Ma just doesn’t get it:
“She may not be able to have children after this, because it affects everything in your body,” her mother, Jackie Fortin, said…
Kind of like death does, innit? Especially in the precluding-having-children department.
Hell of a tough call, forcing chemo on someone, but mother and child are clearly clueless, not to say incompetent. At least there’s a good chance the kid will live, and hopefully find a better mentor than her mom has been.
I’m talking about the mood disorder of depression, not just “she’s feeling depressed”. If she were diagnosed, I think the appropriate action would be to force treatment, since a clinically depressed person is at a much higher risk of self-harm.
So am I, see: Depressive Disorder due to Another Medical Condition on that same page about mood disorders.
Do I have this right?
If she wants to refuse to be treated for cancer she can unless she’s diagnosed with depression in which case we can force her to get treated, which can be extremely unpleasant, since a clinically depressed person is at a much higher risk of self-harm. Once she’s not depressed she can refuse to be treated for cancer and die . . . are you familiar with Catch-22?
For the Young 'uns,
Yossarian: Is Orr crazy?
‘Doc’ Daneeka: Of course he is. He has to be crazy to keep flying after all the close calls he’s had.
Yossarian: Why can’t you ground him?
‘Doc’ Daneeka: I can, but first he has to ask me.
Yossarian: That’s all he’s gotta do to be grounded?
‘Doc’ Daneeka: That’s all.
Yossarian: Then you can ground him?
‘Doc’ Daneeka: No. Then I cannot ground him.
Yossarian: Aah!
‘Doc’ Daneeka: There’s a CATCH?
Yossarian: A catch?
‘Doc’ Daneeka: Sure. Catch-22. Anyone who wants to get out of combat isn’t really crazy, so I can’t ground him.
Yossarian: Ok, let me see if I’ve got this straight. In order to be grounded, I’ve got to be crazy. And I must be crazy to keep flying. But if I ask to be grounded, that means I’m not crazy anymore, and I have to keep flying.
‘Doc’ Daneeka: You got it, that’s Catch-22.
Yossarian: Whoo… That’s some catch, that Catch-22.
‘Doc’ Daneeka: It’s the best there is.
CMC fnord!
No, you don’t have it right – if she’s diagnosed as clinically depressed, I have no problem with the state forcing her to get treatment, for both depression and cancer. If she’s not depressed, I believe it’s wrong for the state to force her to experience what might amount to a torturous treatment regimen.
I don’t believe a depressed person fits the “of sound mind” requirement for consent.
That one I will disagree with. A mood disorder, in and of itself, is not life-threatening. A mood disorder COMBINED WITH other factors (credible threats of self-harm, e.g.) may be enough to force treatment, but the mere existence of that diagnosis should not.
(In fact, one of my doctors once told me that truly severe depression rarely results in self-harm; somebody at that point typically lacks the energy and motivation to get out of bed, much less devise and implement a plan. It is people who are depressed but not at the bottom who still have the ability to do something bad.)
There are plenty of things people do that result in self-harm, from smoking to consuming a steady diet of Twinkies and beer. Only when the risk is extremely high and imminent should society step in.
In Cassandra’s case, of course, both “extremely high risk” and “imminent” apply.
I’m only talking about Cassandra’s case, not the case of a random (physically) healthy person who is depressed.
Ok, I (mis)understood you to be making a more generalized argument. Sorry.
:rolleyes:
I happen to know from personal experience that it is not necessary to have children in order to have a good, happy, and worthwhile life.
Death is preferable to sterility, really?
:rolleyes: