# Congress throws the country under the bus. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 30, 2008, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780 "2008-09-30T00:17:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/21 "2008-09-30T02:46:09Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > The largest point drop in fucking history (if not the largest percentage) and these goat felchers are playing politics with people’s lives and pointing fingers at each other. Largest single one-day point drop on record: -777.68 points (29 September 2008) Overall percentage: -6.98% Largest single one-day percentage drop on record: -24.39% (12 December 1914) Largest single one-day percentage drop in modern times: -22.61% (19 October 1987) Source: [Track the proposal to bail out the struggling U.S. financial system - CNN.com](http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/09/25/economic.meltdown/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/22 "2008-09-30T02:48:47Z")
[QUOTE=The Second Stone] Get Dick Fucking Cheney on the phone to those Republicans to remind them that he is the shadow president for another four months and he will fuck them up. Shit, this is the end of modern civilization, and someone completely evil might come in handy to bust some heads. Never thought I’d ever have something useful to do with Cheney. [/QUOTE] It’s kind of a waste to even have Darth Vader on your team if he’s always in seclusion when he’s needed. ---
**Author:** ![atomicbadgerrace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e7dd6/32.png) [@atomicbadgerrace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/atomicbadgerrace)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/23 "2008-09-30T02:49:04Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Wow, sounds like librul elitism is contagious. > > Take two licks of Ann Coulter’s adam’s apple and call **elucidator** in the morning. > > -Joe I wouldn’t say it’s liberal elitism; I’ve seen it from both sides. Everyone’s in favor of people being educated and making the effort to understand what’s going on… and if you disagree, well then, you just _don’t understand! You don’t know what’s good for yourself_, so we’ll handle it. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/24 "2008-09-30T02:57:38Z")
> [@atomicbadgerrace](#): > > I wouldn’t say it’s liberal elitism; I’ve seen it from both sides. Everyone’s in favor of people being educated and making the effort to understand what’s going on… and if you disagree, well then, you just _don’t understand! You don’t know what’s good for yourself_, so we’ll handle it. My point being that the Evil Libruls are frequently accused of being a bunch of elitist snobs who look down on “the people” for being the lessers. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/25 "2008-09-30T03:38:59Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > It’s kind of a waste to even have Darth Vader on your team if he’s always in seclusion when he’s needed. He’s not on my team, but where the hell is the real president? ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/26 "2008-09-30T03:54:02Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > where the hell is the real president? He gave us a 13 minute speech on the emergency just the other night. What the hell more do you _want_!!! Being president is HARD WORK. Mr. Bush is working HARD!!! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/27 "2008-09-30T03:54:57Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > He gave us a 13 minute speech on the emergency just the other night. What the hell more do you _want_!!! > Being president is HARD WORK. Mr. Bush is working HARD!!! Bush is just a Cheney hand puppet. Where is the master of all evil? ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/28 "2008-09-30T04:37:11Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] He gave us a 13 minute speech on the emergency just the other night. What the hell more do you _want_!!! Being president is HARD WORK. Mr. Bush is working HARD!!! [/QUOTE] Almost in defense of Shrub–yeah, can’t believe I’m saying it either–anybody else get the impression everybody in Congress runs like hell in the opposite direction when they see him coming? The handy buzz word seems to be “distancing”, Republicans are _distancing_ themselves from him. Much more and they might just as well hang a leper’s bell from his neck and be done with it. “I’m not dead yet!”“Well you will be in a minute.” ---
**Author:** ![intention](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e95f7d/32.png) [@intention](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/intention)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/29 "2008-09-30T05:04:49Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Barney Frank is usually right, but not as right as he was this time. Get Dick Fucking Cheney on the phone to those Republicans to remind them that he is the shadow president for another four months and he will fuck them up. Shit, this is the end of modern civilization, and someone completely evil might come in handy to bust some heads. Never thought I’d ever have something useful to do with Cheney. Oh, please. Barney Frank is one of the people [responsible](http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2008/09/28/franks_fingerprints_are_all_over_the_financial_fiasco/) for getting us into the current situation … hard to see that giving him much moral high ground to say a damn thing. w. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/30 "2008-09-30T05:22:23Z")
Propriety, even in the Pit of the Damned, demands that if you offer an opinion piece as evidence of anything, you should at least blush. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/31 "2008-09-30T05:45:29Z")
> [@intention](#): > > Oh, please. Barney Frank is one of the people [responsible](http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2008/09/28/franks_fingerprints_are_all_over_the_financial_fiasco/) for getting us into the current situation … hard to see that giving him much moral high ground to say a damn thing. > > w. Well you have cited an op-ed columnist for a New York Times owned newspaper. I retract everything I have _ **ever** _ said and bow to the opinion of this complete stranger. ---
**Author:** ![intention](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e95f7d/32.png) [@intention](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/intention)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/32 "2008-09-30T07:17:27Z")
[QUOTE=The Second Stone;] Well you have cited an op-ed columnist for a New York Times owned newspaper. I retract everything I have _ **ever** _ said and bow to the opinion of this complete stranger. [/QUOTE] My goodness! Having a bad hair day, are we? No need to be gratuitously churlish, just provide your own citation showing how Barney was right on this whole mess. While we wait, here’s more, this one from from the LA Times. Another dread opinion piece, to be sure. > [@](#): > > On Sunday evening, Republican House Minority Leader John A. Boehner explained his considered opinion on the $700-billion Wall Street bailout plan: It’s a “crap sandwich,” he said, but he was going to eat it. > > Well, it turned out he couldn’t shove it down his colleagues’ throats. The bill failed on a bipartisan basis, but it was the Republicans who failed to deliver the votes they promised. Some complained that Democratic Speaker Nancy Pelosi drove some of them to switch their votes with her needlessly partisan floor speech on the subject. Of course Pelosi’s needlessly partisan. This is news? > > The Republican complaint is beyond childish. Democratic Rep. Barney Frank, a man saturated with guilt for this crisis, nonetheless was right to ridicule the GOP crybabies on Monday. “I’ll make an offer,” he added. “Give me [their] names and I will go talk uncharacteristically nicely to them and tell them what wonderful people they are and maybe they’ll now think about the country.” > > Would that Frank had been imbued with such a spirit earlier. Frank, chairman of the House Financial Services Committee, has spent the last few years ridiculing Alan Greenspan, John McCain and others who sought more regulation for Fannie Mae’s market-distorting schemes – the fons et origo of this financial crisis. Now he says “the private sector got us into this mess.” His partner in crime, Senate Banking Committee Chairman Christopher J. Dodd (D-Conn.), a chief beneficiary of Fannie Mae lobbyists’ largesse, claims this mess is the result of poor oversight – without even hinting at the fact he is in charge of oversight of banks. They sound like pimps complaining about the prevalence of STDs among prostitutes. In our system of government, we have special organizations whose sole purpose is to keep us from getting into these kinds of messes. Among them is the US House of Representatives Financial Services Committee. From their web site, under “Who We Are”: > [@](#): > > **Barney Frank (MA),** Chairman of the Financial Services Committee > > The Committee oversees all components of the nation’s housing and financial services sectors including banking, insurance, real estate, public and assisted housing, and securities. The Committee continually reviews the laws and programs relating to the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development, the Federal Reserve Bank, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, and international development and finance agencies such as the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund. Barney is in charge of the House Committee who is supposed to keep Fannie and Freddy healthy … clearly, he’s been doing a bang-up job of that. In 2003, the Bush Administration (which I loath and despise) actually tried to tighten up the regs on F&F. Who opposed them? Barney Frank. Now prior to that, of course, was the disastrous Republican disembowelling of the Depression-Era legislation separating merchant banks and investment banks, and Phil Gramm’s deregulation of swaps and derivatives that led to Enron, and McCain’s backing of the Keating Five, so there’s plenty of blame to go around. I’m not taking a party political side here. What I am saying is that Barney was in charge of the patients, and they currently are in intensive care … so I still don’t see that he has any high moral ground here. I also don’t see any reason for your attempt to ridicule me. If you feel my citation is inadequate, just ask for another. And to return to the OP, Congress has been throwing us under the bus for a while now. Chris Dodd and Barney Frank are awash in lobbyist money, Phil Gramm is McCain’s main man (yeah, right, he resigned or something … riiiight), Clinton’s push for greater house ownership succumbed to the law of unintended consequences, life goes on … Bottom line? Barney Frank was in charge of making sure this didn’t happen to Fannie and Freddie, and he failed miserably. He claimed they were solvent, and he opposed regulations to improve their fiscal position. Bad politician, no cookies. w. PS - I make a point to read commentators on both sides of the aisle. One of the reasons I enjoy reading Jacoby is that his articles are so well cited. I went back and looked. The piece I referred to contains 11 different citations, which on my planet makes it a bit more than an “op-ed piece”. Yes, they are generally citations to conservative publications … but then liberal commentators tend to link to liberal publications, so we’re not surprised. ---
**Author:** ![MsAnneThrope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3d9bf3/32.png) [@MsAnneThrope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsAnneThrope)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/33 "2008-09-30T07:48:05Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > What a bunch of self-serving cocksuckers these people are. The deal was done, they were on board to pass it, then harpy-in-charge Pelosi gives the Republicans a gratuitous lecture about how fucked up George Bush is, and they retaliate by tanking the vote. In the meantime, McCain’t once again steps on his dick by prematurely taking credit for making sure the bailout succeeded, which just proves that his “trip” to WDC was a sham designed to make him look like a knight to the rescue. I can’t figure out who is the bigger fuck-up in this whole scenario, but I can tell you who gets thrown off the cliff: all of us. What a bunch of stupid motherfuckering inbred droolers. The largest point drop in fucking history (if not the largest percentage) and these goat felchers are playing politics with people’s lives and pointing fingers at each other. I would at least like to get a reach-around while being fucked up the ass. People concerned with their own agenda don’t do reach-arounds. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/34 "2008-09-30T07:59:25Z")
Two realy good alternatives here. One, post the opinion piece, identify it _as such_, and say something like “Here’s this guys opinion, which is very much like my own, but he says it purty.” That’s cool. Or if you have the original, with all those tasty citations, bring that. We can take it. We like that, we’re a bunch of cite-seers. But posting an opinion piece as though it were evidence by itself, well, not the done thing, don’t you know? ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/35 "2008-09-30T08:37:07Z")
One figure I heard tossed about tonight was that the stock market lost 1.5 trillion yesterday when it fell 777 points. That’s half again as much as the bail-out investment would have cost. The House apparently won’t be back in session until Thursday because of religious holidays. The fiddler is on the roof while Rome burns. (No disrespect intended. I just think they ought to close Wall Street for the holidays.) I read tonight that I am greedy because I have money in the stock market. So you guys are going to chip in to pay the $3,000 a month it will cost me for a room in assisted care? I should live another 30 years. My mother’s still going at 95 – the greedy thing. I’m taking names and I’ll remember who the sleeze balls are when the revolution comes. Anybody want to buy some apples? ---
**Author:** ![R.P.McMurphy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7993a0/32.png) [@R.P.McMurphy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R.P.McMurphy)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/36 "2008-09-30T08:47:56Z")
> [@intention](#): > > Oh, please. Barney Frank is one of the people [responsible](http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2008/09/28/franks_fingerprints_are_all_over_the_financial_fiasco/) for getting us into the current situation … hard to see that giving him much moral high ground to say a damn thing. > > w. That article is BS beyond belief. This crap has already been discussed on the SDMB. It wasn’t the “urban poor” that were flipping condo’s in California, Las Vegas and Florida. It wasn’t the disenfranchised that were taking out second and third mortgages to pay their credit card bills to buy a new Escalade. It was the “poor” that were getting sold the idea that they could own their own home with no money down, low monthly payments and an ARM that would make their dream unaffordable as soon as the mortgage rates moved up 1/2 point. The lowlifes that continually blame the poor for the fouling of their own nest are the ones that should be in prison and shot. ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 9:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/37 "2008-09-30T09:50:39Z")
I’ll be the dissenting voice and say that I’m glad that the bailout proposal was rejected by the House. I think that it gave too much power to the Treasury secretary. I think that a decision this momentous needs more debate than the few days that Congress has taken before voting on it. For one thing, I remember when Congress gave carte blanche to the current administration for the situation in Iraq. Well, it turns out that they either lied or acted on erroneous information in invading that country. This current administration has also shown that they are willing to act with the maximum amount of leeway that any law can give them. So I think that the powers given to the executive branch should be limited as much as possible, because I am confident that in any case they will do their best to interpret the law in such a way as to exceed its intent. In short, give them an inch if you want them to use a mile. Give them a mile… Things I don’t like about the bill the way it was yesterday: Didn’t include any changes in bankruptcy laws as they applied to mortgages, to allow judges to adjust mortgage loans on a principal residence (L.A. times story here [No bankruptcy aid for homeowners](http://www.latimes.com/business/investing/la-fi-scrub29-2008sep29,0,2890645.story) ) The first $250 billion is immediately available, and simply requires the President to ask for more to get the next $150 billion; the final $350 billion comes automatically unless Congress votes against it. I think that the next sums should also be subject to Congressional approval. (see some other concerns in this LA Times article [http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-fi-assess29-2008sep29,0,2859697,full.story](http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-fi-assess29-2008sep29,0,2859697,full.story) ) Those are just two examples. In general, I think the law is being rushed through too quickly. I read a quote from Paulson saying that the administration has been working on this plan for a month. If this is true, then the past month was when it needed to be reviewed by Congress, not at the last minute screaming “sign this now! or else we’re all DOOOMED!” That worked after 9/11, I hope it won’t happen again. Fool me once… ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/38 "2008-09-30T10:21:12Z")
I used to dislike American politicians. Now I fucking hate them. Democrat assholes: “ooh, we shouldn’t give money to rich people”. Republican assholes: “ooh, it’s Socialism”. Look you fucking penises, it goes against all my principles too, but the fucking world is about to be fucking fucked! Fuck your principles, people, and who gives a shit whose fault it is. This is a global fucking crisis! It’s going to take the West down, not just your domestic constituents. Seen what’s happening in European and Asian markets today? Just wait until Wall Street opens. Jesus fuck. Thanks, you bunch of cunts. You’re also destroying your own economic hegemony. I’m signing up for Mandarin classes, stat. ---
**Author:** ![Ale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Ale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ale)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/39 "2008-09-30T11:29:47Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > It’s going to take the West down, not just your domestic constituents. > > Seen what’s happening in European and Asian markets today? > > Just wait until Wall Street opens. > > Jesus fuck. > > Thanks, you bunch of cunts. > > You’re also destroying your own economic hegemony. > > I’m signing up for Mandarin classes, stat. Let me add my voice to this chorus. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2008, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780/40 "2008-09-30T11:59:55Z")
Yeah, it sucks. Everyone should have taken a bite out of it but “The Party of Responsibility” is the biggest lie the Republicans spin. The Democrats have the votes. Draft a new bill with protections for taxpayers, no golden parachutes and tons and tons of oversight. Plus a tight-fisted review of who gets what money. Then ram that fucker through. It’s not gonna happen, though. Loading up my Joad-mobile and stuffing my mattress as we speak. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/congress-throws-the-country-under-the-bus/465780.md?page=3)