Russian interference affecting the election. > > All in all, it does not appear at this point that Trump was worried about the substance of the Russia investigation so much as the continuing discussion of it. Watch out. You appear to be taking a heretical viewpoint, based upon the responses I’ve gotten for suggesting similar reasoning might apply. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/223 "2017-05-11T16:04:12Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Unless you’re aware of telepathic technology, I’m pretty sure that demanding a confirmed reading of the President’s brain is impossible. If the people who know and work with him are insufficient for your process of determining his motives, then I question what you would reasonably expect that is better? > > If, of ten aides, five are saying that it’s Russia, three are saying that it’s wiretapping, and two are saying that it’s the refusal to review his testimony, then the logical course is to assume that the decision was 50% one, 30% the other, and 20% the last, not that it’s proof that there’s no knowable answer. Finding disagreement among experts isn’t proof that the experts are all wrong, it’s evidence that the situation has some subtlety to answer. Are YOU able to count up the number of “aides” who said each of the things being posited? Are YOU able to determine which of them are more likely to actually know what the President was thinking? Under the circumstances, pointing to one version of “the reason” out of all the versions offered and taking it as being the ONE that is true is silly. It MAY be true. But without knowing the answers to the two questions above, you’re as much in the dark as anyone. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/224 "2017-05-11T16:12:03Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > Watch out. You appear to be taking a heretical viewpoint, based upon the responses I’ve gotten for suggesting similar reasoning might apply. :rolleyes: Not a problem, I’m used to it. 🙂 From [CNN](http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/10/politics/white-hot-trump-comey/) > [@](#): > > Several people familiar with the decision say the President grew increasingly frustrated at Comey after his congressional hearing last Wednesday when he testified that he was “mildly nauseous” over the idea that he helped sway the election. Even the health care victory in the House one day later couldn’t take his mind off Comey, two people close to Trump said. > > “He wouldn’t hear it (that he should be encouraged),” the friend said. “It’s Russia. Russia. Trump and Russia.” The President complained, with expletives, about Comey’s “mildly nauseous” answer and said his answer when pressed on leaks convinced the President he was far less concerned about the leaks than Trump thought he should be. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/225 "2017-05-11T16:20:40Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > No, I’m not saying it’s “fake news.” Somewhere in there, there might be a (the) real reason(s) for the firing. After all, presumably at least some of the people being mentioned actually know something. But with at least five different plausible reasons mooted for the action, pointing to just one of them and saying, “that one, that’s the reason!” is not offering any real evidence that it is actually the reason. Because you cannot discern which of the proffered tidbits of insider gossip are real, and which are “fake news.” Well then so, let’s use the magic called “thinking”. Trump’s stated reason is that he agreed with Rosenstein’s report. Rosenstein’s report, unless I skimmed over it, didn’t recommend firing the FBI Director. It simply stated and provided reasonable explanation to the effect that Comey had mismanaged the Clinton case in terms of his public engagements, during the election. Those things that Rosenstein criticizes are, explicitly, Trump’s favorite things about Comey. I’ll not bother providing evidence to that effect, since Trump’s tweets and public speeches aren’t really usable evidence for anything, but I think that we can reasonably conclude it to be true. We can rule out the idea that Trump fired Comey for the reasons that Rosenstein provided. And that leaves…what? If the President of the United States did not fire the head of the FBI on the basis that he had, legitimately, engaged in some questionable behavior, is there really anything good that remains? Now let’s consider the case of the Civil War. There are some people who say that the war was to end slavery. Others will say that it was economic. Others will say that it was to preserve the Union. And while each of these arguments is fair and reasonable, anyone saying that the war wasn’t “about” slavery is wrong. It may be true that the South cared more about the basis for their economy than they did about whether that depended on slaves or robots or sheep, it just happened to be slaves. And it may be true that the North went to war to prevent the Union from slowly dissolving into a bunch of independent states again. That’s true, but it still comes down to the issue of slaves. The South’s economy was in jeopardy because of the tightening restrictions on slave ownership. The North’s action was a necessity brought by the South’s attempt to succeed in support of protecting slavery. Slavery is the germ of every argument, and only blind pedantry ignores that. In Trump’s case: Leaks: Leaks about Russia that caused an investigation! Wiretaps: Wiretapped as part of the investigation of Russia! Investigation: Investigations into Russia! Testimony: Testimony about investigations into Russia! No matter what, it’s inescapable that Comey was fired over Russia. He wasn’t fired over Hillary’s emails. There’s nothing else that remains outside of those two options that I am aware of. We can be pedantic about which of the subcategories of Russia it was or the specific percentile breakout, but that doesn’t change the base fact that Comey was fired because Trump was angry about the Russian investigation. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/226 "2017-05-11T16:29:24Z")
On the heals of Comey’s firing, [Trump to sign EO on voter fraud investigation](http://thehill.com/business-a-lobbying/332905-trump-expected-to-sign-order-launching-commission-on-election-integrity). So, chief among Trump’s reasons for firing Comey are: 1. Election voter fraud 2. Russia 3. Surprise 4. Fear 5. Comey’s lack of fanatical devotion ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/227 "2017-05-11T16:36:55Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Not really. I don’t have a dog in this fight but most of the board were screaming for him to go because of the pre-election email stuff. “most of the board”? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/228 "2017-05-11T16:38:01Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > On the heals of Comey’s firing, [Trump to sign EO on voter fraud investigation](http://thehill.com/business-a-lobbying/332905-trump-expected-to-sign-order-launching-commission-on-election-integrity). I saw that and though it was sort of funny. Not to say that both parties don’t muck around with the election, but the Democrats largely try to encourage more people to vote while the Republicans are more active in trying to suppress votes. Only one of those two options is reasonable. Both parties have practiced some outrageous gerrymandering, but the Republicans are in the lead. If the commission does their job honestly, I’m expecting them to be shut down and hidden away promptly upon the publishing of their report. ---
**Author:** ![Tzigone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Tzigone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzigone)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/229 "2017-05-11T16:38:52Z")
[Rosenstein meets with Senate Intel leaders](http://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/11/rosenstein-seeks-meeting-with-senate-intelligence-leaders-238268) Apparently, Warner and Burr left the senate intelligence committee meeting (televised on C-SPAN and PBS) to meet with him. So I’m curious to find out what’s going on there. I really have no idea how common leaving these meeting in the middle is, especially for chair and vice chair. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/230 "2017-05-11T16:45:31Z")
> [@Tzigone](#): > > [Rosenstein meets with Senate Intel leaders](http://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/11/rosenstein-seeks-meeting-with-senate-intelligence-leaders-238268) > > Apparently, Warner and Burr left the senate intelligence committee meeting (televised on C-SPAN and PBS) to meet with him. So I’m curious to find out what’s going on there. I really have no idea how common leaving these meeting in the middle is, especially for chair and vice chair. As I understand it, they make it a requirement to do everything together so far as it has to do with the committee. Still very strange though. Sounds like something rather impressive must have happened or be happening. ---
**Author:** ![Tzigone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Tzigone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzigone)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/231 "2017-05-11T16:48:10Z")
Now I’m reading Rosenstein’s Twitter account was suspended. Don’t know if that’s his real account (the one I found was suspended, but I’ve never gone to it before). But that could just be Twitter shutting it down because of what others are tweeting, right? I mean, a Twitter account doesn’t seem very important. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/232 "2017-05-11T16:49:07Z")
> [@Tzigone](#): > > [Rosenstein meets with Senate Intel leaders](http://www.politico.com/story/2017/05/11/rosenstein-seeks-meeting-with-senate-intelligence-leaders-238268) > > Apparently, Warner and Burr left the senate intelligence committee meeting (televised on C-SPAN and PBS) to meet with him. So I’m curious to find out what’s going on there. I really have no idea how common leaving these meeting in the middle is, especially for chair and vice chair. The twitterati are speculating either the appointment of a special prosecutor or he’s resigning and wants to correct the record re: Comey. But we’ll find out soon. ---
**Author:** ![Tzigone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Tzigone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzigone)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/233 "2017-05-11T17:05:58Z")
> [@](#): > > The twitterati are speculating either the appointment of a special prosecutor or he’s resigning and wants to correct the record re: Comey. But we’ll find out soon. So the Twitter account was a fake (not surprising) and the meeting wasn’t anything urgent? If I’m understanding correctly? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/234 "2017-05-11T17:32:12Z")
> [@Tzigone](#): > > So the Twitter account was a fake (not surprising) and the meeting wasn’t anything urgent? If I’m understanding correctly? The meeting might still be going on. I haven’t heard any reporting yet about what it was about. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/235 "2017-05-11T17:34:08Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > The meeting might still be going on. I haven’t heard any reporting yet about what it was about. I heard it was about outlining boundaries between ongoing FBI investigation and separate congressional investigations. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/236 "2017-05-11T18:13:56Z")
> [@DinoR](#): > > Correct with a tie vote presumably still getting confirmed based on Pence’s tiebreaker as VP. The Constitutional clause (Article I, Section 3, fourth paragraph) that gives the veep his tie-breaking powers isn’t limited or restricted in any way. So it can be used on procedural votes such as cloture votes as well as votes on confirmations and legislation. IIRC, this just happened, with Pence breaking the tie on the cloture vote for DeVos’ nomination as Secretary of Education. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/237 "2017-05-11T19:58:18Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I think that reports of the deputy AG (Rosenstein) threatening to quit over being used by the WH to justify Comey’s firing is fairly significant development as well. Yeah, I’ve seen reports that Rosenstein threatened to resign. What I haven’t seen is the “unless…” part. What does he want in order to not resign? > [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > In Trump’s case: > > Leaks: Leaks about Russia that caused an investigation! > Wiretaps: Wiretapped as part of the investigation of Russia! > Investigation: Investigations into Russia! > Testimony: Testimony about investigations into Russia! > > No matter what, it’s inescapable that Comey was fired over Russia. He wasn’t fired over Hillary’s emails. There’s nothing else that remains outside of those two options that I am aware of. We can be pedantic about which of the subcategories of Russia it was or the specific percentile breakout, but that doesn’t change the base fact that Comey was fired because Trump was angry about the Russian investigation. Yeah, I’ve seen it phrased more vaguely, like “Trump considered Comey insubordinate” or “Trump considered Comey disloyal”. It still boils down to the same thing; Trump wanted to control someone who must remain independent in order to do his job. And that job, at the moment, includes investigating Trump. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/238 "2017-05-11T21:12:11Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I think that reports of the deputy AG (Rosenstein) threatening to quit over being used by the WH to justify Comey’s firing is fairly significant development as well. (Underline added) Reported by whom? _CNN reported Thursday morning that DOJ rejected the claim made by the Post’s **anonymous** source late Wednesday night that said “Rosenstein threatened to resign after the narrative emerging from the White House on Tuesday evening cast him as a prime mover of the decision to fire Comey and that the president acted only on his recommendation.”_ > **[DOJ: Rosenstein Did Not Threaten To Resign](https://dailycaller.com/2017/05/11/doj-rosenstein-did-not-threaten-to-resign/)** > > The Department of Justice refuted a Washington Post report that claimed Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein threatened to resign over the circumstances surrounding the dismissal of former FBI Director James Comey. Is it possible that the news media outlets are so quick to report something/anything concerning this story that they couldn’t be bothered to actually verify the alleged utterances of _anonymous_ sources? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/239 "2017-05-11T21:22:16Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > (Underline added) > > Reported by whom? > > _CNN reported Thursday morning that DOJ rejected the claim made by the Post’s **anonymous** source late Wednesday night that said “Rosenstein threatened to resign after the narrative emerging from the White House on Tuesday evening cast him as a prime mover of the decision to fire Comey and that the president acted only on his recommendation.”_ > > [DOJ: Rosenstein Did Not Threaten To Resign | The Daily Caller](http://dailycaller.com/2017/05/11/doj-rosenstein-did-not-threaten-to-resign/) > > Is it possible that the news media outlets are so quick to report something/anything concerning this story that they couldn’t be bothered to actually verify the alleged utterances of _anonymous_ sources? Sure. It’s possible. Let’s see how things play out over the next few days. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2017, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226/240 "2017-05-11T21:46:27Z")
General question that I haven’t seen addressed yet in this thread… What are the odds that Comey told Trump that he isn’t part of the ongoing investigation into Russian ties/influences on the administration. Given Trump’s difficulty with the truth, I’m inclined to think this is just another lie, but if it is, it seems a pretty bold and foolish one. Even for Trump. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-fired-who-is-covering-who/786226.md?page=13)