# Commiserate: Republicans Against Bush **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 17, 2008, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856 "2008-01-17T13:58:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/21 "2008-01-17T19:43:49Z")
[QUOTE=Ludovic] He went simultaneously too far for those who would go out of their way to criticize his politics and his strategy, (both of which I’m not the biggest fan of nor the biggest detractor of), and not far enough to get things accomplished (since the Serbian intervention was about 5 years too late, and a couple missiles won’t bring people to the negotiation table or kill targetted people on the ground as hundreds of years of history should tell us). But screwing up small is better than screwing up big. Of course, up until the present administration Johnson and Kennedy made more of a weighted impact in combined military screwups than every other postwar administration put together. [/QUOTE] I am one of those semi-isolationist (in terms of military action) Republicans. Once upon a time my party believed in being strong, but not sticking our nose everywhere. We justified our military based on the threat of the commies. I was against the first Gulf War, the Serbian fiasco, and the invasion of Iraq. The only military action in recent years that I supported from a philosophical perspective was taking down the Taliban. They were the accomplices of folks that attacked us, so I had no problem removing them from office. If I thought that the Democrats REALLY wanted to tone down our military actions, I would support them. Unfortunately, I hear too much “Iraq is bad, we should REALLY be in Darfur!” Again - there appears to be no good choice on that subject. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/22 "2008-01-17T19:56:10Z")
[QUOTE=Algher] If I thought that the Democrats REALLY wanted to tone down our military actions, I would support them. Unfortunately, I hear too much “Iraq is bad, we should REALLY be in Darfur!” Again - **there appears to be no good choice on that subject**. [/QUOTE] Although I would be one of those people (though not Democrat,) I agree with the bolded quote, especially from your perspective, unless you also want to get rid of the Fed 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/23 "2008-01-17T20:08:14Z")
[QUOTE=Ludovic] Although I would be one of those people (though not Democrat,) I agree with the bolded quote, especially from your perspective, unless you also want to get rid of the Fed 🙂 [/QUOTE] Nah, the Fed is a necessary evil. I have been happy with Greenspan and Ben. I have been even happier with the returns on my gold investment! That is part of the problem that the semi-libertarian Republicans face - we get lumped in with some real loonies at times. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/24 "2008-01-17T20:30:16Z")
[QUOTE=galvatron] Massachusetts Republican checking in. Have been very disappointed with George, but remember what the alternative was - John Kerry. [/QUOTE] You know, you guys had more choices than that. You _could_ have nominated someone who wasn’t a total asshat. ---
**Author:** ![galvatron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f1d935/32.png) [@galvatron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galvatron)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/25 "2008-01-17T20:47:30Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] You know, you guys had more choices than that. You _could_ have nominated someone who wasn’t a total asshat. [/QUOTE] I am starting to wonder if only asshats want to be politicians ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/26 "2008-01-17T20:51:52Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] You know, you guys had more choices than that. You _could_ have nominated someone who wasn’t a total asshat. [/QUOTE] During Bush v Kerry I had a sign with both of their bumper stickers and comment, “Is this the best our nation can offer?” ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/27 "2008-01-17T20:56:01Z")
What’s with the Kerry hate? He isn’t a good campaigner, but he seemed like a pretty decent Senator. I admit to (still) being confused about the logic behind his two votes on authorizing force against Iraq (no to #1 under GHWB, yes to #2 under GWB), but other than that, he’s a pretty mainstream Democrat. ---
**Author:** ![galvatron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f1d935/32.png) [@galvatron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galvatron)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/28 "2008-01-17T21:04:44Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] What’s with the Kerry hate? He isn’t a good campaigner, but he seemed like a pretty decent Senator. I admit to (still) being confused about the logic behind his two votes on authorizing force against Iraq (no to #1 under GHWB, yes to #2 under GWB), but other than that, he’s a pretty mainstream Democrat. [/QUOTE] He doesn’t stand for anything except getting his face on TV ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/29 "2008-01-17T21:12:50Z")
[QUOTE=galvatron] He doesn’t stand for anything except getting his face on TV [/QUOTE] Well, there’s probably no point in getting into a debate about that in this thread, butI think that Bush has shown himself to stand for little, if anything, as well. ---
**Author:** ![galvatron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f1d935/32.png) [@galvatron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galvatron)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/30 "2008-01-17T21:29:23Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Well, there’s probably no point in getting into a debate about that in this thread, butI think that Bush has shown himself to stand for little, if anything, as well. [/QUOTE] Agreed. Any other Republicans that are not happy with Bush have any thoughts on the current crop of Candidates? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/31 "2008-01-17T21:29:35Z")
I hasten to remind, sir, that his stance against animal-human hybrid research is unwavering and resolute! ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/32 "2008-01-17T21:33:36Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] What’s with the Kerry hate? He isn’t a good campaigner, but he seemed like a pretty decent Senator. I admit to (still) being confused about the logic behind his two votes on authorizing force against Iraq (no to #1 under GHWB, yes to #2 under GWB), but other than that, he’s a pretty mainstream Democrat. [/QUOTE] I don’t know what _Kerry’s_ logic was, but ISTM that there’s a natural path to that pair of votes. The January 1991 vote was quite clearly a vote on whether to go to war, right then: we’d already done all the preliminaries. But Bush obfuscated the purpose of the 2002 vote, saying he needed to have the authority to go to war, in order to achieve our goals without war, which he was going to try his damnedest to do. If one believed him (staying out of the argument of whether it was reasonable to believe Bush at the time, which certainly looks different from January 2008 than it did in September and October of 2002), it was reasonable to vote for the 2002 authorization, even though one had voted against the 1991 authorization - if one was for a peaceful resolution to both conflicts. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/33 "2008-01-17T21:36:28Z")
[QUOTE=galvatron] Agreed. Any other Republicans that are not happy with Bush have any thoughts on the current crop of Candidates? [/QUOTE] GROSS OVER SIMPLIFICATION AND GUT REACTION FOLLOWS: McCain - too into Iraq, some questions regarding him and guns, and his finance reform bill was nothing other than an incumbent protection plan. Rudy - Not really a Republican. Tough on crime, et al, but another gun control guy. I don’t think he understands much outside of the big city. Huck - Socialist Bible Thumper. ugh. He is right wing on social issues, and left wing on others - in many ways an opposite of my beliefs. Romney - a little too Ken doll, but of the pack is the one I have the best chance of tolerating. The fact that he has been in business and politics is good. His Massachusetts HC plan was a good compromise method to provide more healthcare to more people. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/34 "2008-01-17T21:37:17Z")
It is too late for me. I will leave the party I always belonged to on February 6th. I will vote McCain in the primary and become unaffiliated the next day. This President and the way most of the candidates are running, has finally driven me from my party. In NJ it takes 50 days to switch parties, so I got fed up, too late for this primary. Fucking stupid state with stupid election rules! I will vote Obama in November is possible. I will settle for HRC. Jim ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/35 "2008-01-17T21:42:20Z")
[QUOTE=RTFirefly] I don’t know what _Kerry’s_ logic was, but ISTM that there’s a natural path to that pair of votes. The January 1991 vote was quite clearly a vote on whether to go to war, right then: we’d already done all the preliminaries. [/quote] Possibly. But a simpler explanation is that the Democratic leadership recommended a no vote for GHWB and a yes vote for GWB, and he was just toeing the party line. > [@](#): > > But Bush obfuscated the purpose of the 2002 vote, saying he needed to have the authority to go to war, in order to achieve our goals without war, which he was going to try his damnedest to do. If one believed him (staying out of the argument of whether it was reasonable to believe Bush at the time, which certainly looks different from January 2008 than it did in September and October of 2002), it was reasonable to vote for the 2002 authorization, even though one had voted against the 1991 authorization - if one was for a peaceful resolution to both conflicts. It’s funny how some people still think that. Others on your side disagree: > [@](#): > > The resolution you voted for, Robert Byrd said was a blank check for George Bush. Ted Kennedy says it was a vote for war. James Carville and Paul Begala said anyone who says that vote wasn’t a vote for war is bunk. [Russert speaking to Hillary](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22634967/page/3/) on Meet the Press last Sunday. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/36 "2008-01-17T21:46:44Z")
[QUOTE=Algher] …Huck - Socialist Bible Thumper. ugh. He is right wing on social issues, and left wing on others - in many ways an opposite of my beliefs. … [/QUOTE] Is it just me or does Huckleberry look a lot like Huey Long with better suits? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/37 "2008-01-17T21:54:09Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Is it just me or does Huckleberry look a lot like Huey Long with better suits? [/QUOTE] Not just you. Especially his message. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/38 "2008-01-17T22:19:56Z")
The denunciation of Huckabee on the right confuses me. I’m confused as to why someone whose sole defining issue is the replacement of income tax with a consumption tax is considered a “populist.” ---
**Author:** ![Astroboy14](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@Astroboy14](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astroboy14)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/39 "2008-01-17T22:24:00Z")
[QUOTE=galvatron] Any other Republicans that are not happy with Bush have any thoughts on the current crop of Candidates? [/QUOTE] For me, so far, it’s a big “none of the above.” ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2008, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856/40 "2008-01-17T23:11:20Z")
[QUOTE=Algher] Romney - a little too Ken doll, but of the pack is the one I have the best chance of tolerating. [/QUOTE] On the Daily Show last night, they mentioned Mitt then showed a clip of Guy Smiley from Sesame Street. Separated at birth. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/commiserate-republicans-against-bush/433856.md?page=3)