# Comic books: What are the worst reasons for the supervillain to hate the superhero? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 22, 2005, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213 "2005-11-22T05:38:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![chrisk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@chrisk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chrisk)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/21 "2005-11-22T15:36:35Z")
> [@William V.](#): > > Not from a comic book (that I know of), but I thought that Picard’s clone in “Star Trek Nemesis” had a ridiculous vendetta. He’s cloned by the Romulans for a harebrained scheme to replace Starfleet’s top officers with doppelgangers, then packed off to a hellish Reman mine when the plan is shelved. When he takes power, he swears that he will destroy… Earth. > > Jeez, what did the good people of Earth ever do to him? Wouldn’t he be more likely to be pissed off at the Romulans for consigning him to the mines? I’d say it isn’t so much ridiculous as irrational. He _does_ take some payback on Romulans, especially ones who are in control of the government, like the ones who sent him to the mines. (Not sure if it’s established whether any of them are the same, or if he’s just attacking whoever happens to be in power because the romulans who used to be in power wronged him.) Oh - and I know that wiping out the romulan power structure was necessary before taking over, but it sure seemed like he enjoyed it to me. 😃 As far as the mission to destroy Earth, I always thought that was just because he’s subconsciously accepted some of the value judgements of those he hates. To them, as a human child, he was worse than worthless. Thus, to ‘prove himself’ (who he’s proving himself to doesn’t really matter any more at this point,) he has to wipe out the seat of the rest of humanity. As I said, irrational, but no more ridiculous than some of the irrational things that real people do. To me. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/22 "2005-11-22T15:39:42Z")
Agent Foxtrot: > [@](#): > > Mississippienne countered that Dr. Doom hates Rex Reed because Dr. Doom was building a machine to speak to his dead mother, and Rex told him he had it calibrated wrong (Dr. Doom wouldn’t listen). Rex was right…the machine went kaput and somehow Dr. Doom blames him for this. Mississippienne completely misunderstands Doom. The key to Doom - very powerfully driven home by Mark Waid during the “Unthinkable” story in the FF comic two years ago - is that he has a tremendous ego, and does not believe himself capable of error. When his machine blew up in his face, he accused Reed Richards of deliberately sabotaging it because he was (shades of Luthor-Superman) jealous of his genius…because no way could _Doom_ have made the mistake. Tengu: > [@](#): > > The Legion had been trying to evaccuate the planet, but the LSA were kids, and so they didn’t realise that, and were manipulated by the Dark Man into believing the Legion had been responsible for the destruction of Dryad. > > Blok eventually realised they weren’t behind it, and joined, whereas the rest…continued to hate the Legion. The Super-Assassins were brainwashed, not merely manipulated. Blok’s brainwashing didn’t take as well because he was a silicon-based creature, so his brain works differently from the human Super-Assassins’. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/23 "2005-11-22T15:46:29Z")
Not a comic book _per se_ but I loved how in the movie **Sky High** , a supervillian hated the Hero because in high school he lost the lead role in _Oklahoma_ to him. ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/24 "2005-11-22T17:16:53Z")
> [@William V.](#): > > Not from a comic book (that I know of), but I thought that Picard’s clone in “Star Trek Nemesis” had a ridiculous vendetta. He’s cloned by the Romulans for a harebrained scheme to replace Starfleet’s top officers with doppelgangers, then packed off to a hellish Reman mine when the plan is shelved. When he takes power, he swears that he will destroy… Earth. > > Jeez, what did the good people of Earth ever do to him? Wouldn’t he be more likely to be pissed off at the Romulans for consigning him to the mines? Obviously he wants to get revenge on Picard, because he thinks it’s Picard’s fault that he lost his hair. ---
**Author:** ![Mississippienne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@Mississippienne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mississippienne)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/25 "2005-11-22T17:31:22Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Mississippienne completely misunderstands Doom. The key to Doom - very powerfully driven home by Mark Waid during the “Unthinkable” story in the FF comic two years ago - is that he has a tremendous ego, and does not believe himself capable of error. When his machine blew up in his face, he accused Reed Richards of deliberately sabotaging it because he was (shades of Luthor-Superman) jealous of his genius…because no way could _Doom_ have made the mistake. No, that’s not so. I completely understand the psychological reasoning behind Doom’s resentment of Richards. The fact that it’s an _irrational_ reason is why Doom is the villain – rationally, he should be able to accept that he was wrong and Richards was right, and put the whole mess behind him. But his ego won’t allow him to accept his mistake, thusly he transfers his anger to Richards. So he becomes the meglomaniacal despot of a small Eastern European nation, and spends a lot of time designing robots and talking to himself in third person. Happens all the time. On a lighter note, only in comic books can your college roomie be designing a machine to talk to his dead mom, and not only do you _not_ think this is weird or that he needs counseling or anything, but you examine the machine and discover that its calibration is off for transdimensional communication. Because that’s _so_ something every freshman should know about. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/26 "2005-11-22T17:48:17Z")
Then perhaps Agent Foxtrot misrepresented your argument. The fact that Doom genuinely thought Reed sabotaged the machine makes the hatred less irrational than simple psychological anger-transference. ---
**Author:** ![Menocchio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Menocchio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Menocchio)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/27 "2005-11-22T17:48:24Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Bane, hands-down. > > The guy was born and raised in a Central American prison for some crime that his father had done. Then, for some odd reason, he started having nightmares about bats…then, some guy from Gotham gets imprisoned there and mentions Batman, so suddenly Bane realizes that his purpose in life is to destroy Batman??? > > He never met Batman. Batman never did anything to him. But somehow, this childhood nightmare became a full-blown vendetta against Batman! > > Some of the others are petty or trifling, but this one is absurd. I heard that the original plan was to make Bane the bastard son of Thomas Wayne (Bruce’s dad), and Bane would be motivated by jealousy and revenge (see Edmund in King Lear). The editors decided that there was no real point in ruining the reputation of a character who died in the backstory, so they ditched it. Unfortunately, they didn’t really replace it with anything. In Birthright, Luthor is turned against Superman when Superman snubs him at a photo op. Now _that’s_ petty. (okay, it’s more like Luthor had spent his entire life looking for an equal, and when he found one in Superman, Superman immediately humiliated him in public) ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/28 "2005-11-22T17:49:32Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > “Lord DOOM will have you know that despite his so-called ‘cinematographic failings’ he was plucky, clever, and had _heart!_” “In fact, he has several. They are the hearts of all those who have opposed DOOM! He keeps them in jars in his study.” ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/29 "2005-11-22T18:42:34Z")
[QUOTE=Menocchio] I heard that the original plan was to make Bane the bastard son of Thomas Wayne (Bruce’s dad), and Bane would be motivated by jealousy and revenge (see Edmund in King Lear). The editors decided that there was no real point in ruining the reputation of a character who died in the backstory, so they ditched it. Unfortunately, they didn’t really replace it with anything. QUOTE] I’m glad they ditched that aspect of it. Not only because it’s out of character for what we know of Thomas Wayne (not that such an argument stopped them from throwing a ridiculous plot bomb at Dr. Leslie Thomkins), but because if true, Bane’s name would be Bane Wayne. Boooooooooo. ---
**Author:** ![cbawlmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cbawlmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cbawlmer)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/30 "2005-11-22T18:46:02Z")
Oops, botched the coding. Sorry about that. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/31 "2005-11-22T19:29:40Z")
There was one obsessed rival inventor, forget his name, who attacked Iron Man just to prove his own powered-battlesuit technology was superior to Tony Stark’s. (This was when Stark was drinking heavily, so he didn’t put up a very good fight.) ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/32 "2005-11-22T19:35:55Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > There was one obsessed rival inventor, forget his name, who attacked Iron Man just to prove his own powered-battlesuit technology was superior to Tony Stark’s. (This was when Stark was drinking heavily, so he didn’t put up a very good fight.) Last name was Stane. And it went deeper than simply wanting to out-armor Stark. Stane was obsessed with many aspects of Stark’s life, including his greater business success and his better looks. Stane orchestrated Stark’s business downfall in some back-handed way and, when Stark partnered with a small company and began a comeback, Stane blew it up and killed a bunch of people. ---
**Author:** ![Promethea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Promethea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Promethea)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/33 "2005-11-22T19:46:29Z")
Elektra and her beef with Matt Murdock - why exactly was she so mad at him? As far as I could work out from Miller’s original run on Daredevil, this is never adequately explained. I presume she sort of blames him for her father’s death, but lt also implies that she blames Cruel Fate for this and uses it as her excuse to become an amoral assasin. Anyone? Oh, and can someone refresh my memory as to just why Cain Marko (Juggernaut) hates Professor X again? Isn’t something like he was jealous of him as a child or something equally minoe? I forget. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/34 "2005-11-22T19:58:51Z")
> [@Der Trihs](#): > > There was a recurring minor Avengers villian, I don’t remember his name, who won the lottery and bought a bunch of third rate supervillian gadgetry and repeatedly attacked the Avengers in order to become famous. > > Two incidents I recall : He attacks while Wasp is having a large party of superheroines over ( she wanted more female Avengers ); amusingly, they beat him almost without interrupting their conversation beyond comments like “Who is he?” and “Oh, one of _those_”. In the second, he tried to booby trap them when they appeared on the _David Letterman Show_; they broke the traps and Letterman beat him unconscious. …it was the **Mechano-Marauder** [http://www.geocities.com/marvel\_oops/mechano/mechano.html](http://www.geocities.com/marvel_oops/mechano/mechano.html) [http://www.geocities.com/utherworld/comixpix/z1avengl.html](http://www.geocities.com/utherworld/comixpix/z1avengl.html) ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/35 "2005-11-22T20:10:50Z")
> [@Promethea](#): > > Oh, and can someone refresh my memory as to just why Cain Marko (Juggernaut) hates Professor X again? Isn’t something like he was jealous of him as a child or something equally minoe? I forget. They’re stepbrothers, and as a kid, Marco’s dad, Kurt Marko, favored Professor X over him (because Kurt Marco blamed himself for causing Professor X’s father’s death). In fact, during a fire at his lab, Kurt saved Xavier before saving Marko. So, he resents him. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/36 "2005-11-22T20:34:26Z")
> [@Captain Amazing](#): > > They’re stepbrothers, and as a kid, Marco’s dad, Kurt Marko, favored Professor X over him (because Kurt Marco blamed himself for causing Professor X’s father’s death). In fact, during a fire at his lab, Kurt saved Xavier before saving Marko. So, he resents him. I seem to recall there being an incident where the elder Marko was physically abusing the younger, and a young Charles “overheard” it telepathically. That may be from an out-of-continuity source though. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/37 "2005-11-22T21:07:12Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > The Super-Assassins were brainwashed, not merely manipulated. Oops, yes, so they were. My bad. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2005, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/38 "2005-11-22T22:57:36Z")
The **real** reason Luthor has always hated Superman is because they are the incarnations of the eternal emnity between Brains and Jocks. Luthor is the straight-A honor student, and Superman is the captain of the football team. Supes gets all the accolades while none of the girls will go with Luthor to the prom. ---
**Author:** ![Mississippienne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@Mississippienne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mississippienne)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/39 "2005-11-23T03:44:45Z")
Other villain motivations… _Avengers_ baddy the Living Laser took up supervillainy after becoming obsessed with the wasp, and attacked her teammates in an unsuccessful attempt to impress her. Maybe he should have tried shooting Regan instead. Baron Heinrich Zemo, besides being a Nazi nogoodnik, also ran afoul of Captain America and was doused with some of his own Adhesive X, permanently afixing his purple mask to his face. Not one to let this get him down, he swore undying vengeance on Cap and any heroes associated with him. The Jester, a failed actor, went on to torment poor Daredevil with his hack villainy instead of his hack acting. ---
**Author:** ![bmoak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@bmoak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bmoak)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2005, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213/40 "2005-11-23T03:48:23Z")
> [@Tengu](#): > > Third for Luthor and the hair thing. > > The Legion of Superheroes had several enemies that hated them because they wouldn’t let them join - some examples: Jungle King, Spidergirl (who did, eventually join), Ronn-Kar & Radiation Roy. (The open auditions were a real bad idea - they rejected a lot of useful members, or crazy people who’d hate them for it.) The REAL bad idea of the open auditions wasn’t giving a bunch of unstable superpowered people a reason to bear a grudge against the Legion (that was just a neat side-effect). It was allowing anyone in a costume and powers to join up, no questions asked. How many times was the Legion infiltrated by new members operating under false pretenses? Nemesis Kid, Dynamo Boy, Molecule Master, plus probably another 3 or 4 I’m forgetting. Don’t forget the Legion of Super-Rejects! These were applicants rejected because they came from the same homeworld as other Legion members and violated the “no duplication of powers” bylaw, even though a lot of them were more powerful than their Legion counterparts. A lot of them (Micro Lad, Esper Lass, Magno Lad) ended up in the new, improved Legion of Super-Villains, along with the Super-Assassins, and the original rejects that were part of the old LSV. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/comic-books-what-are-the-worst-reasons-for-the-supervillain-to-hate-the-superhero/332213.md?page=3)