# Congratulations, straight supremacists **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 12, 2003, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786 "2003-11-12T10:26:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![wolfstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wolfstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfstu)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/161 "2003-11-14T15:49:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by MrVisible \* > \*\*Hey, **Wolfstu** , anything in particular you want on your shrine? So far, I’ve got the past couple of posts of yours, engraved in steel, and a few candles and some incense. Oh, and some gummi bears. \*\* :o Oh, why, thank you. I’ve never had a shrine before. Gummi bears? That’s very thoughtful of you. 🙂 I think the best addition would be a photograph of your smiling nephew, unmolested by hatred from whoever is making him feel unsafe. **Mr. B** : > [@](#): > > …a solitary _Stick-Up_ in the Cubs’ Locker Room comes to mind. Uh… I’m pretty sure this was a compliment, so I’m going to be tactful and pretend I understood it 🆒 . (The Cubs are a baseball team that Cecil likes, no?) And thanks for compliments to everyone. It’s nice to be able to contribute to a discussion now and then. And **MrVisible** , I really hope things get better, soon, for your nephew, no matter what’s going on. I’m sure you’ll do everything you can… and if I were there, I’d be glad to help. I was going to ask if you could tell us a bit about him… it’s easy for those of us separated by space and pixels to forget that he’s a real person with thoughts and interests and potential. But then I realised that it might involve risk of revealing his identity, which you’re taking care not to do. So I’ll leave it up to your judgement. Either way, my thoughts are with him. ---
**Author:** ![wolfstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wolfstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfstu)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/162 "2003-11-14T16:14:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfstu \* > \*\*The best one I’ve seen is at one of our dopers’ websites. But [www.metrodemontreal.com/matt](http://www.metrodemontreal.com/matt) seems to be down right now. When it’s up, I’ll give you a link to the author’s memorial page, where he lists names and references for _dozens_ of people assaulted or murdered for their sexuality, or even their _perceived_ sexuality. \*\* This site is back up. The memorial page to victims of anti-homosexual violence is [here](http://www.metrodemontreal.com/matt/gay/victims.html). The main page on about homosexuality is [here](http://www.metrodemontreal.com/matt/gay/index.html). I highly recommend it as reading to anyone who wants to learn the straight dope on ‘gay’. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/163 "2003-11-14T16:34:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfstu \* > \*\*Uh… I’m pretty sure this was a compliment, so I’m going to be tactful and pretend I understood it 🆒 . (The Cubs are a baseball team that Cecil likes, no?) \*\* Heh. 😃 A Stick-Up is a small, round air freshener with an adhesive pad on the back. The Cubs locker room would be (I assume) a really smelly place. He’s comparing your (very eloquent, I’d like to note) posts to a breath of fresh air on a very old and nasty subject. I agree. ---
**Author:** ![rekkah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ee59a6/32.png) [@rekkah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rekkah)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/164 "2003-11-14T16:59:09Z")
Firstly, and most importantly, Mr Visible, I’m so sorry that your nephew is suffering like this. Being a teenager isn’t easy at the best of times, and no-one should have to suffer such needless persecution. I’m glad his family are obviously so supportive, but very very sad that he’s going through this. To **Debaser** , if you’re still reading, and anyone else who’s been silently agreeing, many people have put forward what seemed to me to be perfectly logical arguments, without any apparent success, so I’m going to ask you to think about it like this: You’re about to get married. I don’t know you or the future Mrs Debaser, so I have no idea why you’re getting married, but I’ll assume it’s not solely for the noble motive of procreation and the continuation of the human race. It _might_ be for the sake of those tax and other legal benefits you mentioned (and they aren’t just financial either - the right to be treated as next of kin if your beloved is in hospital and unable to make decisions for him or herself). I won’t follow this line of thought any further, because others have already made the point that if these benefits are going to exist, they should be available to all. On the other hand, it might be because you are very much in love with Mrs Debaser. You are intending to spend the rest of your life with her, because to you she is beautiful, special and amazing, your world would be a colder and darker place without her. If this is the case, I would ask you to sit down with your gay friend some time and ask him about the loves of his life. He may not have a partner at the moment, but I expect that at some point or another he has been in love. If you listen carefully, without judging his choices, you will find that his capacity to love, to find one particular person beautiful, special and amazing is every bit as great as yours, it simply extends towards a different gender. Deaf people can’t hear. A totally deaf person can read about the wonder of Bach, or Jimi Hendrix, but they won’t be able to experience it for themsleves. As you say, many deaf people have created communities for themselves, and consider their deafness to be a fundamental part of them. I’m sure there are experiences that a hearing person can’t appreciate that enrich the life of a deaf person, but there is also something fundamental that is unavailable to them. A gay person has just as much capacity for love as a straight person. I think the main hope most parents have for their children is that they will be happy. A gay person is every bit as capable of achieving happiness as a straight person, it is only the intolerance of certain people and communities that sometimes stand in the way of that. I strongly doubt Mr Visible’s nephew has any kind of coherent aganda. I imagine he just wants to be allowed to grow up in peace, maybe go to college, perhaps get a job, maybe even one where he doesn’t have to keep his private life totally secret from those around him and perhaps, one day find someone beautiful, special and amazing that he wants to spend the rest of his life with. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/165 "2003-11-14T18:35:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfstu \* > \*\*This site is back up. The memorial page to victims of anti-homosexual violence is [here](http://www.metrodemontreal.com/matt/gay/victims.html). > > The main page on about homosexuality is [here](http://www.metrodemontreal.com/matt/gay/index.html). I highly recommend it as reading to anyone who wants to learn the straight dope on ‘gay’. \*\* Oh, you flatterer! _flutters eyelashes, hides mouth with fan_ ---
**Author:** ![wolfstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wolfstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfstu)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/166 "2003-11-14T23:14:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jayjay \* > \*\*Heh. 😃 A Stick-Up is a small, round air freshener with an adhesive pad on the back. The Cubs locker room would be (I assume) a really smelly place. He’s comparing your (very eloquent, I’d like to note) posts to a breath of fresh air on a very old and nasty subject. > > I agree. \*\* Oh, okay. That’s a nice analogy… I was just tripped up on what a “Stick-Up” was. I was trying to figure out what sticks up in a locker room that this might be a euphemism for… or whether it was some kind of wild-west robbery, or the only Cub who would show outward support for his team or something. Heh. Thanks, then, for sure. > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by matt\_mcl_ > **Oh, you flatterer! _flutters eyelashes, hides mouth with fan_** No overture is more flattering than truth. (It helped me!) Actually, to be honest, you’ll notice I didn’t name you above… this is because, since it’s your personal website, I wasn’t sure if it would be in good form or not for me to give your name along with it. I guess I just thought it might be inappropriate to link to something potentially private without checking with the author. (Like someone might be unhappy about me linkng to their livejournal.) In the future, do you mind if I refer to it as **matt\_mcl** ’s website? ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/167 "2003-11-15T01:13:12Z")
Welp, I put it online so folks would read it. By all means, identify it however you would feel most comfortable. And it was an overture, was it? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/168 "2003-11-15T04:06:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Debaser \*\*\*Thus, IMHO, gay people have no choice about thier lifestyle. However, as science and technology advances someday we might have the option of fixing this defect. > \*\* And isn’t it wonderful that we have had researchers like Dr. Josef Mengele working on “cures” for this. (sigh) It’s so disheartening to try to deal with people like this, who clearly are decent people, and not the violent basher type. Yet it is their support, and their speaking & writing talents that create the atmosphere that allows the violent bashing types to continue their attacks. And they just don’t get what they are doing. I’m sure (based on reading his other posts) that Debaser did not intend to justify the actions of Dr. Mengele. But somehow he does not see that once he starts talking about some group of humans as “defective”, that a step has been taken along the path to extermination camps. The problem isn’t the real bad people; we can deal with them. The harder problem is the good people who stand by. ---
**Author:** ![GoHeels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b3f665/32.png) [@GoHeels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GoHeels)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/169 "2003-11-15T16:12:21Z")
I wish I had a huge, nation-wide loudspeaker, and I could proclaim across the land: LEAVE GAY PEOPLE ALONE!!! HAVEN’T THEY TAKEN ENOUGH SHIT ALREADY!!! **Mr. Visible** , I really hope things work out for your nephew. I have to admit that I have been guilty of letting a few gay slurs go by in my lifetime. It’s not that I was a homophobe, I just didn’t really give a damn about the subject. If it helps, I will say something (or at least give a dirty look) to the next person who says something ugly. ---
**Author:** ![MrVisible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@MrVisible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrVisible)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2003, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/170 "2003-11-15T17:26:28Z")
Thanks, **GoHeels**. That’d help a lot. ---
**Author:** ![nisosbar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c37758/32.png) [@nisosbar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nisosbar)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2003, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/171 "2003-11-16T20:59:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kalhoun \* > \*\*What happened to the kid? Can someone else, maybe non-family, take him in? I can’t imagine what happened that is literally running him out of town. \*\* Ryan White + Kokomo, Indiana = running someone out of town. ---
**Author:** ![MrVisible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@MrVisible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrVisible)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2003, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/172 "2003-11-16T22:05:05Z")
It’s still up in the air. We’re weighing a few options, none of which are particularly good. I’ll do my best to keep you posted. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2003, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/173 "2003-11-17T14:41:44Z")
Did anyone catch “Cold Case” last night? All you folks that think this sort of thing never really happens? Also, Grady…why don’t you take a look at the gaybashing thread if you want to see the reality of the problem from the actual victims account. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=135183&perpage=50&pagenumber=1](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=135183&perpage=50&pagenumber=1) ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2003, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/174 "2003-11-17T18:55:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mr. Moto \* > **I do not believe in gay or polygamous marriage. I think the distinctions between married and single life have been degraded to the point that divorce and single parenthood are far too commonplace. I do not think further destruction of these distinctions are good for society.** _looks at her parents, who were only married for 2 years before divorcing…_ _looks at heterosexual friends who were married less than a year before divorcing_ _looks at lesbian couple who has been together for the last 27 years_ _looks at father-in-law and his partner, who celebrated their 11th wedding_ anniversary this summer\* Please explain to me how they are “destroying” anything at all? Now, I’m not saying that homosexual marriages last longer than heterosexual marriages. All I’m saying is that homosexual marriages will have exactly jack shit to do with anything happening in heterosexual marriages. Either give the right to marry to everyone or pull the “legal” recognition of marriage altogether. I’m sorry, but I have listened–ok read–all of the arguments here and I still can’t see a person who is opposed to gay marriage as anything but a bigotted idiot. Emphasis on the idiot. Every argument I’ve heard is irrational and stupid. Homosexuality is such a stupid thing to be “against” in general. I mean it’s like being against people who don’t like goat cheese or something. It’s not something they chose, it doesn’t affect you in any way, it’s totally irrelevant… SO WHAT THE FUCK? I wish VisibleNephew all the best. \*yes, with a minister and everything. It isn’t recognized by the government, naturally, but it’s a real marriage in every real sense. ---
**Author:** ![Doobieous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/da6949/32.png) [@Doobieous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doobieous)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2003, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786/175 "2003-11-18T11:35:48Z")
Doobieous’ Gay Agenda ™: 1. Stop being treated as a second class citizen 2. Stop being possibly harassed, beaten, fired, jailed, denied rights others have, and most of all killed. 3. Treated with respect and dignity by the “religious” (of course there are many who do but i mean all of them 4. Able to “flaunt” my homosexuality as every single straight couple i know does. 5. Able to love whom i choose freely. 6. Able to gain the same rights any married couple gets (and lord knows how we homosexuals make a mockery of marriage when we have all of those lovely couples who divorce, and some who divorce MANY times) 7. Able to be who i AM, just as anyone else is. So there’s seven on my current agenda! Anyway, seriously, i feel sorry that your nephew has gone through what he has, Mr. Visible. I know that with an uncle like you he has at least one safety net to fall into who is looking out for him. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congratulations-straight-supremacists/212786.md?page=8)