# Comey Memo: Trump Told Him - Shut Down Flynn Probe **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 16, 2017, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792 "2017-05-16T21:40:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 27
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/521 "2017-06-08T19:28:28Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > So what are you suggesting here? > > That Trump acted appropriately in these meetings and Comey knew this, as evident by him continuing talks with him? > > That Trump acted _in_appropriately in these meetings and Comey knew this, but rather than telling him to stop, Comey made effort to take notes that could be later used against him? I think Comey thought that Trump was acting inappropriately and compromising the integrity of the FBI. But instead of asserting his independence at the time he chose to be compromised and then strike back in revenge. He has put the FBI in an extraordinarily compromising position in two ways. One, by meeting with Trump one on one he did expose himself to being influenced. Second, by his actions after being fired he has clearly chosen sides against Trump. Instead of appearing independent, he’s now one of Trump’s harshest critics. As for Trump, I wouldn’t vote for the guy and don’t think he’s a good president. I just don’t see anything that inappropriate or illegal going on. > [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > If you’re suggesting the latter happened, this is a poor defense for Trump. Comey had no obligation to police the President’s behavior. It is Trump’s responsibility to know how to conduct himself and/or consult with advisors. It’s not a defense of Trump but an indictment of Comey. Both of them look like clowns. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/522 "2017-06-08T19:29:13Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Trump’s [lawyer](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2017/live-updates/trump-white-house/james-comey-testimony-what-we-learn/trump-lawyer-president-never-told-comey-i-need-loyalty-i-expect-loyalty/?utm_term=.3ffc9a2bd074) is calling Comey a liar. Comey testified under oath about the loyalty pledge, and I would encourage Trump to testify under oath as well. “I’m his mouthpiece, and I can say anything at all with impunity, so here are the things my client would like me to say on his behalf, so that he is not directly responsible and can possibly plausibly deny that I am saying things at his direction:” ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/523 "2017-06-08T19:32:23Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Trump’s achilles heel is his thin skin and volatile temper. Also the fact that he’s completely clueless about such minor matters as how the government works & all areas of public policy. And since he’s unwilling to consistently yield to the advice of those who do, he’s doomed to keep creating serious dysfunction and undermining his government, not to mention making a complete fool of himself. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/524 "2017-06-08T19:37:09Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Keeping Trump angry and distracted has been the Left’s strategy since the election. Trump’s achilles heel is his thin skin and volatile temper. > > The left will continue to play him like violin until after the 2018 election. He’ll be impeached if they win back the house. The trial will be in the Senate. > > It’s really pretty sad that no one gives a crap about getting any real legislation passed. > > It’s only a matter of time before Pence takes over. Are you suggesting that Trump’s inability to effectively govern, even though Republicans have Congress, the Senate and the Presidency, is because the Democrats are somehow causing him to be a twit? Is it your further implication that he will be impeached for no real cause simply because Democrats want him out of power? ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/525 "2017-06-08T19:45:14Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > No, I don’t think the president can obstruct an investigation into criminal wrongdoing by his own friends and campaign workers. Particularly by firing the person who is leading the investigation. This is even more true if the investigation is about a foreign hostile power interfering with the election process. > > But I guess “it was not technically illegal if you look at it this special way” is pretty much all the Republicans have left now. Nixon fired Archibald Cox, the special investigator for Watergate. He didn’t get away with it politically, but it was perfectly legal. So yes, the president can fire the person who is leading the investigation into criminal wrongdoing by himself, his friends and/or campaign workers. What happens after that may take any of a large number of different directions, but criminal prosecution for obstruction of justice is unlikely to be one of them. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/526 "2017-06-08T19:46:20Z")
My favorite Comey quote so far: When asked about Trump’s vague threat about taped conversations, Comey said “Lordy, I hope there are tapes!” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/527 "2017-06-08T19:52:39Z")
> [@treis](#): > > I think Comey thought that Trump was acting inappropriately and compromising the integrity of the FBI. But instead of asserting his independence at the time he chose to be compromised and then strike back in revenge. This is…catch 20/20 logic. If Comey thought Trump was trying to be unlawfully coercive, him pushing back against the President would have given Trump even more reason to see Comey as hostile and disloyal. In other words, increasing the odds of Trump firing him and/or attacking the investigation. This is what Comey was afraid of. So he chose not to push back, _because he valued the investigation_. Instead, he played it cool and took notes. But, lo and behold, he was fired anyway, because whatever spine he showed was still too much for Trump. Just as he was worried about all along. So he released his memo to show that he had good reason to be worried. If he’d “asserted his independence” like you’re saying he should’ve, how do you think Trump would’ve reacted? Please don’t respond with anything naïve, please. > [@](#): > > He has put the FBI in an extraordinarily compromising position in two ways. One, by meeting with Trump one on one he did expose himself to being influenced. Him refusing to meet with Trump would have influenced the investigation by increasing the odds of his termination. Comey was stuck between a rock and a hard place. > [@](#): > > Second, by his actions after being fired he has clearly chosen sides against Trump. Instead of appearing independent, he’s now one of Trump’s harshest critics. Which is why Trump made a strategic mistake in firing him, but this has nothing to do with Comey doing anything wrong. If Trump fired him because Comey wasn’t “loyal” enough to him, _he’s perfectly justified in being Trump’s harshest critic_. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/528 "2017-06-08T19:53:35Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > Are you suggesting that Trump’s inability to effectively govern, even though Republicans have Congress, the Senate and the Presidency, is because the Democrats are somehow causing him to be a twit? Is it your further implication that he will be impeached for no real cause simply because Democrats want him out of power? Everything that is currently vexing Trump is completely within his own power to resolve, but he has consistently chosen to make all those problems worse. Russia? He could have worked with Congress to create an independent commission to investigate the election meddling, but he’s chosen instead to sandbag everything and fire the FBI Director. Flynn? He shouldn’t have hired him in the first place, considering how he left government in disgrace, but then he made things worse by trying to stop an investigation into him. Ethics and conflict of interest? He decided not to take the obvious and clear steps recommended by ethics professionals. Over and over again, on every single issue that is bogging him down, Trump has consistently chosen the path that makes everything worse for him. Because he has no idea what he’s doing. You can’t blame the opposition party for any of that. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/529 "2017-06-08T19:53:58Z")
The Left is manipulating Trump. His anger and lack of experience is making him do dumb stuff. He’s not listening to his advisers. It’s a recipe for failure. He reminds me a lot of Andrew Johnson. A short tempered man that wasn’t meant for office. He was almost impeached for trying to fire Secretary of War Edwin M. Stanton, a violation of the 1867 Tenure of Office Act. A law eventually repealed in 1887. > **[Tenure of Office Act (1867)](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenure_of_Office_Act_(1867))** > > The Tenure of Office Act was a United States federal law, in force from 1867 to 1887, that was intended to restrict the power of the president to remove certain office-holders without the approval of the U.S. Senate. The law was enacted March 2, 1867, over the veto of President Andrew Johnson. It purported to deny the president the power to remove any executive officer who had been appointed by the president with the advice and consent of the Senate, unless the Senate approved the removal durin... ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/530 "2017-06-08T20:00:00Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > It’s really pretty sad that no one gives a crap about getting any real legislation passed. Have you looked at any of the legislation so far offered? ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/531 "2017-06-08T20:02:13Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > The Left is manipulating Trump. His anger and lack of experience is making him do dumb stuff. He’s not listening to his advisers. > > He reminds me a lot of Andrew Johnson. He was almost impeached for trying to fire Secretary of War Edwin M. Stanton, a violation of the 1867 Tenure of Office Act. A law eventually repealed in 1887. > > [Tenure of Office Act (1867) - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenure_of_Office_Act_(1867)) So you are saying that Trump is being manipulated into a position where he can be impeached. That is interesting. I don’t agree with your assessment. I think Trump is directly responsible for everything that is happening, including the inability of his team to govern effectively. Nitpick: Johnson was impeached. ---
**Author:** ![ganthet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de0a6/32.png) [@ganthet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ganthet)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/532 "2017-06-08T20:14:22Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > The Left is manipulating Trump. His anger and lack of experience is making him do dumb stuff. He’s not listening to his advisers. It’s a recipe for failure. What tripe. Donald is a big boy who ran precisely on his business leadership skills and experience and used his lack of government experience as a selling point. He and he alone is responsible for his words, his actions, and his ignorant narcissism that are leading him to conduct himself in a reckless, deeply stupid manner. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/533 "2017-06-08T20:14:30Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > My favorite Comey quote so far: When asked about Trump’s vague threat about taped conversations, Comey said “Lordy, I hope there are tapes!” > 😃 Yeah, the obvious response to Trump’s lawyer insisting that Comey is lying about the conversation is “Well, hand over the tapes” In fact, if Trump doesn’t make tapes available, he can’t really use that leverage ever again since the first time he DOES produce tapes for anything, the obvious question will be “So where’s the Comey tapes” and no one will believe him when he claims that they don’t exist. Well, _some people_ will but those people will believe him if he says he rode a dinosaur to work. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/534 "2017-06-08T20:18:09Z")
Is there anything that isn’t the _Left’s_ fault? Trump being a completely incompetent, ignorant, short-tempered, inarticulate, neophyte, moron doesn’t move the needle; it’s the \*Left \*pointing it out that tips the scales. Genius. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/535 "2017-06-08T20:18:14Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Yeah, the obvious response to Trump’s lawyer insisting that Comey is lying about the conversation is “Well, hand over the tapes” > > In fact, if Trump doesn’t make tapes available, he can’t really use that leverage ever again since the first time he DOES produce tapes for anything, the obvious question will be “So where’s the Comey tapes” and no one will believe him when he claims that they don’t exist. Well, _some people_ will but those people will believe him if he says **he rode a dinosaur to work.** How do you get a dinosaur into the White House? ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/536 "2017-06-08T20:19:47Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Everything that is currently vexing Trump is completely within his own power to resolve, but he has consistently chosen to make all those problems worse. > > Russia? He could have worked with Congress to create an independent commission to investigate the election meddling, but he’s chosen instead to sandbag everything and fire the FBI Director. > > Flynn? He shouldn’t have hired him in the first place, considering how he left government in disgrace, but then he made things worse by trying to stop an investigation into him. > > Ethics and conflict of interest? He decided not to take the obvious and clear steps recommended by ethics professionals. > > Over and over again, on every single issue that is bogging him down, Trump has consistently chosen the path that makes everything worse for him. Because he has no idea what he’s doing. You can’t blame the opposition party for any of that. I agree that Trump has pretty consistently chosen the worst possible approach to all these matters, but saying they are “completely within his own power to resolve” is a huge overstatement. An independent commission would be hanging over his government for years. And his ethics issues are probably insoluble - no one has ever been president with such a far flung business empire, and there were really no good solutions for that. Again, what Trump has done is mostly just pouring more gasoline on the fire, especially as regards to Russia. But he wasn’t going to escape it anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/537 "2017-06-08T20:22:36Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > How do you get a dinosaur into the White House? Are you kidding? I think he also gave it security clearance. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/538 "2017-06-08T20:25:37Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Are you kidding? I think he also gave it security clearance. If the President rides it, it isn’t illegal. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/539 "2017-06-08T20:26:03Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > …And his ethics issues are probably insoluble - no one has ever been president with such a far flung business empire, and there were really no good solutions for that. Yes, and it’s obvious: full financial disclosure. If you’re unwilling to do so, then the job isn’t for you. Having an unvetted president mired in ethical conflicts was entirely predictable. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2017, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792/540 "2017-06-08T20:26:46Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > This is…catch 20/20 logic Not really. It’s just a matter of picking your poison. Comey had the choice between job security and the FBI’s reputation. He chose job security. > [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > Him refusing to meet with Trump would have influenced the investigation by increasing the odds of his termination. Comey was stuck between a rock and a hard place. No doubt he was in a difficult position but, like the Clinton investigation, he totally blew it and chose the worst possible path. > [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > Which is why Trump made a strategic mistake in firing him, but this has nothing to do with Comey doing anything wrong. If Trump fired him because Comey wasn’t “loyal” enough to him, _he’s perfectly justified in being Trump’s harshest critic_. It’s a mistake because it feeds into Trump’s story of the Deep State/Washington/Bureaucrats working against him. Comey, as FBI director, was actively plotting against Trump. Perhaps he had good reason to. But it’s a bombshell. An FBI director creating documents with, apparently, the intention of leaking them if he were fired. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792.md?page=26) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comey-memo-trump-told-him-shut-down-flynn-probe/786792.md?page=28)