# Contractions: can't we all agree the apostrophe needs to be retired? \[Edited\] **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 12, 2014, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378 "2014-08-12T16:45:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/21 "2014-08-12T17:38:56Z")
> [@Blaster\_Master](#): > > Worse though, the apostraphe will still be needed in some situations, notably for possessives. That’s quite common usage, and while it can probably be sussed out from context, it seems like unnecessary effort, and we’ll definitely have ambiguity when dealing with plural possessives. If we’re going to keep it for this purpose, why not keep it for contractions? You could, if you wanted write possessives in english without apostrophes although it would be slightly annoying to always write out things like “the mailbox of Smith”, but if spanish can do it, I’m sure we’d survive. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/22 "2014-08-12T17:47:48Z")
I know the English language changes slowly. We’re stuck with apostrophes for at least another generation. I noticed just now the Oxford dictionary still has outdated rules for compound adjectives. I never see hyphens used in sugar free, accident prone, fair haired etc. The Oxford is way out of date trying to force hyphens into those phrases. ---
**Author:** ![LC\_Strawhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@LC\_Strawhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LC_Strawhouse)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/23 "2014-08-12T17:54:33Z")
I dare you to go to Ireland and tell every O’Brien and O’Neill you meet that their name is getting retired. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Unwashed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_great_unwashed/32/4791_2.png) [@The\_Great\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/24 "2014-08-12T18:01:26Z")
Letsgetridoffspacestoo.Spacesdonothingexceptgetinthewayofonewordmeetingwithanother.Plusmyspacebarisbroken. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Unwashed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_great_unwashed/32/4791_2.png) [@The\_Great\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/25 "2014-08-12T18:02:41Z")
> [@LC\_Strawhouse](#): > > I dare you to go to Ireland and tell every O’Brien and O’Neill you meet that their name is getting retired. 😃 WhynotObamadidit? ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/26 "2014-08-12T18:08:54Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > That’s exactly the point I’m making. We’re all trapped typing these useless apostrophes hundreds of times a day because of outdated grammar rules. No one wants to appear illiterate. > > Modify the rules. Make the apostrophe optional. I’d be willing to bet in twenty years the majority of the younger generation won’t be using them. > > Look! I had to type four apostrophes in just this one tiny posting. I know this is a joke thread, but your premise is flawed: the apostrophe for contractions is not an outdated grammar rule. The younger generation is, by and large, doomed to spelling words incorrectly, and to not giving a royal shit whether or not it’s “skills” or “skilz”. It doesn’t mean that all of us have to look like utter fools. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/27 "2014-08-12T18:17:26Z")
If the apostrophe is going to be used as a standard and mandatory orthographic “letter” in the English alphabet, they could have at least put it with all the the other letters on they keyboard, instead of making touch typists stop and look for its currently fashionable position. When I learned typing, it was Shift-8. And it wasnt even an apostrophe then, it was a dual purpose right and left single quotation mark. I quit using them a long time ago, unless my writing needed to be recognized as formal by pedants. If I write shouldnt or dont and you have no idea what Im talking about, youre not going to understand anything else I say, either. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/28 "2014-08-12T18:23:24Z")
I never judge anyone’s writing on the SDMB. I assume they are rushed just like me. I often post during short breaks during my day. There’s no time for editing or proofreading. I do enough proofreading for memos and support documentation I get \*paid \* to write at work. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/29 "2014-08-12T18:25:51Z")
> [@CT\_Damsel](#): > > I do not use contractions. I can not abide them. However; I will not mind if you drop the ’ 😃 Isn’t cannot one word? Both ways are equally correct, but I see cannot used more frequently. ---
**Author:** ![74westy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/74westy/32/3950_2.png) [@74westy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/74westy)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/30 "2014-08-12T18:28:24Z")
In a text message? Sure - why go to the extra effort? But, for example, a message board post will be read many more times than it will be written. In that case, why make it easier for the writer by making it harder for the reader(s). ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/31 "2014-08-12T18:32:47Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > If you can’t figure out which one is meant in the sentence “I won’t abide you speaking that thieves’ cant in my house.” the apostrophe is not going to save you. _“I won’t abide you speaking that, thieves! Can’t in MY house!”_ 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/32 "2014-08-12T19:20:40Z")
> [@cochrane](#): > > Isn’t cannot one word? Both ways are equally correct, but I see cannot used more frequently. Shouldn’t you write it like this: Both ways are equally correct, but I see “cannot” used more frequently. ---
**Author:** ![DChord568](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@DChord568](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DChord568)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/33 "2014-08-12T19:46:30Z")
My heart bleeds for the poor souls who have to type all those extra keystrokes! Personally, I’ve never found it a burden to do so, and I have never once felt the need to resort to text-speak in texts, instant messages or emails. My boss, on the other hand, is untroubled by writing “I hope ur happy with the proposal” in an email to the president of a company we’re pitching. Great idea, that…I’m sure he is greatly impressed knowing that the head of our firm talks like a Valley Girl. But look…he’s saved four whole keystrokes! I’m with the others…never give in to the barbarians at the gate. The English language, despite its occasional frustrations, is a beautiful vehicle for conveying thought. If it takes a few extra keystrokes for the sake of it doing so clearly and unambiguously, it’s an effort I’m more than willing to make. ---
**Author:** ![DChord568](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@DChord568](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DChord568)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/34 "2014-08-12T19:50:51Z")
> [@74westy](#): > > In a text message? Sure - why go to the extra effort? But, for example, a message board post will be read many more times than it will be written. In that case, why make it easier for the writer by making it harder for the reader(s). This. And I may be in a dwindling minority, but I absolutely assess the intelligence of a poster based on how he or she writes. Anyone can make a typo from time to time, but consistent misspellings, poor grammar and generally shoddy writing inevitably get in the way of the ideas expressed, no matter how worthy they may be, and make me think less of the writer. No apologies for this. If you don’t care enough to write reasonably well, it says to me that you don’t care much about anything else. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/35 "2014-08-12T19:55:40Z")
> [@DChord568](#): > > This. > > And I may be in a dwindling minority, but I absolutely assess the intelligence of a poster based on how he or she writes. Anyone can make a typo from time to time, but consistent misspellings, poor grammar and generally shoddy writing inevitably get in the way of the ideas expressed, no matter how worthy they may be, and make me think less of the writer… Ah, so Shakespeare had poor intelligence since his spelling was terrible?:rolleyes: And some of us use some deliberate “error” as we want the language to change for the better. For example, I dont like apostrophes much, I think “tho” is better than “though” and “an” is stupid, just use “a”. But grammar nazi’s refuse to let the language evolve. ---
**Author:** ![DChord568](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@DChord568](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DChord568)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/36 "2014-08-12T19:56:34Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I noticed just now the Oxford dictionary still has outdated rules for compound adjectives. I never see hyphens used in sugar free, accident prone, fair haired etc. The Oxford is way out of date trying to force hyphens into those phrases. I strongly disagree. What is your cite for the notion that using hyphens in compound adjectives is “outdated”? If you never see hyphens in the phrases you list, then you’re seeing some piss-poor writing. I’ve seen myriad examples of the absence of hyphens in such phrases leading to stumbling and confusion. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/37 "2014-08-12T19:58:24Z")
> [@DChord568](#): > > I’ve seen myriad examples of the absence of hyphens in such phrases leading to stumbling and confusion. Really, you have \* ten thousand\* examples? :dubious: _Literally_, I suppose? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/38 "2014-08-12T20:10:11Z")
> [@DChord568](#): > > I’m with the others…never give in to the barbarians at the gate. The English language, despite its occasional frustrations, is a beautiful vehicle for conveying thought. If it takes a few extra keystrokes for the sake of it doing so clearly and unambiguously, it’s an effort I’m more than willing to make. Hilarious. ---
**Author:** ![DChord568](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@DChord568](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DChord568)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/39 "2014-08-12T20:12:12Z")
(I’m taking a considerable leap and responding to this post as if the poster is serious and not pulling our legs. If I’ve been wooshed, then, woohoo, you got me!) > [@DrDeth](#): > > Ah, so Shakespeare had poor intelligence since his spelling was terrible?:rolleyes: Where exactly do you get this idea? Spelling was all over the place in Shakespeare’s day. The fact that he himself spelled his own name several different ways is testimony to this. According to Wikipedia, “It was not until Samuel Johnson’s _A Dictionary of the English Language_ (1755) that a truly noteworthy, reliable English Dictionary was deemed to have been produced.” So there was no particular standard of spelling for Shakespeare to aspire to during his lifetime. > [@](#): > > And some of us use some deliberate “error” as we want the language to change for the better. Ooh, what a rebel! How did it go for you when you used this approach in writing a cover letter and résumé for that job you went after? > [@](#): > > For example, I dont like apostrophes much, I think “tho” is better than “though”… A newspaper (I seem to recall it was a Chicago one, but I’m not sure) that wanted to try your same force-feeding approach adopted this tactic this in the early part of the 20th century, but abandoned it after a short period of time. Guess it didn’t catch on. > [@](#): > > …and “an” is stupid, just use “a”. Great idea, but help me out here…how exactly am I supposed to say (as opposed to write) “I really think you’re a asshole”? (Nothing personal; just the first example that came to mind!) > [@](#): > > But grammar **nazi’s** refuse to let the language evolve. Now I don’t know whether this was intentional or just you being you. Doesn’t seem to square very well with your great hunger for using fewer keystrokes. ---
**Author:** ![DChord568](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@DChord568](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DChord568)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2014, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378/40 "2014-08-12T20:14:49Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Really, you have \* ten thousand\* examples? :dubious:_Literally_, I suppose? If you think you’re making some real gotcha point here…sorry, but you lose. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/contractions-cant-we-all-agree-the-apostrophe-needs-to-be-retired-edited/695378.md?page=3)