Concerned about getting a black or foreign doctor? Make sure to use www.whitedoctor.org!

[KarlGrenze]

@Rumor_Watkins

My point is that, much like the insecure people in my field (law) who yap on and on about how people who went to the shittiest law school and passed the bar are as much a lawyer as the guy who was on the Harvard Law Review, bandying about “well they passed some licensure tests” as evidence of your point belies the fact that there is still much stratification in the quality of medical practitioner.

I believe there is stratification, I find it ridiculous that people can discern that based on something that happened before they got into med school. Or imply that the stratification is inherent based on skin color or last names.

[Rumor_Watkins]

@KarlGrenze

First of all, the USMLE is the general licensing test, NOT the board tests that the doctors have to take at the end of their residencies to become fully specialized.

ok. board certification is not required to practice medicine. there are significant numbers of non board-certified practitioners.

None of those tests are a cake in the walk. The students who take those tests are studying really hard before taking them. In the general USMLE tests, yes, the passing rate is higher, but again, that does not mean it is simply easy.

ok.

You guys seem to think that it is easy, a piece of cake, and really “not good enough” for medicine. But in reality, seriously, the minimum amount of knowledge and skills required for a doctor is a lot… A whole freaking lot. Just because it is the minimum it is not “easy”, nor is it “bad”. It is perfectly fine. A very selective test would be harmful to the profession, and really not of much help to the patients.

it might not be good enough for me, as a consumer of the goddamn product.

the level of knowledge you need to be a lawyer is a lot… A whole freaking lot. But I wouldn’t ever dare select a lawyer (but many, many do) by simply looking for the first licensed professional I bump into. There’s a little more to it.

The specialty specific tests, the ones taken at the end of residencies, are much more specialized, and much more harder, with lower passing rates. Again, even if the majority pass, this does not mean that the exam is “easy”, nor that the minimum is not “good enough”. It IS plenty of good enough, it IS exactly what is expected and required for that profession, and that specialty. You guys seem to think that “the minimum” is bad. It is not, each college ensures that the minimum their diplomates should know is still hard, difficult, and vast knowledge.

and that’s my point. you just admitted that “it IS plenty of good enough, it IS exactly what is expected and required for that profession”. i.e. minimal competency. you’re the one who is making the implication that minimum = bad

[Rumor_Watkins]

@KarlGrenze

I believe there is stratification, I find it ridiculous that people can discern that based on something that happened before they got into med school.

I would disagree. Especially given that there’s no med school that I am aware of that has open enrollment.

Or imply that the stratification is inherent based on skin color or last names.

I agree. I would disagree if you’re using skin color as a proxy metric for “were you the beneficiary of reduced admissions metrics due to an active policy of affirmative action” and that metric is accurate

[KarlGrenze]

@Rumor_Watkins

ok. board certification is not required to practice medicine. there are significant numbers of non board-certified practitioners.

I thought that was only the case if you’re talking about GPs or general family practice. All the other medical specialties (pediatrics, internal medicine, endocrinology, dermatology, surgery, radiology, etc.) require passing the board exams for that specialty, and you need to pass it to become a member of that college.

I would argue that if you’re going to look at accomplishments, noticing that the person is not boarded in a specialty that they’re supposed to practice is more telling than what they did before med school.

it might not be good enough for me, as a consumer of the goddamn product.

the level of knowledge you need to be a lawyer is a lot… A whole freaking lot. But I wouldn’t ever dare select a lawyer (but many, many do) by simply looking for the first licensed professional I bump into. There’s a little more to it.

There is, I just disagree with the immediate assumption that since someone is from X group, then they MUST have gotten to med school due to affirmative action (which, again, I don’t know if anything remotely like it exists at med school level), and are inherently inferior doctors. THAT mindset is what I’m against.

and that’s my point. you just admitted that “it IS plenty of good enough, it IS exactly what is expected and required for that profession”. i.e. minimal competency. you’re the one who is making the implication that minimum = bad

Eh… nope… I believe that the minimum required to pass the test is actually good knowledge and good base, not bad. You’re the ones who want to go look for something more than “passed all the testing required for accreditation, licensing, and specialty certification”.

I would disagree. Especially given that there’s no med school that I am aware of that has open enrollment.

At least in the American university system, there were many classes I had to take as requirement for professional school (either med or vet school). The material covered in those classes… many times I didn’t need most of it for veterinary medicine (example: physics). Whether I did well in that class or not (actually I didn’t) has no importance in what I do now.

I would disagree if you’re using skin color as a proxy metric for “were you the beneficiary of reduced admissions metrics due to an active policy of affirmative action” and that metric is accurate

I’m still trying to decipher that sentence…

[monstro]

I know a white woman (a Jew, whodathunkit?!) who got into Morehouse School of Medicine after she was rejected from the better known medical school she wanted to go to. Twice.

And she happens to be an excellent doctor.

[KarlGrenze]

BTW, I think that is the main difference between minorities looking for specific doctors vs whites looking solely for white doctors.

In the first case, the group (be it women, blacks, Hispanics, etc.) wants doctors they think they can most easily identify with, based on things like common cultural backgrounds or same gender. They’re looking for someone who may empathize with them, and they won’t feel intimidated.

Versus, it seems, the other group is looking for non minority doctors based on an immediate assumption that they’re inferior, not because they may not empathize better.

Very different reasons.

[Rand_Rover]

If you’ll bother to look upthread, you’ll see where I gave two reasons why a white patient could prefer a white doctor for reasons other than thinking that non-white people are inherently inferior to white people.

So, I think your belief shows a bias that is just like the biase of which you are accusing white people.

[KarlGrenze]

@Rand_Rover

So, I think your belief shows a bias that is just like the biase of which you are accusing white people.

Rand, you’re right, you did posted other reasons. Yet why the insistence in this thread about affirmative action in med schools? Which, again, I’m not sure how big of a deal it is.

[Pazu]

@Rumor_Watkins

ok. board certification is not required to practice medicine.

Technically true, but I’ve never seen it actually done.

there are significant numbers of non board-certified practitioners.

Cite?

I have never seen a single job listing in my field that did NOT specify “Board Certified or Board Eligible”.