# Composition of US Carrier Battle Group **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 29, 2004, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997 "2004-03-29T02:34:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/1 "2004-03-29T02:34:00Z")
I’m playing a video game named “Superpower”, wherein I get to command a fictional version of a real nation and a fictional navy. I am curious as to what would constitute a typical carrier battle group for the US, so that I can emulate the US in my plans for world domination. I’m thinking something like: 1 Carrier 2 Destroyers 1 Cruiser 1 Frigate 1 Supply Ship 2 Subs A whole mess of little ships Is that accurate? ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/2 "2004-03-29T02:39:22Z")
Add at lease one oiler which is not the same as a regular supply ship. All our carries may now be nuclear but planes need JP5 and other ships need fuel oil. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/3 "2004-03-29T02:55:37Z")
I don’t believe that we deploy frigates (Oliver Hazard Perry-class) with our CVBGs anymore, as we are in the process of ripping the missle launch systems out of them and using the frigates as ‘uber-patrol boats’. Also, and I don’t have the game so I don’t know the various limitations, but we are also starting to decommision the older Ticonderoga-cruisers, as the newer (and more efficient) Arleigh Burke-class Destroyers come online. Not that ‘Cruiser’ and ‘Destroyer’ are meaningful distinctions in the modern Navy. (Ticonderoga class=Cruisers. Spruance class=Destroyers. Same hull, go figure.) I am pretty anal about that stuff too, as witnessed by my building ‘real’ fleets in Masters of Orion III. Fun stuff! (Trying to keep it GQ-worthy) Does _Superpower_ give you good control over land and air units, as well? Do you get nukes? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/4 "2004-03-29T03:05:50Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > I don’t believe that we deploy frigates (Oliver Hazard Perry-class) with our CVBGs anymore, as we are in the process of ripping the missle launch systems out of them and using the frigates as ‘uber-patrol boats’. Also, and I don’t have the game so I don’t know the various limitations, but we are also starting to decommision the older Ticonderoga-cruisers, as the newer (and more efficient) Arleigh Burke-class Destroyers come online. Not that ‘Cruiser’ and ‘Destroyer’ are meaningful distinctions in the modern Navy. (Ticonderoga class=Cruisers. Spruance class=Destroyers. Same hull, go figure.) > > I am pretty anal about that stuff too, as witnessed by my building ‘real’ fleets in Masters of Orion III. Fun stuff! > (Trying to keep it GQ-worthy) > Does _Superpower_ give you good control over land and air units, as well? Do you get nukes? Superpower allows full control of land and air units as well. If I wish to, I _can_ retire vessels or other units, and my maintenance costs will decrease accordingly. I do get nukes, but using them is dangerous. Also, the AI basically refuses to use nukes, even if you invade a country with the bomb. Regarding the various missions of Cruisers vs Destroyers vs Frigates, etc, is there someplace I can find concise mission-objective-based definitions of what they’re supposed to be designed for? ---
**Author:** ![igloorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/858c86/32.png) [@igloorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/igloorex)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/5 "2004-03-29T03:08:33Z")
That sounds about right, except for the “whole mess of smaller boats.” No smaller vessels could hang with a CVBG in terms of speed, range, or seaworthiness to get anywhere. Depending on the situation, a CVBG might be augmented once on scene with minesweeps or PC vessels, but it is not common for those to cruise around with the CV. Also, there’s pretty much always at least 2 Aegis ships in the CVBG. Those could be either cruisers (Tico class) or destoyers (Arleigh Burke class). They’re there to provide air search / air defense for the carrier. But don’t take my word for it, here’s what the US Navy site has to say ([http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/ships/carriers/powerhouse/cvbg.html](http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/ships/carriers/powerhouse/cvbg.html)): > [@](#): > > Typically a carrier strike group might have: > > a carrier – The carrier provides a wide range of options to the U.S. government from simply showing the flag to attacks on airborne, afloat and ashore targets. Because carriers operate in international waters, its aircraft do not need to secure landing rights on foreign soil. These ships also engage in sustained operations in support of other forces. > > two guided missile cruisers – multi-mission surface combatants. Equipped with Tomahawks for long-range strike capability. > > a guided missile destroyer – multi-mission suface combatant, used primarily for anti-air warfare (AAW) > > a destroyer – primarily for anti-submarine warfare (ASW) > > a frigate – primarily for anti-submarine warfare (ASW) > > two attack submarines – in a direct support role seeking out and destroying hostile surface ships and submarines > > a combined ammunition, oiler, and supply ship – provides logistic support enabling the Navy’s forward presence: on station, ready to respond ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/6 "2004-03-29T03:15:04Z")
The Spruance class destroyers are rapidly being decommissioned, as are the old Ticonderogas (CG 47 to CG 51). The Spruance shared a hull with the Ticos, but they weren’t the same ship at all. They had radically different roles. The newer Ticonderogas and the Arleigh Burke class destroyeers can be used more interchangeably, since they share the important components of: 1. The AEGIS combat system and associated SPY radar. 2. The Vertical Launcher System for launching of missiles 3. Tomahawk cruise missiles and SM-2 surface-to-air missiles for said launcher ---
**Author:** ![igloorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/858c86/32.png) [@igloorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/igloorex)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/7 "2004-03-29T03:29:31Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > The newer Ticonderogas and the Arleigh Burke class destroyeers can be used more interchangeably, since they share the important components of: > > 1. The AEGIS combat system and associated SPY radar. > 2. The Vertical Launcher System for launching of missiles > 3. Tomahawk cruise missiles and SM-2 surface-to-air missiles for said launcher You forgot the most important component they share: LAMPS Mk III helicopters (At least with the flight II Burkes) (ok, ok, helos are probably not going to displace any of your top three in the list, but they’re easily #4. Then again, the other ships in BG can also field LAMPS helos, so not as much need for the cruisers to do so as well.) ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/8 "2004-03-29T03:39:21Z")
Does the designation “Corvette” apply to any modern vessel or is that an obsolete class of vessel, like “Battleship” or “Dreadnought” ? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/9 "2004-03-29T03:50:10Z")
I rode an Ecuadorian Navy corvette in Unitas exercises eight years ago. Corvettes are small fast ships, smaller than a frigate, but larger than patrol craft. This designation is not used for any ships in the U.S. Navy, however. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/10 "2004-03-29T03:57:40Z")
> [@Jonathan Woodall](#): > > Does the designation “Corvette” apply to any modern vessel or is that an obsolete class of vessel, like “Battleship” or “Dreadnought” ? Some nations do have Corvettes. Chevy is running a deal! Yukyukyuk… Really, some countries (quite a few) have ‘Corvettes’, which are _generally_ smaller than a frigate, but larger than a patrol boat. The Israeli Saar-V series, for instance, rivals some of the larger frigates and destroyers out there, while most corvettes have a mid/small (57mm or so) gun, maybe a few missles, and not much else. The US Navy is looking to bring back corvettes, but the word ‘corvette’ is no good, so we are going to call them ‘Littoral Combat Ships’, basically smaller vessels equipped to fight closer to shore, since most of our ships are designed to fight far out sea, an event which will probably not happen for some time. The largest surface combatant in use these days is the Russian ‘Kirov’ class nuclear powered guided missle battlecruiser (BCGN). When it is working, that is, as the thing(s) appear to be maintenance nightmares. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/11 "2004-03-29T04:20:55Z")
Here’s a picture of a corvette similar to the one I rode on this page (warning-Spanish) [http://www.warbook2000.com/naval/ecuador/armadaecuador.htm](http://www.warbook2000.com/naval/ecuador/armadaecuador.htm) The sucker was so small I couldn’t walk from berthing to my work spaces (CIC, radio and the bridge) without having to hit the weather decks. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/12 "2004-03-29T05:40:49Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > The US Navy is looking to bring back corvettes, but the word ‘corvette’ is no good, so we are going to call them ‘Littoral Combat Ships’, basically smaller vessels equipped to fight closer to shore, since most of our ships are designed to fight far out sea, an event which will probably not happen for some time. How did the word corvette become verboten? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/13 "2004-03-29T07:02:46Z")
> [@](#): > > How did the word corvette become verboten? It is not so much “verboten” as just outside U S Navy parlance. I don’t think the U.S. has had an actual corvette in well over a hundred years (if then) and those would have been totally different ships, of course. The name corvette entered U.S. awareness during WWII with the various British ASW ships. We had “sub chasers” and destroyer escorts (light, slow destroyers), but the ships we had that most nearly approximated corvettes were various classes of Coast Guard cutters–that we did not call corvettes. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/14 "2004-03-29T07:10:26Z")
> [@Jonathan Woodall](#): > > How did the word corvette become verboten? Because ‘corvettes’ are what poor and inferior navies have! The United States Navy has (will have) ‘Littoral Combat Ships’! (No real reason, other than that the USN does not want corvettes, it wants LCS. 6 in one hand, half-dozen in the other, IMO.) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/15 "2004-03-29T08:26:05Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > I don’t believe that we deploy frigates (Oliver Hazard Perry-class) with our CVBGs anymore, as we are in the process of ripping the missle launch systems out of them and using the frigates as ‘uber-patrol boats’. Also, and I don’t have the game so I don’t know the various limitations, but we are also starting to decommision the older Ticonderoga-cruisers, as the newer (and more efficient) Arleigh Burke-class Destroyers come online. Not that ‘Cruiser’ and ‘Destroyer’ are meaningful distinctions in the modern Navy. (Ticonderoga class=Cruisers. Spruance class=Destroyers. Same hull, go figure.) > > I am pretty anal about that stuff too, as witnessed by my building ‘real’ fleets in Masters of Orion III. Fun stuff! > (Trying to keep it GQ-worthy) > Does _Superpower_ give you good control over land and air units, as well? Do you get nukes? Once the missile launchers are removed, what kind of weaponry are the frigates left with? Cannon only? ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/16 "2004-03-29T09:03:26Z")
Hrmmm, post eaten? Anyhoo, once the OHPs lose there missles, they will still have a pretty decent armament: -76mm gun. -CIWS -Mk.46/50 torpedos (little nancy torpedos, but better than a sharp stick in the eye…) -Helos with whatever armament they carry. -Increased weapons lockers on board, since there is a lot more boarding going on these days. More then enough for their given task (Perform the tedious and sometimes dangerous work of enforcing embargos, searching ships for badguys, etc.) The saving in space and crew from deleting the missles will be/is well worth it, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![muttrox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a8b319/32.png) [@muttrox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muttrox)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/17 "2004-03-29T14:16:46Z")
This may help: > **[How Carrier Battle Groups Work](https://science.howstuffworks.com/carrier-group.htm)** > > How does one of the most valuable pieces of military equipment travel around the world? When they move, an entire fleet of protective air and water craft moves with them. Learn all about carrier battle groups. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/18 "2004-03-29T14:29:18Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Here’s a picture of a corvette similar to the one I rode on this page (warning-Spanish) > > [http://www.warbook2000.com/naval/ecuador/armadaecuador.htm](http://www.warbook2000.com/naval/ecuador/armadaecuador.htm) > > The sucker was so small I couldn’t walk from berthing to my work spaces (CIC, radio and the bridge) without having to hit the weather decks. Specifically, the middle picture is the one with the corvette (CM14) ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/19 "2004-03-29T15:13:44Z")
That’s the one. I actually, on that deployment, rode the Esmeraldas and the Los Rios corvettes as well as the frigate Moran Valverde. I also rode ships of the Brazilian, Venezuelan, Argentine, Chilean, and Colombian navies, while circumnavigating the continent of South America and making tons of port visits along the way. I also got my ditch card (Panama Canal transit) and became a shellback (initiation ceremony for crossing the Equator for the first time). It was a fun six months, especially for a single sailor. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![igloorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/858c86/32.png) [@igloorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/igloorex)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997/20 "2004-03-31T02:14:24Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > Hrmmm, post eaten? > > Anyhoo, once the OHPs lose there missles, they will still have a pretty decent armament: > > \ > > -Helos with whatever armament they carry. The helos can carry: Mk46/50 torps “penguin” anti-ship missile (possibly the worst name ever for a weapon) hellfire missiles (much more fearsome sounding) Side mounted gun (M60 or M240) I guess the OHPs needed the forward launcher to shoot their harpoons? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/composition-of-us-carrier-battle-group/236997.md?page=2)