# Common Held Beliefs or Ignorance about a Film That Drives You Crazy **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [August 13, 2023, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524 "2023-08-13T19:45:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2023, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/381 "2023-09-13T20:33:20Z")
> [@Steven\_Maven](#): > > In _The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance_, it was John Wayne’s character, NOT Jimmy Stewart’s character, who performed the titular action. When the belief becomes fact, print the belief. ---
**Author:** ![Pavelb1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/439d5e/32.png) [@Pavelb1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pavelb1)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2023, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/382 "2023-09-13T20:35:22Z")
Yup I was wrong [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/48oLsDImC5A/hqdefault.jpg "Alfie (1966) - End title") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48oLsDImC5A) ---
**Author:** ![Steven\_Maven](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steven_maven/32/3272_2.png) [@Steven\_Maven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steven_Maven)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2023, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/383 "2023-09-13T20:46:09Z")
> [@Jeopardy! 2022-23](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeopardy-2022-23/971442/1429): > > > [@Jeopardy! 2022-23](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeopardy-2022-23/971442/1427): > > > > Actually, I’m vaguely thinking about cutting the cord…Jeopardy! > > YouTubeTV is the answer. YouTubeTV requires a subscription. > [@Jeopardy! 2022-23](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/jeopardy-2022-23/971442/1430): > > Regular YouTube usually has the most recent games. That’s how Mrs Maven & I watch it, usually during lunch. Several people post unauthorized copies. Some of them appear to live outside the USA. The episodes usually disappear after the original date. From time to time there is no current episode. Sometimes the date is mislabeled. Sometimes there are various internal glitches, including gaps, ending prematurely, and an annoying zooming in and out for no apparent reason. ---
**Author:** ![Steven\_Maven](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steven_maven/32/3272_2.png) [@Steven\_Maven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steven_Maven)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2023, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/384 "2023-09-13T21:04:30Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > > [@Steven\_Maven](#): > > > > In _The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance_…. > > When the belief becomes fact, print the belief. “When the **legend** becomes fact, print the **legend.** ” …because the legend is glorious and the fact mundane. There are several other minor misquotes similar to yours, but they don’t distort the underlying meaning. The same cannot be said for an episode of _Blue Bloods_. Tom Selleck’s character mangles the meaning to criticize a disreputable journalist, claiming that the movie says that it’s OK to lie if it serves your agenda. That is the exact opposite of the original intent. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2023, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/385 "2023-09-13T21:26:30Z")
Some people just have to be right, at the expense of a joke. What is the title of this thread? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2023, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/386 "2023-09-13T23:12:40Z")
> [@Steven\_Maven](#): > > I continue to be impressed by Hal David’s lyrical craftsmanship in summarizing a 123 minute movie (a bit long for that era) in a 2:49 song without revealing my above spoiler. Is he a philosopher? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2023, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/387 "2023-09-13T23:26:45Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Or listen to what Vizzini is saying as he explains his reasoning to Westley. He never explains his reasoning to Westley. What he’s saying isn’t his reasoning. It’s the raw material for his data collecting that goes into his reasoning. > [@MaxTheVool](#): > > I think you’re selling Vizzini very short. His plan was actually quite clever. (1) Spout a bunch of nonsense (2) distract opponent (3) switch cups (4) pick up your cup, wait for opponent to drink first from what they think is the non-poisoned cup Switching the cups was just to be sure (it was a life-and-death game, after all), but that wasn’t the bulk of his plan. I mean, really, any criminal “mastermind” whose plan depends on “Look, what’s that over there!?” wouldn’t have even gotten as far as grabbing the princess. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2023, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/388 "2023-09-13T23:32:57Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Switching the cups was just to be sure (it was a life-and-death game, after all), but that wasn’t the bulk of his plan. Then we saw that scene very differently. As I saw the scene, he first wasted a bunch of time going on about his various fake deductions, during which he was either (a) trying to bore/distract Westley, or (b) frantically trying to come up with his real plan. Then step 1 of his real plan was to distract Westley, and switch the cups while Westley wasn’t looking. Which (from his perspective) he did. Step 2 of his real plan is he picks up a cup, either cup, and “starts drinking” from it, watching Westley. He thinks one and only one cup is poisoned. He thinks Westley knows which cup is poisoned, except that Westley is wrong. He assumes that Westley (like most people) wouldn’t be willing to just voluntarily drink fatal poison. Therefore, when he sees Westley willingly drinking from a switched cup, he realizes that Westley thinks he has won (which is true), and therefore assumes that his guess was right, and that he is winning, so he drinks the poison and dies. Honestly, it’s a pretty brilliant plan… it just gets totally out-of-the-box outflanked. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2023, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/389 "2023-09-14T02:47:21Z")
> [@Steven\_Maven](#): > > YouTubeTV requires a subscription. “Cutting the cord” doesn’t mean getting rid of all subscription services. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2023, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/390 "2023-09-14T10:53:32Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > > [@Steven\_Maven](#): > > > > I continue to be impressed by Hal David’s lyrical craftsmanship in summarizing a 123 minute movie (a bit long for that era) in a 2:49 song without revealing my above spoiler. > > Is he a philosopher? There’s no “s” in Hal David. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2023, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/391 "2023-09-14T12:20:04Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I mean, really, any criminal “mastermind” whose plan depends on “Look, what’s that over there!?” wouldn’t have even gotten as far as grabbing the princess. Heck, he was hired _by_ a criminal mastermind to grab the princess. ---
**Author:** ![JohnnyEcks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnnyecks/32/18197_2.png) [@JohnnyEcks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnnyEcks)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2023, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/392 "2023-09-14T15:38:34Z")
Interesting detail- Westley, when he sets up the game, says “Where is the poison? “, Not “Which cup is the poison in?” Thus, “both” is an acceptable answer, by the rules given. It’s a classic bar-bet setup, and exact wording is important. **One of these days in your travels, a guy is going to show you a brand-new deck of cards on which the seal is not yet broken. Then this guy is going to offer to bet you that he can make the jack of spades jump out of this brand-new deck of cards and squirt cider in your ear. But, son, you do not accept this bet, because as sure as you stand there, you’re going to wind up with an ear full of cider.** ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2023, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/393 "2023-09-15T22:21:24Z")
Are you sure that was Cher? The YouTube clip says it’s Cilla Black. I mean there’s no auto-tune that I can hear. 😄 ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2023, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/394 "2023-09-16T13:59:56Z")
I remember the Cilla Black (and a later Dionne Warwick) version. But I looked it up numerous places, and it was Cher over the final credits. I started googling because, when I watched the clip above, I thought “This doesn’t sound like the version I know.” Now, why Burt asked Cilla Black to record it later, I don’t know… ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2023, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/395 "2023-09-16T14:52:49Z")
Well, I missed this before: Cilla Black sang on the UK re-release and Cher sang on the US version. I only knew the Dionne Warwick rendition. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2023, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/396 "2023-09-18T03:59:22Z")
Groot died in _Guardians of the Galaxy_. He was not reborn as a seedling. The character we’ve seen in the subsequent movies in the series is the original Groot’s child. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2023, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/397 "2023-09-18T16:37:30Z")
I remember people used to criticize in the 90s how in Star Wars: A New Hope the Stormtroopers assaulting Leia’s diplomatic transport were all stupid for doing a direct frontal assault and not just cutting through somewhere else or having Vader lead the assault but if you actually watch the movie it’s an almost perfect assault. The rebels know they’re coming from the hatch but then the Stormtroopers plant a sort of flashbang high explosion charge on the door which causes the rebels assembled to flinch which then allows the Imperials to come out blazing. In fact the Imperials only lose about 3 guys against a well fortified position, and they broke the Rebel defensive line almost immediately. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2023, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/398 "2023-09-18T23:23:04Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The character we’ve seen in the subsequent movies in the series is the original Groot’s child. Do you mean that “I am Groot” never literally means “I am Groot”? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2023, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/399 "2023-09-18T23:36:34Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > Do you mean that “I am Groot” never literally means “I am Groot”? Sometimes it means “I am Groot but not exclusively so.” It’s a subtle language. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2023, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524/400 "2023-09-18T23:43:41Z")
Same individual, offspring, or relative gets kind of fuzzy, for plants. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-held-beliefs-or-ignorance-about-a-film-that-drives-you-crazy/988524.md?page=21)