# Controversial encounters between law-enforcement and civilians - the omnibus thread #2 **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 23, 2020, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531 "2020-06-23T20:29:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 128
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2548 "2022-04-26T14:03:49Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > He wasn’t trying to control the situation, he was trying to dominate another person and assert his authority In other words, he was an American cop. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2549 "2022-04-26T14:14:32Z")
Right, as I said, he was selected due to his personality, and followed the training and culture he was given. The problem is not _this_ cop, though obviously the problem in this situation was this cop. The problem is the entire culture of policing here in America, where the goal is not to serve the public, but to terrorize it into compliance. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2550 "2022-04-26T14:48:42Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > The problem is the entire culture of policing here in America, where the goal is not to serve the public, but to terrorize it into compliance. Well, they only terrorize the _wrong kind_ of people. If you appear at a glance to be the right kind of people, they will be reluctant to terrorize you. I mean, look at all the good upstanding officers who showed up at the Capitol to re-educate those people who had voted for the wrong person. ---
**Author:** ![PackerMan2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/packerman2/32/2894_2.png) [@PackerMan2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PackerMan2)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2551 "2022-04-26T15:03:45Z")
Maybe take a step back and ask why he was being detained. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2552 "2022-04-26T17:42:41Z")
Does that justify assault? ---
**Author:** ![excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e8c25b/32.png) [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/excavating_for_a_mind)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2553 "2022-04-26T17:45:48Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > Cops are trained to maintain control of the situation, which includes not letting a detainee escape. I think this is the problem. Training. Cops are trained that allowing a detainee escape is considerably worse than killing a detainee. That is a problem. Particularly if they have a positive ID on the detainee. If they know who the detainee is, deadly force is not needed to force compliance. IMO, the cops should be taught to first obtain a positive ID on the individual, then take actions as needed to deescalate, calling in backup as needed. I get the impression that many cops are afraid of being thought of as wimps if they cannot handle a disruptive detainee single-handedly, and the downside of being considered a wimp is much worse than killing the people you are charge with protecting. If I were King, I would mandate that any cop who discharged his firearm while on duty would not be allowed to carry a gun in the line of duty. Sure, there are times when a cop needs the ability to defend himself and the public, which is why we give them guns. But, such a small percentage of cops actually fire their weapon during their career, and firing a deadly weapon at another human has to take a mental toll on the cop, that such a rule would not be a punishment, but rather, a reward and acknowledgment that the force is not going to put such an officer in that position, again. I also believe there should be a national (or at least, state) license for LEOs. I mean, most states license the people who cut your hair. I do think that accountability and verification of training is more important for a LEO than for a cosmologist. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2554 "2022-04-26T17:52:10Z")
> [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](#): > > I do think that accountability and verification of training is more important for a LEO than for a cosmologist. Maybe you’re more comfortable consulting an unlicensed scientist who studies the universe than I am. :shudder: 😉 ---
**Author:** ![PackerMan2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/packerman2/32/2894_2.png) [@PackerMan2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PackerMan2)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2555 "2022-04-26T18:03:34Z")
I’m saying that the cop should not have escalated the situation and attempted to detain him. When Madison Cawthorne was pulled over multiple times without a valid drivers license was he ever detained? I wonder what the difference was? hmmm… ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2556 "2022-04-26T18:25:22Z")
> [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](#): > > If I were King, I would mandate that any cop who discharged his firearm while on duty would not be allowed to carry a gun in the line of duty. I’ve expressed the same sentiment. If you kill someone while on duty, you’re either a hero or a murderer. If you are a hero, then I certainly wouldn’t want to put you in a position where you would have to end another life, so retirement with full benefits for you. If you are a murderer, you retire as well, with your lifetime of room and board provided by the state. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2022, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2557 "2022-04-26T18:38:55Z")
Imagine if the police were required to have a \>C average 4-year BA, with broadly specific coursework. If nothing else, I bet that would go a long way toward publically funded K-16. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2022, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2558 "2022-04-27T00:00:12Z")
Fuck this fucking guy. [In brazen attack on press, Villanueva investigates Times reporter who revealed cover-up (msn.com)](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/in-brazen-attack-on-press-villanueva-investigates-times-reporter-who-revealed-cover-up/ar-AAWD5lv?ocid=entnewsntp&cvid=08acbb3bdd06487eb6312be902ae65b8) For those unfamiliar. The L.A. Sheriff’s office is only _slightly_ less thuggish and brutal as MS13. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2022, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2559 "2022-04-27T00:10:00Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > Fuck this fucking guy. > > [In brazen attack on press, Villanueva investigates Times reporter who revealed cover-up (msn.com)](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/in-brazen-attack-on-press-villanueva-investigates-times-reporter-who-revealed-cover-up/ar-AAWD5lv?ocid=entnewsntp&cvid=08acbb3bdd06487eb6312be902ae65b8) > > For those unfamiliar. The L.A. Sheriff’s office is only _slightly_ less thuggish and brutal as MS13 Was looking for this thread to post the same story, directly from the LA Times: > **[Villanueva backs off investigation of Times reporter who revealed cover-up](https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2022-04-26/los-angeles-sheriff-villanueva-times-reporter-under-investigation-coverup)** > > Sheriff Villanueva announces criminal investigation of Times journalist who revealed an incident in which a deputy kneeled on the head of an inmate. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2022, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2560 "2022-04-27T18:38:44Z")
Fuck all these guys too: [https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/minneapolis-police-engage-in-a-pattern-or-practice-of-race-discrimination-minnesota-human-rights-department-says/ar-AAWFiCC?cvid=fd81645c89c145238d605ac848ce20ca](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/minneapolis-police-engage-in-a-pattern-or-practice-of-race-discrimination-minnesota-human-rights-department-says/ar-AAWFiCC?cvid=fd81645c89c145238d605ac848ce20ca) Obvious racsim: > The report paints a damning picture of policing in Minneapolis, where according to Lucero Black residents represent about 19% of the population yet 78% of all police searches from 2017 to 2020 involved Black residents and their vehicles. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2022, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2561 "2022-04-27T22:21:25Z")
Former Boston police union president charged with multiple counts of rape of children. > **[‘Monstrous, Monstrous Acts': Ex-Boston Police Union President Pleads Guilty...](https://www.nbcboston.com/news/local/ex-boston-police-union-president-charged-with-child-rape-expected-to-change-plea/2702666/?amp)** > > A former head of Boston’s police union facing a total of 33 charges in connection with the rape and abuse of six children over various periods of time beginning in the 1990s pleaded guilty Monday. Patrick Rose had previously pleaded not guilty and... ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2022, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2562 "2022-04-28T18:39:32Z")
Cop committs crime that cops arrest citizens for. > **[Police officer fired following drug arrest](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/police-officer-fired-following-drug-arrest/ar-AAWFwvz?li=BBnb7Kz)** > > According to Chief Richard Dennis, his office learned on Monday, April 25, that 36-year-old Candace Cole attempted to purchase “illicit narcotics” while off-duty. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2022, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2563 "2022-04-28T20:13:56Z")
And the Police department is not releasing information on why he was not caught decades ago “to protect the victims”. Sure, that’s the reason. Not to cover up the internal blue wall that protects even child rapists. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2022, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2564 "2022-04-28T20:40:37Z")
No, it reads straight, so long as you remember that cops think of themselves as the victims in any situation. Can you imagine that if comes out that there were other cops that knew about it, and didn’t come forward and how angry people would be at those cops? Those poor victimized cops, why won’t you think of them? ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2022, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2565 "2022-04-28T20:50:35Z")
That’s already known. The only thing being hidden is which cops in Internal Affairs or the leadership were involved in letting this slide. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2022, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2566 "2022-04-28T21:06:39Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > The only thing being hidden is which cops in Internal Affairs or the leadership were involved in letting this slide. There was a particularly dirty cop in the Kansas City, KS police department, Roger Golubski (rape, child rape, drug dealing, etc). There were numerous complaints, none of which came to anything until relatively recently. The police chief and internal affairs boss are both conveniently dead now. And of course the whole department was at least somewhat aware. I somewhat knew (via my wife’s cousin who was tight with him) an officer (call him Fred) who was either president of the union or at least a wheel in it. Apparently when the heat started to get unignorable on good old Roger the boys at the union hall all wanted to come out in support of him. Fred talked them down - pointed out that they all knew he was bad news and did they really want to go on record supporting him. Fred seemed a nice enough guy, but he never provided evidence (although I don’t know if he actually ever worked with Golubski so may not have had any first hand knowledge). But even as casual as our relationship was, he wasn’t shy talking about the low-level bullying and corruption even he was participating in, making it clear it was part of the culture. [Here is an op-ed/human interest story](https://www.kansascity.com/opinion/opn-columns-blogs/melinda-henneberger/article260671447.html) laying out some of Golubski’s history and how it was ignored. May be paywalled. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2022, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/2567 "2022-04-28T21:07:22Z")
Don’t you think that the cops have already suffered enough with this one cop getting caught? How many other cop lives do you want to destroy? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531.md?page=127) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531.md?page=129)