# Common words derived from proper names **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 16, 2007, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931 "2007-07-16T03:08:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2007, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/41 "2007-07-21T07:38:24Z")
[QUOTE=the Online Etymology Dictionary] Mercurial 3. Of persons. Born under the planet Mercury; having the qualities supposed to proceed from such a nativity, as eloquence, ingenuity, aptitude for commerce. [/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Exapno Mapcase] People are free to decide which to go by. [/QUOTE] Except that is not really what Mercurial means [http://www.thefreedictionary.com/mercurial](http://www.thefreedictionary.com/mercurial) **OR** [http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/mercurial](http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/mercurial) I believe my Merriam-Webster trumps your Online Etymology Dictionary. Mercurial **could** mean being born under the planet Mercury but how did THAT planet get it’s name? When people use the word they almost always mean #2. Either way, the source of the word is ultimately a persons name. ---
**Author:** ![groman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/73ab20/32.png) [@groman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/groman)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2007, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/42 "2007-07-21T07:51:49Z")
[QUOTE=Sitnam] For some reason I thought there was a Spartan king named Laconis…guess not. No…the planet is named for the person Mercury (a diety granted, but still). I’m not sure why you’d think a word meaning thief and swift came from an orbiting ball of rock. [/QUOTE] Hmm, I’ve always thought that “mercurial” when describing a person was a reference to Mercutio (who might have been named after Mercury for all I know) and not directly to Mercury. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2007, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/43 "2007-07-21T15:49:16Z")
[QUOTE=groman] Hmm, I’ve always thought that “mercurial” when describing a person was a reference to Mercutio (who might have been named after Mercury for all I know) and not directly to Mercury. [/QUOTE] There’s no evidence for this whatsoever that I know of. > [@Sitnam](#): > > I believe my Merriam-Webster trumps your Online Etymology Dictionary. Really? You believe that? The Merriam-Webster beats the Online Etymology Dictionary and the Oxford English Dictionary, which are both etymological dictionaries. Really? You believe that? Why? ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2007, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/44 "2007-07-21T16:14:12Z")
[QUOTE=groman] Hmm, I’ve always thought that “mercurial” when describing a person was a reference to Mercutio (who might have been named after Mercury for all I know) and not directly to Mercury. [/QUOTE] See, I always assumed the opposite- that Shakespeare named his character with nimble wit and dancing tongue after Mecury/mecurial. ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2007, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/45 "2007-07-21T17:03:27Z")
Originally posted by **panache45:** > [@](#): > > Johnson. > > Who’s the lucky guy this word is derived from? I think his full name was Woodrow (“Woody”) Peter Johnson. Oh, and “algebra” is from an Arabic mathemetician, Al-Jebera. ---
**Author:** ![groman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/73ab20/32.png) [@groman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/groman)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2007, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/46 "2007-07-21T17:46:21Z")
[QUOTE=Exapno Mapcase] There’s no evidence for this whatsoever that I know of. [/QUOTE] While I’m not arguing because now that I think about it, it makes sense. However, I’ve spent my entire life with a mental image of “mercurial” being Mercutio-like based on a particular actor’s rendition of him in a production I saw as a kid. So there evidence at least _one person_ did it 😛 ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2007, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/47 "2007-07-22T00:36:43Z")
[QUOTE=Exapno Mapcase] Really? You believe that? The Merriam-Webster beats the Online Etymology Dictionary and the Oxford English Dictionary, which are both etymological dictionaries. Really? You believe that? Why? [/QUOTE] I’m unfamiliar with the Online Etymology Dictionary, but if given contradictory info from the OED and the most recent M-W, I’d go with M-W. Most fo the OED is quite old, having been written and compiled 80 or more years ago. Some of it was updated in the 80s with the release of the 2nd Edition, but that changed only a small part of the entire corpus. M-W not only has the OED to base its research on, but also their own files and years of scholarly research. Of course, sometimes the difference between the two is a matter of interpretation of the primary data. Two scholars can read the same cites and come to different understandings. That may be the case here. Unfortunately, M-W doesn’t publish its citations, so we can’t know if this is the case. ---
**Author:** ![Garfield226](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Garfield226](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Garfield226)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2007, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/48 "2007-07-22T00:49:56Z")
[jones](http://www.answers.com/topic/jones-1?cat=health) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2007, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/49 "2007-07-22T01:09:41Z")
Do you understand the difference between etymological dictionaries and regular “definitional” dictionaries? This is a serious question, because I find that most people tend to think of dictionaries as dictionaries when in fact there are enormous differences between them. The OED has a special purpose, as outlined in the 1933 preface: > **[Oxford English Dictionary](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford_English_Dictionary)** > > The Oxford English Dictionary (OED) is the principal historical dictionary of the English language, published by Oxford University Press (OUP), a University of Oxford publishing house. The dictionary, which began publication in 1884, traces the historical development of the English language, providing a comprehensive resource to scholars and academic researchers, and provides ongoing descriptions of English language usage in its variations around the world. Work began on the dictionary in 1857,... > [@](#): > > The aim of this Dictionary is to present in alphabetical series the words that have formed the English vocabulary from the time of the earliest records [ca. A.D. 740] down to the present day, with all the relevant facts concerning their form, sense-history, pronunciation, and etymology. Its editors deliberately collected as many usages of words throughout history as they could to trace the development of meanings, senses, and variations as writers used them in new and varying ways. This is distinctly different from modern dictionary creation, which tries to compile current usage as a way of parsing sets of meanings. The dictionaries may or may not include an etymology, depending on the edition, but the history of the word is of far less importance than the way the word is currently used. Take the American Heritage Third Edition. It too gives mercurial - as a _definition_ - as being from the god Mercury: > [@](#): > > Having the characteristics of eloquence, shrewdness, swiftness, and thievishness attributed to the god Mercury. But it also gives an _etymology_ for the word: > [@](#): > > Middle English, of the the planet Mercury, from Latin _mercurialis_, of the god or planet Mercury, from _Mercurius_, Mercury Understanding the difference between the etymology of a word and its current definition and usage is critical, because probably the vast majority of words in English have either changed in meaning or grown new meanings unrelated to the way the word originally appeared in the language. **Sitnam** clearly doesn’t appreciate this distinction, and perhaps doesn’t even realize that it exists. You cannot say “Except that is not really what Mercurial means” when talking about etymology. Meaning and origin are separate. I thought, in a thread about word origins, that this was so obvious as to go without saying. That’s clearly wrong. Nothing is so obvious as to go without saying to a general audience, because we each have our specialties. But I just couldn’t believe that anyone would take **Sitnam** seriously because of the laughable confusion continually being presented between current meaning and origin. Mercurial comes from an astrological usage of people born under the sign of Mercury. Today even the astrology nuts tend not to refer to planets that way and that origin would have no meaning for anyone. As a definition, then, the use of Mercury to refer to the god is perfectly acceptable. The careful researcher just has to understand why this change was made and what the true origin of the word is. I have the OED, the unabridged Random House, the American Heritage, the Microsoft Encarta College, and a pocket Merriam-Webster, BTW. Each treats the language in a somewhat different manner, and each has its uses. For older etymologies, the OED is the standard, even if newer research is crucial. But I never ever confuse an etymological dictionary with one describing current usage. That’s like confusing diesel with gasoline. Your engine will stall if you mix them up. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2007, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/50 "2007-07-22T01:13:47Z")
Foley artists derive the name of their profession from that immortal sound-effects man, Jack Foley. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2007, 10:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/51 "2007-07-22T10:31:16Z")
You know **Exapno Mapcase** , say what you want, this is from your own cite: > [@](#): > > mercurial > 1390, “pertaining to the planet Mercury” (see Mercury). Meaning “sprightly, volatile, quick” (1593) is from supposed qualities of those born under the planet Mercury, probably partially by association with quicksilver. > [@](#): > > Mercury > c.1150, from L. Mercurius “Mercury,” the Roman god, originally a god of tradesmen and thieves, from merx “merchandise;” or perhaps from Etruscan and infl. by merx. Later he was associated with Gk. Hermes. The planet closest to the sun so called in classical L. (c.1386 in Eng.). Sense of “silver-white metal, quicksilver” is first recorded c.1386, when elements were commonly associated alchemically with the planets. This one probably so associated for its mobility. First came the Roman God (c.1150), then the planet (c.1386), then the ‘born under’ (c.1390), then the metal & ‘quick’ meaning (c.1593) [QUOTE=Exapno Mapcase] Understanding the difference between the etymology of a word and its current definition and usage is critical, because probably the vast majority of words in English have either changed in meaning or grown new meanings unrelated to the way the word originally appeared in the language. Sitnam clearly doesn’t appreciate this distinction, and perhaps doesn’t even realize that it exists. [/QUOTE] Oh I do, I am well aware that words have different meaning throughout time, and that todays meaning has little relevance on the origin of the word, but when the word is FIRST used for is whats relevant for etymology. Mercurial came from Mercury, and even if it was the planet, the planets name came from the person, so it’s heritage is from a name of a person. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2007, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/52 "2007-07-22T17:09:03Z")
shanghai ---
**Author:** ![Rucksinator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/898d66/32.png) [@Rucksinator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rucksinator)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2007, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/53 "2007-07-22T23:50:04Z")
Machiavellian ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2007, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/54 "2007-07-23T00:41:01Z")
[QUOTE=Sitnam] Oh I do, I am well aware that words have different meaning throughout time, and that todays meaning has little relevance on the origin of the word, but when the word is FIRST used for is whats relevant for etymology. Mercurial came from Mercury, and even if it was the planet, the planets name came from the person, so it’s heritage is from a name of a person. [/QUOTE] Oh, good grief. You’re saying that the world’s finest dictionaries got their own definition wrong because they were unable to sort out the meanings of their own source citations. But you were able to figure it out for them. I’m done here. Have fun. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2007, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/55 "2007-07-25T06:06:10Z")
[QUOTE=Exapno Mapcase] I’m done here. Have fun. [/QUOTE] Method #234 of **How to duck out of an argument you’ve lost** ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2007, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/56 "2007-07-26T02:52:03Z")
Have “maverick” and “macadam” been mentioned yet? After Samuel Maverick (1803-70) and JL McAdam (1756-1836), respectively. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2007, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/57 "2007-07-26T15:57:00Z")
[QUOTE=Joey P] Tivo, as in “I’ll Tivo it” or “I tivo’d it” [/QUOTE] Another form is “ **tivotee** ” derived from devotee. Al Gore has been making a lot of appearance to talk about global warming. Reporters keep pressing him to make a **Sherman Statement** , firmly stating he doesn’t want to run for president. Gore keeps dancing around it. After the US civil war, Gen. William T. Sherman was urged to run for president. His answer, “_If nominated, I will not run. If elected, I will not serve_,” has become the traditional denial, the **Sherman Statement**. Nina Totenberg is NPR’s legal correspondent. Public Radio stations often give away coffee mugs and tote bags to those who pledge to support the station with money. For some pledges, during some shows, you can get a **Nina Totenbag** ® In figure skating and gymnastics, several moves are named after the athlete who invented them. A few are the **Thomas Flare** , the \*\*Axel \*\* jump, the \*\*Flying Camel \*\* spin, and the \*\*Hamill Camel \*\* combination spin. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2007, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/58 "2007-07-26T17:32:45Z")
[QUOTE=AskNott] After the US civil war, Gen. William T. Sherman was urged to run for president. His answer, “_If nominated, I will not run. If elected, I will not serve_,” has become the traditional denial, the **Sherman Statement**. [/QUOTE] And that reminds me of the Civil War’s General Hooker. No prizes for guessing what was named after him. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2007, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931/59 "2007-07-26T17:57:46Z")
[QUOTE=Siam Sam] And that reminds me of the Civil War’s General Hooker. No prizes for guessing what was named after him. 😃 [/QUOTE] Rugby players? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/common-words-derived-from-proper-names/411931.md?page=2)