# Conservatives: Does it piss you off that Rush's asinine approach is discrediting a valid point? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 11, 2012, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496 "2012-03-11T22:00:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/1 "2012-03-11T22:00:57Z")
Are there any conservatives (or even non-conservatives) that think that Rush Limbaugh’s underlying point about insurance coverage of birth control is valid, but he is discrediting the whole argument by his asinine approach of ugly personal attacks? ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/2 "2012-03-11T22:04:16Z")
I get the impression that among his audience, his style does not discredit whatever point he’s making. Outside his audience, it does. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/3 "2012-03-11T22:05:31Z")
Fixed the typo in the thread title, although I had to reword it to make the edit fit because of the length. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/4 "2012-03-11T22:43:15Z")
Not really, no. I’m a practical person when it comes to government policy, before anything else. I don’t feel women have a right to publicly funded contraception, but I think providing as many contraception options as possible combined with education about the use of contraceptives is good public policy. I feel this way for the same reason Richard Nixon did (the President who started Federal funding for Planned Parenthood): It decreases the number of poor people being born. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/5 "2012-03-11T22:47:14Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > Not really, no. I’m a practical person when it comes to government policy, before anything else. I don’t feel women have a right to publicly funded contraception, but I think providing as many contraception options as possible combined with education about the use of contraceptives is good public policy. I feel this way for the same reason Richard Nixon did (the President who started Federal funding for Planned Parenthood): > > It decreases the number of poor people being born. Pretty much this (although I support this more to reduce abortions than to “decrease the number of poor people”). People don’t have a natural/God-given right to social security, welfare, jobs, unemployment benefits, education, Internet, etc. but if not everyone can have it and it hurts the people, than the government can provide minimal coverage-not as a _right_ but as a _privilege_. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/6 "2012-03-11T23:06:01Z")
There may be good arguments against the gov’ts contraception policy, but I don’t think Rush was making them, underlying or otherwise. Even aside from the “slut” comments, his rant was pretty incoherent. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/7 "2012-03-11T23:07:45Z")
Why is public funding always insinuated into discussions on this subject? ---
**Author:** ![Condescending\_Robot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a183cd/32.png) [@Condescending\_Robot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Condescending_Robot)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/8 "2012-03-11T23:10:26Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Why is public funding always insinuated into discussions on this subject? So conservatives who are smart enough to avoid yelling “slut” on the radio can tapdance around the fact that their real objection to contraception is rooted in psychotic attitudes towards women. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/9 "2012-03-11T23:14:30Z")
> [@Condescending\_Robot](#): > > So conservatives who are smart enough to avoid yelling “slut” on the radio can tapdance around the fact that their real objection to contraception is rooted in psychotic attitudes towards women. No. I have no problems with legalizing contraception. After all Ayn Rand certainly wouldn’t mind contraception but she would have objected to the idea of government paying for it. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/10 "2012-03-11T23:16:47Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > No. I have no problems with legalizing contraception. After all Ayn Rand certainly wouldn’t mind contraception but she would have objected to the idea of government paying for it. I think the point they’re making is that Sandra Fluke’s original testimony wasn’t about government paying for contraception at all. It was about a private university that she attended not being required to provide contraception for the students it was supposed to be caring for the health of. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/11 "2012-03-11T23:19:20Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Why is public funding always insinuated into discussions on this subject? Or that anyone was _ever_ insisting upon “natural/God-given” rights, for that matter. Limbaugh’s discourse was so obfuscating (as usual) of any point at all that even if I were a conservative, I’d be hard pressed to identify it. Which valid point from Limbaugh does the OP theoretically posit? ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/12 "2012-03-11T23:20:37Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I think the point they’re making is that Sandra Fluke’s original testimony wasn’t about government paying for contraception at all. It was about a private university that she attended not being required to provide contraception for the students it was supposed to be caring for the health of. I stand corrected. I should have said to the idea of government mandating employers to provide specific types of coverage in their health care plan. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/13 "2012-03-11T23:25:28Z")
To the OP: Yes, it does; because we end up discussing Rush and dittoheads and Foxnews and not the real issue. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/14 "2012-03-11T23:31:04Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I think the point they’re making is that Sandra Fluke’s original testimony wasn’t about government paying for contraception at all. It was about a private university that she attended not being required to provide contraception for the students it was supposed to be caring for the health of. A private religious-affiliated university being required to provide contraception in spite of that religion’s convictions to the contrary. And to the OP, yes indeed, it does piss me off that Rush’s bloviation played right into President Obama & Friends’ hands. Rush could have given a jolly & cogent ribbing of the entitlement felt by a privileged 30-year old woman but he decided to get down & dirty. He deserves everything he’s getting. However, in the long run, he’ll be fine, but now the cause he purported to represent is pretty much sullied. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/15 "2012-03-11T23:36:04Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > I stand corrected. I should have said to the idea of government mandating employers to provide specific types of coverage in their health care plan. Health insurance is just another form of compensation. Are you against mandatory minimum wages? Mandatory overtime pay? There is ample precedent for government mandates over employee compensation. ---
**Author:** ![thelabdude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dc4da7/32.png) [@thelabdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelabdude)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/16 "2012-03-11T23:47:21Z")
Yes. I have long felt that weak arguments weaken strong positions. If you have a good argument, using weak ones makes it look like you don’t. Is his birth certificate the best argument against Obama? Rush blew it and weakened the fight against people not believing in birth control having to support it. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/17 "2012-03-11T23:48:27Z")
> [@](#): > > It decreases the number of poor people being born. Big government isn’t a problem as long as they’re performing a real social service. First step, [abortion](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie_Stopes#Advocacy_of_eugenics), second, [sterilisation](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsory_sterilization#United_States), third, [moral objectivism](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/06/02/981501/-Ayn-Rand,-Eugenics,-and-Lesser-Breeds). It’s strange how the party of [individualism](http://aleph0.clarku.edu/huxley/CE9/CaML.html) rejects Darwin, but Malthus [only sometimes](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8wnyIcpisE)… If I were a Republican, I’d hold that Rush was being paid an incredible amount by the Democratic party to deflect reasoned debate on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2012, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/18 "2012-03-12T01:03:56Z")
Does it bother anyone that Sandra Fluke’s point about contraception being a medical treatment for conditions other than preventing pregnancy has been overshadowed by Rush’s asinine approach? > [@Sandra Fluke](#): > > These denials of contraceptive coverage impact real people. In the worst cases, women who need this medication for other medical reasons suffer dire consequences. A friend of mine, for example, has polycystic ovarian syndrome and has to take prescription birth control to stop cysts from growing on her ovaries. Her prescription is technically covered by Georgetown insurance because it’s not intended to prevent pregnancy. At many schools, it wouldn’t be, and under Senator Blunt’s amendment, Senator Rubio’s bill, or Representative Fortenberry’s bill, there’s no requirement that an exception be made for medical needs. When they do exist, these exceptions don’t accomplish their well-intended goals because when you let university administrators or other employers, rather than women and their doctors, dictate whose medical needs are good enough and whose aren’t, a woman’s health takes a back seat to a bureaucracy focused on policing her body. > > In sixty-five percent of cases, our female students were interrogated by insurance representatives and university staff about why they need these prescriptions and whether they’re lying about their symptoms. For my friend, and 20% of women in her situation, she never got the insurance company to cover her prescription, despite verification of her illness from her doctor. Her claim was denied repeatedly on the assumption that she really wanted the birth control to prevent pregnancy. [Sandra Fluke’s testimony before Congress](http://democrats.oversight.house.gov/images/stories/Testimony_-_Sandra_Fluke.pdf) What exactly was Rush’s valid point about this anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2012, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/19 "2012-03-12T01:19:18Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > To the OP: Yes, it does; because we end up discussing Rush and dittoheads and Foxnews and not the real issue. I do believe the OP gets to decide what he wants to talk about when it come to the subject of his own thread, notwithstanding the efforts of most of the conservatives in this thread to try to change the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2012, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496/20 "2012-03-12T01:22:08Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > I stand corrected. I should have said to the idea of government mandating employers to provide specific types of coverage in their health care plan. And what does this(and your previous post) have to do with Rush’s effect on the debate? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/conservatives-does-it-piss-you-off-that-rushs-asinine-approach-is-discrediting-a-valid-point/615496.md?page=2)