# Comey Memo: Trump Told Him - Shut Down Flynn Probe **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 16, 2017, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792 "2017-05-16T21:40:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/201 "2017-06-05T11:15:49Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > I’m sure the Republicans have been working overtime digging into Comey’s past. If he ever cheated playing marbles at recess, they’re going to find it. Maybe one of them will ask him what time it is, and if he says 1:30, they’ll ask him again a half hour later and he’ll say 2:00. Then they’ll say “what is it, first you said 1:30 and now you say 2:00?” Then the Fox channel will have a crawl at the bottom, continuing for the next week “COMEY CAUGHT IN LIE IN TESTIMONY”. They won’t need to do any of that. I think Senator Lindsey Graham already tipped his hand when he commented about Comey’s handling of the fake Russian emails. I think Comey has been a basically honest broker in trying to work through the GOP’s attempts to politicize the military and DoJ but he did commit some unforced errors in handling these situations, which has upset both parties. The GOP is going to put the focus on Comey’s errors and try to drift away from the probe and his firing itself. I suspect that those who are hoping for Trump’s Waterloo are going to walk away feeling disappointed. The same number of people will want Trump impeached and the same number of people will defend him, no matter what is said on Thursday. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/202 "2017-06-05T13:41:14Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Long standing since the founding of the republic for the DOJ and since the founding of the FBI for that institution. The AG is the only cabinet member who isn’t there to further the president’s agenda. Should the FBI decide that the DC pizza thing had any credibility, then they would investigate it and if Obama had said lay off they’d be within their rights to tell him to go suck eggs. And the president could then fire every single one of them. There might be political consequences of doing so, but that’s true of everything the president does. However, I doubt he’d find any resistance to quashing the Pizza Parlor Investigation since that investigation, itself, would have been a blatant politicization of the FBI’s authority. Your vision allows unchecked corruption to exist in the FBI. Sort of like the good old days of J Edgar himself. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/203 "2017-06-05T14:38:13Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Long standing protocol? It is to laugh. So tell me, **Bob** , suppose the FBI decided to open an investigation into the Clinton Pedophile Ring operated out of the DC Pizza joint. Could the president shut that down? If a hypothetical president Clinton shut that down, it would be absolutely wrong and make me believe that there is actually something to it. No reason to shut down a probe into something that you didn’t do, and if the FBI saw fit to investigate and Clinton shut it down, it would be obstruction of justice. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/204 "2017-06-05T17:05:10Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > If a hypothetical president Clinton shut that down, it would be absolutely wrong and make me believe that there is actually something to it. No reason to shut down a probe into something that you didn’t do, and if the FBI saw fit to investigate and Clinton shut it down, it would be obstruction of justice. We could argue about that, but since that is not what **Bob** was talking about, it would be pointless. **Bob** said “Sitting in the Oval Office does not entitle one to shut down any investigation”, emphasis added. I agree that the president trying to interfere with an investigation concerning him/her is fraught with problems. And I agree that, in general, the prez should not inject himself into an FBI investigation. I just don’t agree that the prez can never do so, nor do I agree that he doesn’t have the authority to do so. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/205 "2017-06-05T17:42:32Z")
In which case, your argument is little more than a legal technicality that carefully ignores whether an action is worthy or valid? ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/206 "2017-06-05T17:48:13Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > Originally Posted by drad dog View Post > I’m pretty sure that after 2 it’s already obstruction of justice. > > CarnalK: > Well, you’re wrong. Trump is in charge of the FBI and he can legally ask for something to be shut down. > > What are you talking about? He could not just ask. It must be for cause. O/W it’s obstruction. But in this case the cause is not in dispute. The Orange James Bond already blabbed it out. Therefore after step 2, go to special prosecutor. Ibid ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/207 "2017-06-05T18:11:46Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > We could argue about that, but since that is not what **Bob** was talking about, it would be pointless. **Bob** said “Sitting in the Oval Office does not entitle one to shut down any investigation”, emphasis added. I agree that the president trying to interfere with an investigation concerning him/her is fraught with problems. And I agree that, in general, the prez should not inject himself into an FBI investigation. I just don’t agree that the prez can never do so, nor do I agree that he doesn’t have the authority to do so. Prior public statements may preclude the president from doing so at will under the law. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/208 "2017-06-05T20:10:46Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > We could argue about that, but since that is not what **Bob** was talking about, it would be pointless. **Bob** said “Sitting in the Oval Office does not entitle one to shut down any investigation”, emphasis added. I agree that the president trying to interfere with an investigation concerning him/her is fraught with problems. And I agree that, in general, the prez should not inject himself into an FBI investigation. I just don’t agree that the prez can never do so, nor do I agree that he doesn’t have the authority to do so. I would say sitting in the oval office does not entitle one to shut down any investigation that includes one’s self in any way. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/209 "2017-06-05T20:32:21Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > I would say sitting in the oval office does not entitle one to shut down any investigation that includes one’s self in any way. The Constitution is silent on the issue, which is unsurprising given that the Department of Justice did not exist until 1870 and no federal agency was authorized to perform formal investigations until the establishment of the National Bureau of Criminal Identification in 1897. (The US Marshals Service has existed since 1789 but it was primarily an enforcement agency directed by the federal courts and involved in fugitive recovery in US territories and other extra-state level operations, and more recently, asset forfeiture and witness protection.) The President may very well be legally able to suspect or halt investigations by executive order, and Congress would have to resort to passing a law authorizing the application of an independent counsel or prosecutor to perform investigation under Congressional oversight, which is an “implied” power of the legislative branch. A legal challenge against an arbitrary dismissal or order to halt an investigation, on the other hand, would throw the decision to the judiciary, which has broad powers in investigating and rendering decisions regarding executive authority. Donald Trump, of course, feels that he is entitled to do whatever he wishes regardless of what the Constitution (which he most certainly has not read) directs or implies, and would be pleased to ignore the “so-called” judiciary and Congressional investigators entirely, and may do so until someone holds his feet to the fire. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/210 "2017-06-05T21:52:13Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > I would say sitting in the oval office does not entitle one to shut down any investigation that includes one’s self in any way. What do you mean by “entitle”? Are you saying he should’t or that the can’t, legally? If the latter, I’ll need to see a cite for that. ---
**Author:** ![Tzigone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Tzigone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzigone)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/211 "2017-06-05T22:06:39Z")
So, I’m reading that ABC, NBC, CBS and Fox will all have live coverage of Comey’s testimony? When I saw the news of ABC and CBS, I thought maybe it was too much hype, would be boring to a lot of people, and would blow up in their faces (or liberal faces) if nothing so sever that the GOP would be compelled to act came of it. Then saw that NBC and Fox were covering it, too. I was surprised. I do kind of wonder if they know/expect something big might happen, though. Here’s hoping. In other news: [Russian hacking](https://theintercept.com/2017/06/05/top-secret-nsa-report-details-russian-hacking-effort-days-before-2016-election/) - at this point talking about voter rolls rather than votes, I think. Also, the leaker has seemingly already been [arrested](http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/336432-federal-government-contractor-charged-for-leaking-classified-material). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/212 "2017-06-05T22:10:23Z")
They don’t have to think something big will happen. They just need to think that people will watch. When Michael Jackson died, we had a live feed of his driveway for hours and hours, and nothing happened. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/213 "2017-06-05T22:22:13Z")
> [@ganthet](#): > > Since the exact words used and their context will be extremely important, either Comey’s description of the conversation will come in his opening statement or through a more open-ended question, like - “Please describe to us the conversation you had with the president about the investigation on Day X.” Since there have been only rumors about any such conversation, facts will be need to be established before Comey is asked about conclusions. > > You can bet that some of the conclusion questions following a detailed description of that or any other conversations will be 1) whether Comey has ever experienced or heard about any other similar request to shut down a specific investigation from a president before, 2) his opinion about the propriety of a president making such a request when the investigation is related to the president, 3) how he interpreted that conversation (and Trump’s reaction following any rejection of such a request) as it related to his other conversation with Trump in which Trump allegedly demanded some kind of personal loyalty pledge and Comey only offered a pledge to be truthful, and 4) whether Comey feels like he was abruptly fired because he refused to shut down the FBI investigation and refused to give some kind of loyalty oath to Trump personally and not merely the office of the president. I think you’re right: these may well be questions that will be asked. I would also like to see questions asked Comey about claims that Trump made about him, in the May 11 interview Trump did with NBC’s Lester Holt: > [@](#): > > HOLT: He told you, you weren’t under investigation with… > TRUMP: Yeah, and I… > HOLT: …regard to the Russian investigation. > TRUMP: …I’ve heard that – I’ve heard that from others. I think… > HOLT: Was it in a phone call? Did you meet face to face? > TRUMP: I had a dinner with him. **He wanted to have dinner because he wanted to stay on.** We had a very nice dinner at the White House… > HOLT: He – he asked… > (CROSSTALK) > TRUMP: …very early on. That dinner was arranged. **I think he asked for the dinner. > And he wanted to stay on as the FBI head.** And I said I’ll, you know, consider. We’ll see what happens. [http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2017/05/11/president\_trumps\_full\_interview\_with\_lester\_holt.html](http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2017/05/11/president_trumps_full_interview_with_lester_holt.html) Comey should be asked: “was the President’s claim accurate–\*did \*you request to have dinner with him?” and “was the claim that you stated or otherwise communicated to the President that you ‘wanted to stay on’ as FBI Director, an accurate claim?” Comey’s responses would be of interest to many. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/214 "2017-06-05T23:11:04Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Comey should be asked: “was the President’s claim accurate–\*did \*you request to have dinner with him?” and “was the claim that you stated or otherwise communicated to the President that you ‘wanted to stay on’ as FBI Director, an accurate claim?” > > Comey’s responses would be of interest to many. Trump lies again. Movie at 11. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/215 "2017-06-05T23:20:30Z")
I’m not getting why those are interesting questions. So what if Trump was wrong about that? He can just claim that that was the way he remembered things, and that’s that. I mean, he even qualified one of those claims with “I think…”. “I think he did X” genially means you’re not 100% sure. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/216 "2017-06-05T23:38:28Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > They don’t have to think something big will happen. They just need to think that people will watch. When Michael Jackson died, we had a live feed of his driveway for hours and hours, and nothing happened. All they have to do is get big ratings. That’s the one thing that’ll send Trump off the rails. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/217 "2017-06-05T23:40:49Z")
> [@Fubaya](#): > > All they have to do is get big ratings. That’s the one thing that’ll send Trump off the rails. He gets the BIGGEST ratings. Terrific ratings!!! ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2017, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/218 "2017-06-05T23:43:44Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I’m not getting why those are interesting questions. So what if Trump was wrong about that? He can just claim that that was the way he remembered things, and that’s that. I mean, he even qualified one of those claims with “I think…”. “I think he did X” genially means you’re not 100% sure. The reason to ask them is to put on the record that Trump’s claims about conversations he had with Comey are false and fictional. (Recall that one of the main issues being addressed in the Thursday hearing is the topic of those very conversations: whose recollections are more credible?) Everyone knows that it’s highly unlikely that Comey would have told Trump that he “wanted to stay on” (in Trump’s words)–the FBI Directorship has a ten-year term, which was not nearing its end, and no FBI Director has to ask any President if he can “stay on.” This is even aside from the unlikelihood of someone with Comey’s personality traits asking a President if that President will let him stay on in the directorship. The unlikelihood that Trump’s claims are true have direct relevance to the weight that should be placed on Comey’s own claim (that Trump asked him to minimize or curtail the Russia/Flynn investigation). ---
**Author:** ![ganthet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de0a6/32.png) [@ganthet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ganthet)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/219 "2017-06-06T02:04:44Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Everyone knows that it’s highly unlikely that Comey would have told Trump that he “wanted to stay on” (in Trump’s words)–the FBI Directorship has a ten-year term, which was not nearing its end, and no FBI Director has to ask any President if he can “stay on.” This is even aside from the unlikelihood of someone with Comey’s personality traits asking a President if that President will let him stay on in the directorship. > > The unlikelihood that Trump’s claims are true have direct relevance to the weight that should be placed on Comey’s own claim (that Trump asked him to minimize or curtail the Russia/Flynn investigation). The problem with that is that Trump’s likely ignorance of an FBI director’s term set by federal statute is that his own ignorance and assumption about the situation vis-a-vis Comey’s continued tenure is such that it could be offered as an equally likely explanation for his account besides Trump lying. Comey has certainly made some recent questionable actions and statements in 2016 both for and against Hillary, but his record as a long-standing civil servant and his integrity don’t seem to be much in question. That seems to be one of the many reasons why his testimony is so eagerly awaited - because it will likely be true. Proving Trump to be a liar is not necessary to establish that whatever account Comey gives is trustworthy. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2017, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/220 "2017-06-06T03:10:26Z")
> [@ganthet](#): > > The problem with that is that Trump’s likely ignorance of an FBI director’s term set by federal statute is that his own ignorance and assumption about the situation vis-a-vis Comey’s continued tenure is such that it could be offered as an equally likely explanation for his account besides Trump lying. > > Comey has certainly made some recent questionable actions and statements in 2016 both for and against Hillary, but his record as a long-standing civil servant and his integrity don’t seem to be much in question. That seems to be one of the many reasons why his testimony is so eagerly awaited - because it will likely be true. Proving Trump to be a liar is not necessary to establish that whatever account Comey gives is trustworthy. The problem is, people don’t know what to think. Look, I think Trump’s guilty as hell of obstruction and collusion, but even so, there’s no smoking gun and I doubt that’ll be revealed on Thursday. There will probably be a lot of “I don’t know” and I can’t answer that." Conversely, I expect GOP senators are going to grill Comey – they have to in order to be able to tell Trumpists in their home states that they fought the good fight. The thing I worry about here is, if this hearing turns out to be a nothing burger or an event in which the tables are turned on Comey, then Trump could conceivably win a big-time PR coup. Everyone then walks away and says “What’s the truth? Will we ever know?” As incredible as it seems, a lot of people wonder why they should care about Russia. But this is serious, serious stuff here. When people can break the law and then gaslight the electorate and institutions designed to hold them accountable…that’s a ticket to authoritarian rule. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792.md?page=12)