# Comey Memo: Trump Told Him - Shut Down Flynn Probe **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 16, 2017, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792 "2017-05-16T21:40:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/281 "2017-06-07T13:48:02Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Gallup actually shows a _downward trend_–the chart (showing results from the week after Inauguration Day up until June 5): > > [http://www.gallup.com/poll/201617/gallup-daily-trump-job-approval.aspx](http://www.gallup.com/poll/201617/gallup-daily-trump-job-approval.aspx) > > It’s pretty clear. As you say, after a fall there will be a rise–but the overall trend is downward. (The trends are like a ‘V’ on its side, with point to the left: the arm of “disapprove” moves up while the arm of “approve” moves down.) I think the increasing net disapproval is due to increase in disapproval rates, not a decrease in approval rates. His approval rates first hit 40% in early February, and though they crossed the 40% line plenty of times, they came back to 40% every time. They hit 40% in February, March, April, May, June, and are currently at 38% (and the last change was an increase). If you ignore the huge drop in approval rates from inauguration to early Feb, they’ve been fairly steady at 40%. We have the Comey testimony tomorrow, and that might push him down (though I think it’s more likely Comey won’t say anything devastating, which will actually improve Trump’s approval ratings). ---
**Author:** ![2nd\_Law](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/f475e1/32.png) [@2nd\_Law](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2nd_Law)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/282 "2017-06-07T13:58:27Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > From a criminal law perspective, how Comey felt is relevant. “Nice place you got here; it would be a shame if something happened to it,” can genuinely be a statement of admiration and concern, or a veiled threat. One aspect of determining which it was rests with the listener’s subjective reaction. A threat isn’t a threat unless it’s both objectively reasonable to consider it a threat and it genuinely induces fear on the part of the recipient. > > It’s similar in this instance. Comey’s reaction is relevant in a criminal inquiry concerning obstruction of justice. > > Standard disclaimer: yes, yes, Congress is able to impeach for any reason they please, and is not limited by criminal boundaries. Nonetheless, I have said and continue to aver that as a political reality, not as a legal bar, Congress will not impeach unless there is a clear criminal act in play. I would imagine Trump’s subsequent actions (such as firing Comey) and statements (such as those made to the Russians in the Oval Office) would be relevant as well. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/283 "2017-06-07T18:08:22Z")
> **[os-jcomey-060817.pdf](https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/os-jcomey-060817.pdf)** > > 106.24 KB Comey’s opening statement for tomorrow. Some snippets: “A few moments later, the President said, “I need loyalty, I expect loyalty.” I didn’t move, speak, or change my facial expression in any way during the awkward silence that followed. We simply looked at each other in silence. The conversation then moved on, but he returned to the subject near the end of our dinner.” “He then said, “I need loyalty.” I replied, “You will always get honesty from me.” He paused and then said, “That’s what I want, honest loyalty.” I paused, and then said, “You will get that from me.” As I wrote in the memo I created immediately after the dinner, it is possible we understood the phrase “honest loyalty” differently, but I decided it wouldn’t be productive to push it further. The term – honest loyalty – had helped end a very awkward conversation and my explanations had made clear what he should expect.” "The President then returned to the topic of Mike Flynn, saying, “He is a good guy and has been through a lot.” He repeated that Flynn hadn’t done anything wrong on his calls with the Russians, but had misled the Vice President. He then said, “I hope you can see your way clear to letting this go, to letting Flynn go. He is a good guy. I hope you can let this go.” I replied only that “he is a good guy.” (In fact, I had a positive experience dealing with Mike Flynn when he was a colleague as Director of the Defense Intelligence Agency at the beginning of my term at FBI.) I did not say I would “let this go.” " “I immediately prepared an unclassified memo of the conversation about Flynn and discussed the matter with FBI senior leadership. I had understood the President to be requesting that we drop any investigation of Flynn in connection with false statements about his conversations with the Russian ambassador in December.” "He said he had nothing to do with Russia, had not been involved with hookers in Russia, and had always assumed he was being recorded when in Russia. " ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/284 "2017-06-07T18:28:43Z")
The text is as boring as hell. I hope the questioning adds some sizzle. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/285 "2017-06-07T19:43:36Z")
“Director Comey, this awkward silence you describe… is it fair to say that at least in part, the awkwardness was due to sexual tension between you and the President?” ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/286 "2017-06-07T19:55:33Z")
“Thank you for your question, Senator Franken.” ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/287 "2017-06-07T20:02:40Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > “Thank you for your question, Senator Franken.” No, after his Rick Perry interlude, Al will be avoiding all congressional hearing-related sexual references. I expect it was enough for a lifetime. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/288 "2017-06-07T20:05:42Z")
Confirmation of things we already new, but still big that we’ll get it under oath from the former FBI head. Surprised that Trump wasn’t lying about Comey saying he wasn’t under investigation. Although Comey might have been thinking “the investigation is targeting collusion in the Trump camp, not Trump specifically.” I find it funny that Trump brought up Russia hookers later. Just fixated on that tidbit because it’s colorful or because it’s true? ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/289 "2017-06-07T20:08:36Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Does anyone remember why Bill Clinton was so unpopular about 150 days into his presidency? He even dipped below Trump for a week or so. :eek: > > Cool stuff, btw. The incredibly bitter fight over the 1993 Budget. The June 7 1993 Time cover is, “The Incredible Shrinking President.” That article is behind a paywall, but here’s the Wikipedia article which does a decent job of explaining the battle. It was an incredibly nasty fight inside the Democratic party. > **[Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1993](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnibus_Budget_Reconciliation_Act_of_1993)** > > The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1993 (or OBRA-93) was a federal law that was enacted by the 103rd United States Congress and signed into law by President Bill Clinton on August 10, 1993. It has also been unofficially referred to as the Deficit Reduction Act of 1993. Part XIII of the law is also called the Revenue Reconciliation Act of 1993. > The bill stemmed from a budget proposal made by Clinton in February 1993; he sought a mix of tax increases and spending reductions that would cut th... ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/290 "2017-06-07T20:10:13Z")
I think this is new: _ **"The President went on to say that if there were some “satellite” associates of his who did something wrong, it would be good to find that out, but that he hadn’t done anything wrong and hoped I would find a way to get it out that we weren’t investigating him."** _ Seems like Trump laying the groundwork for a scapegoat. Also, this: _ **""He said he would do that and added, ‘Because I have been very loyal to you, very loyal; we had that thing you know.’ I did not reply or ask him what he meant by ‘that thing.’ I said only that the way to handle it was to have the White House Counsel call the Acting Deputy Attorney General. He said that was what he would do and the call ended."** _ “That thing” likely meaning the Hillary Clinton email thing, indicating that Trump thought Comey owed him. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/291 "2017-06-07T20:15:54Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > I think the increasing net disapproval is due to increase in disapproval rates, not a decrease in approval rates. Which doesn’t invalidate the point that GOP members of congress may be considering the possibility that their re-election chances would be better without Trump than with Trump. Even if a hard core of voters will stick with Trump to the end, it’s the numbers overall in each district or state that will be examined by nervous incumbents. And it’s unlikely that _all_ who voted for Trump can be fairly classified as an unquestioning, fanatical “hard core.” (I’d put that number at closer to 20% than to the 40% you’ve been mentioning.) > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > [https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/os-jcomey-060817.pdf](https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/os-jcomey-060817.pdf) > Comey’s opening statement for tomorrow. > Some snippets: > > “A few moments later, the President said, “I need loyalty, I expect loyalty.” > I didn’t move, speak, or change my facial expression in any way during the > awkward silence that followed. We simply looked at each other in silence. The > conversation then moved on, but he returned to the subject near the end of our > dinner.” > > “He then said, “I need loyalty.” I replied, “You will always get honesty from me.” He paused and then said, “That’s what I want, honest loyalty.” I paused, and then said, “You will get that from me.” As I wrote in the memo I created immediately after the dinner, it is possible we understood the phrase “honest loyalty” differently, but I decided it wouldn’t be productive to push it further. The term – honest loyalty – had helped > end a very awkward conversation and my explanations had made clear what he should expect.” I suspect that Comey is kidding himself, here, with the concept that the interchange ended with Trump realizing that no pledge of personal loyalty had been given. It’s much more likely that Trump took Comey’s failure to rebut Trump’s “honest loyalty” construction as meaning that Comey was indeed kissing the ring. (And Comey is smart enough to know that, by the way, making the bit made red in the excerpt above, more than a little disingenuous.) At any rate: by many accounts it’s highly unusual to have an opening statement released so early. One theory is that it’s intended to blunt any anti-Comey kompromat that had been in the works for release today. If so, the early release of the statement does seem like a pretty savvy tactic. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/292 "2017-06-07T20:17:20Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > “That thing” likely meaning the Hillary Clinton email thing, indicating that Trump thought Comey owed him. Why would Comey owe Trump for that? I read it as Trump thinking that Comey actually had pledged his loyalty. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/293 "2017-06-07T20:19:38Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Why would Comey owe Trump for that? > > I read it as Trump thinking that Comey actually had pledged his loyalty. “Because I have been very loyal to you, very loyal; we had that thing you know.'” Trump is saying that he was loyal to Comey. That has nothing to do with demanding Comey’s presumed loyalty to Trump. I read it as Trump saying that they were linked by the Clinton email scandal, and Trump could have gotten rid of him over it, but didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/294 "2017-06-07T20:30:37Z")
I’m with **Snarky** , especially in the context of that document as a whole. The narrative flows from, “I need loyalty, Comey,” to, “hey, we had that loyalty thing,” in a direct line. It felt like the theme of the statement as a whole to me. Trump kept telling Comey to “get it out there,” that he wasn’t under investigation, and he never did. Remember how many times Trump went out of his way to state that Comey told him directly, three times, that he wasn’t under investigation? That was what was paramount to Trump. He just wanted Comey to say it too. He didn’t. He got fired. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/295 "2017-06-07T21:30:39Z")
I tend to agree with **Snarky Kong**. I read it as ‘that thing’ is referring to Comey’s apparent lack of demurrer to Trump’s ‘honest loyalty’ question. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/296 "2017-06-07T21:33:44Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > “Because I have been very loyal to you, very loyal; we had that thing you know.'” > > Trump is saying that he was loyal to Comey. That has nothing to do with demanding Comey’s presumed loyalty to Trump. > > I read it as Trump saying that they were linked by the Clinton email scandal, and Trump could have gotten rid of him over it, but didn’t. “Because I have been very loyal to you, very loyal; we had that thing you know.” “Our thing” in italian is Cosa Nostra ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/297 "2017-06-07T21:39:05Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Standard disclaimer: yes, yes, Congress is able to impeach for any reason they please, and is not limited by criminal boundaries. Nonetheless, I have said and continue to aver that as a political reality, not as a legal bar, Congress will not impeach unless there is a clear criminal act in play. Certainly not in this House, which would be tasked with bringing charges (the Senate votes on the charges, but has no role in bringing the impeachment in the first place). Barring something more than this, we’re still stuck with Trumpo the Clown for 3 1/2 more years. If it were the other way around, it would be possible; only three Republicans would be necessary to break ranks. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/298 "2017-06-07T22:08:44Z")
Well, not any more! Trump’s personal lawyer has come out with a statement which underlines the obvious truth that Comey’s testimony amounts to a complete vindication and exoneration. So, that’s settled, then. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/299 "2017-06-07T22:19:04Z")
I’d just like to note that, according to Comey’s testimony, Trump lied when he said that he didn’t ask Comey for loyalty. > **[Trump warns his fired FBI director, threatens the media](https://www.foxnews.com/transcript/trump-warns-his-fired-fbi-director-threatens-the-media)** > > The 'Special Report' All-Star panel weighs in "JUDGE JEANINE PIRRO, FOX NEWS: People suggest that the question that apparently the New York Times is selling that you asked Comey whether or not you had his loyalty was possibly inappropriate. Could you see how they could think that? PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: I read that article. I don’t think it’s inappropriate. PIRRO: Did you ask that question? TRUMP: No. No, I didn’t. But I don’t think it would be a bad question to ask. I think loyalty to the country, loyalty to the United States is important. You know, I mean, it depends on how you define loyalty, number one. Number two, I don’t know how that got there because I didn’t ask that question." ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2017, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/300 "2017-06-07T22:32:17Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, not any more! Trump’s personal lawyer has come out with a statement which underlines the obvious truth that Comey’s testimony amounts to a complete vindication and exoneration. So, that’s settled, then. I can see the wheels turning in Trump’s mind, but not even close to firing the ignition of critical thought. “Haha, the Special Counsel for **Investigation** appointed to **investigate** my actions will reveal to the whole world that I am not secretly being investgated! Win!”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792.md?page=16)