# Confusing puzzle from Will Shortz **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [April 27, 2009, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505 "2009-04-27T15:03:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/1 "2009-04-27T15:03:36Z")
I’ve been listening the NPR’s Weekend Edition every Sunday morning for at least 6months now, and Will Short’s word games are the highlight of my mornings. I solve about half of the puzzles, and always submit them, though they’ve never called me to put me on the air. I solved yesterday’s puzzle almost before he finished reading it. But something confuses me. Five equals four. Seven equals five. Eight equals one. Twenty-six equals nine. What does twelve equal? Um… Eight equals one? Is that a mistake? ---
**Author:** ![RiverRunner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/977dab/32.png) [@RiverRunner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RiverRunner)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/2 "2009-04-27T15:15:22Z")
Kinda seems like it, unless it’s a multi-layered puzzle, where “one” would be referring back to “the first answer.” That doesn’t seem right, though. RR ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/3 "2009-04-27T15:19:54Z")
> [@RiverRunner](#): > > Kinda seems like it, unless it’s a multi-layered puzzle, where “one” would be referring back to “the first answer.” That doesn’t seem right, though. Even that doesn’t make sense, though. It wouldn’t refer back to the first answer, it would refer back to the first question. And the puzzles are sometimes hard, but they are never obscure. ---
**Author:** ![Eureka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/74df32/32.png) [@Eureka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eureka)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/4 "2009-04-27T20:23:13Z")
I don’t think it’s a mistake, because it’s written on the website in numeric form–rather than in words as you did here. Why this proves anything is now beyond me–I had one of those lightbulb moments which then don’t compute. ---
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/5 "2009-04-27T20:47:19Z")
Your lightbulb moment may have been correct. Hint:Using the digits instead of the words is intended to obscure the solution.My answer:Roman numerals in the words for the numbers. So twelve is 65, counting the “w” as 2 "v"s. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/6 "2009-04-27T20:48:55Z")
> [@Eureka](#): > > I don’t think it’s a mistake, because it’s written on the website in numeric form–rather than in words as you did here. Yeah, I’m not sure why that makes a difference, though I suppose it might. I cannot for the life of me figure out why 8 would equal 1, even outside of the context of the rest of the puzzle. If the original puzzle had a misprint, would they correct it on the website? They must know the answer, so how could they let this clue go unnoticed? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/7 "2009-04-27T20:51:12Z")
> [@rowrrbazzle](#): > > My answer:Roman numerals in the words for the numbers. So twelve is 65, counting the “w” as 2 "v"s. Huh? Now I’m more confused than before. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/8 "2009-04-27T20:52:48Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > I cannot for the life of me figure out why 8 would equal 1, even outside of the context of the rest of the puzzle. Because I = 1 ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/9 "2009-04-27T20:54:13Z")
Oh wait – I see what you’re thinking. I’m not buying part of your answer, but I can see how you’d come up with an answer of 5 ---
**Author:** ![zut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zut/32/2875_2.png) [@zut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zut)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/10 "2009-04-27T20:56:43Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > Oh wait – I see what you’re thinking. I’m not buying part of your answer, but I can see how you’d come up with an answer of > > 5 Try 55 (LV) ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/11 "2009-04-27T20:57:44Z")
> [@rowrrbazzle](#): > > Hint:Using the digits instead of the words is intended to obscure the solution.My answer:Roman numerals in the words for the numbers. So twelve is 65, counting the “w” as 2 "v"s. I’d say “55” – the letters in the others are all adjacent, and “vv” isn’t a legitimate roman numeral, and LV is. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2009, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/12 "2009-04-27T21:48:26Z")
I think it would be better worded as You can take four from five You can take five from seven You can take one from eight You can take nine from twenty-six What can you take from twelve? ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/13 "2009-04-28T07:52:39Z")
“There may be no 3 in three, but there is a 4 in five, and 9 in six, and 1 in eight, and in twelve, there’s 55!” - Cliff Johnson, 3 in Three (computer game). ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/14 "2009-04-28T12:22:54Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > I solved yesterday’s puzzle almost before he finished reading it. But something confuses me. What was your solution, and based on what logic? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/15 "2009-04-28T12:51:18Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > What was your solution, and based on what logic? Count the number of letters in each clue. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/16 "2009-04-28T13:39:07Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > Count the number of letters in each clue. I think that must have been an intentional red herring; otherwise why use 26 rather than 6 or 16? Does anybody else wonder if Will Shortz has a brother named Jim? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/17 "2009-04-28T13:44:25Z")
> [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](#): > > I think that must have been an intentional red herring; I think you’re right. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/18 "2009-04-28T17:35:05Z")
> [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](#): > > Does anybody else wonder if Will Shortz has a brother named Jim? No more than I wonder if Peter Cetera has a brother named Et. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/19 "2009-04-28T17:44:49Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > No more than I wonder if Peter Cetera has a brother named Et. My Sunday school teacher was Mrs. Sippi. ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2009, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505/20 "2009-04-28T21:13:52Z")
“Will and shorts- two things I’m no longer allowed to change on my own.” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/confusing-puzzle-from-will-shortz/494505.md?page=2)