# Controversial encounters between law-enforcement and civilians - the omnibus thread #2 **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 23, 2020, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531 "2020-06-23T20:29:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 160
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2023, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3188 "2023-01-29T18:52:46Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Better to have a law that says that if a cop lies or gives false information, they are disciplined up to and including immediate termination, along with potential civil and criminal liabilities for the harm resulting from that lie. “Up to” in a law like this would accomplish nothing at all. A 25 cent fine falls within the scope of “up to”. We need mandatory minimum penalties for misbehaving cops, because with the system as it is, the minimum is what they’ll be getting. > [@k9bfriender](#): > > To ask this presupposes that it is the protestors that were the sole initiators of the violence. Indeed. In all of the previous protests-turned-riots of the past few years, it wasn’t the protests who started the riots. It was right-wing groups like the Proud Boys, the Boogaloo Boys, and the police forces themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2023, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3189 "2023-01-29T19:06:19Z")
Police murdered George Floyd on May 25th. The Minneapolis 3rd Precinct was attacked by protestors, abandoned by police; and burned on May 28th. It was the following day, May 29th, that Derek Chauvin was arrested and charged with third degree murder and manslaughter. Because there were bystanders who were brave enough to film the videos were available almost immediately. In the killing of Tyre Nichols there were no bystander videos, and people had to wait for the police to release bodycam videos. Before those videos were available the officers involved had already been fired and charged with murder. This did not happen in George Floyd’s murder. Chauvin wasn’t charged until after videos were freely available. I suspect had Chauvinn been fired and charged more quickly the protests might have taken a different route. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2023, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3190 "2023-01-29T19:22:20Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > “Up to” in a law like this would accomplish nothing at all. A 25 cent fine falls within the scope of “up to”. We need mandatory minimum penalties for misbehaving cops, because with the system as it is, the minimum is what they’ll be getting. Agreed, I just didn’t feel like laying out an entire disciplinary schedule. Point is that they _should_ be held accountable, where in the current system, they are not. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2023, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3191 "2023-01-29T19:25:29Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > First time I’ve ever heard a police department respond with the appropriate level of horror and dismay or in any way prepare the public for what they were about to see. So maybe that has helped quell the chaos. That and the victim’s Mom asked people not to riot. I suppose you could even say that these demonstrations are less a protest against what the city did wrong, and more a show of support that they are doing the right thing. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3192 "2023-01-30T02:58:10Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > but the difference in the public response to both incidents is noteworthy. …besides what everyone else has pointed out: it isn’t the difference in public response that is noteworthy. It’s the way the _authorities_ have reacted. Its the agents of the state that have effectively turned this into a multi-media event, prime-time TV, the lynching of this man turned into entertainment. If _anyone_ wanted a chance to smash some heads it was the police. They were baiting them. Its just that nobody took the bait. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3193 "2023-01-30T20:33:48Z")
There is a rumor going around that Tyre Nichols was having a relationship with the wife of one of cops. > **[Was Tyre Nichols involved with Memphis police officer's wife? Rumor goes...](https://opoyi.com/usa/was-tyre-nichols-involved-with-memphis-police-officers-wife-rumor-goes-rampant-after-dashcam-video-sparks-protests/)** > > There is a rumor that Tyre Nichols might have been involved with the wife of one of the officers who have been arrested for his murder. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3194 "2023-01-30T20:49:49Z")
If that turns out to be true we could see those second-degree murder charges get up-graded quite a bit. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3195 "2023-01-30T23:30:00Z")
I suppose that rumor would “explain” why five Black cops would beat a Black civilian to death, because sexual jealousy is easier to understand than the inherently corrupting influence of unsupervised and uncontrolled power. On the other hand, this (from the linked item) which makes the opposite of sense: > Although most people across the nation are protesting against the meaningless death of Nichols, **which seems to have racist undertones** , some people are beginning to circulate the rumor that Nichols might have been involved with the wife of one of the officers who have been arrested for his murder. (emphasis added). It seems to me, the death of a Black person at the hands of Black cops tends to move the focus away from racist cops and onto cops in general. So the opposite of “racist undertones.” Maybe someone can explain to me what I’m missing. Finally, all you have to do is say “there’s a rumor about X” to make the rumors start flying about X. Anyone can start a rumor online, why should anyone pay any attention to it (unless it suits their purposes)? ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3196 "2023-01-30T23:34:30Z")
As freely as those cops were talking, I’d have expected to hear something like “Fuck with my wife motherfucker” or something like that. I’ll believe it when the wife of the cop makes a TikTok about it. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3197 "2023-01-30T23:38:57Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > There is a rumor going around that Tyre Nichols was having a relationship with the wife of one of cops. What is Opoyi and why are they the first to get this info? ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3198 "2023-01-30T23:42:49Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > What is Opoyi and why are they the first to get this info? They’re a media aggregator located in India. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2023, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3199 "2023-01-30T23:48:16Z")
And another member of their FD got fired. I assume the “two EMTs” are the ones mentioned when this story first blew up. > **[Tyre Nichols Death, Two EMTs And Fire Lieutenant Who Came To Scene Fired](https://www.tmz.com/2023/01/30/tyre-nichols-two-emts-fire-lieutenant-responded-arrest-scene-fired/)** > > Two EMTs and a fire lieutenant who responded to the Tyre Nichols arrest scene were fired. > MFD says their investigation concluded the EMTs, who were called for a person being pepper sprayed, failed to conduct an adequate patient assessment on Tyre … and after their initial interaction with him, they requested an ambulance, which got there about 15 minutes after EMTs arrived. > All the while, the Fire Department says Lt. Whitaker remained in the fire engine with the driver. I’m unclear if they’re saying the EMTs were responding to a call for someone that was pepper sprayed, meaning that’s all the info the dispatcher gave them or if that’s what the EMTs report stated. I’m _guessing_ both. I’m guessing the lied to the dispatcher so it wouldn’t be on record and they convinced the EMTs to falsify the paperwork. My gut says that’s why the driver and LT stayed in the truck. Plausible deniability. OTOH, the dispatcher may have simply had incomplete info. But then I’d want to know if the FD driver and LT staying in the truck is typical. IF, they lied to the dispatcher and the EMTs lied on their paperwork and the LT and driver stayed in the truck so as not to notice anything, I’ll bet one of the cops called/texted someone from the FD to give them a head’s up. That’s not as bad as it being premeditated (ie if one of their wives were sleeping with him) but it’s still pretty awful. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2023, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3200 "2023-01-31T02:27:14Z")
Two Shelby County sheriffs have been suspended and an EMT Lieutenant has been suspended. A sixth Memphis officer has been suspended, but not fired or charged with murder. He’s white. He’s in the video using a taser. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2023, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3201 "2023-01-31T02:58:03Z")
And, OK, this Scorpion unit has been dissolved… But all of the other members of it are still on the force, right, just in other units? If they were terrorists before, they’re still terrorists. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2023, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3202 "2023-01-31T03:02:46Z")
I believe the term is “Disband and go to ground.” ---
**Author:** ![HeyHomie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heyhomie/32/207_2.png) [@HeyHomie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HeyHomie)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2023, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3203 "2023-01-31T16:03:44Z")
This might be more suited to the Omnibus Stupid MFers thread, but since it’s adjacent to a law enforcement issue, I’m putting it here. San Juan County (Utah) Commissioner Bruce Adams caught on dashcam loudly berating cop who arrested his son on an outstanding warrant, demands to see the paper trail, demands supervisor, demands his son be released, yada yada yada. He’s apologized in a “sorry not sorry” sort of way. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/YL_gDpBIWf0/maxresdefault.jpg "EXCLUSIVE: Body cam shows county commissioner pushing Utah deputy to release son after lawful arrest") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YL_gDpBIWf0) ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3204 "2023-02-01T11:11:29Z")
I think it’s worse than a non-apology apology. ISTM he’s just flat out lying about apologizing. Also, WTF is with that stupid hat indoors? ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3205 "2023-02-01T11:25:38Z")
I’ve been watching a ton of First Amendment audit videos on YT. Fascinating stuff. One wonders if there’s even such a thing as a good cop. Anyway, one thing I’ve noticed is the obsession most cops have with wanting a person’s ID. They _constantly_ demand ID if a person is detained. Heck, they ask for ID even during a consensual encounter. “Can I see an ID? We need your ID. Why won’t you give us your ID? We need your ID. Do you have ID? Let me see your ID. Do you have ID on you? I need to see it. You have ID?” When the victim asks, “Why do you want my ID?” the response is always, “We just want to find out who you are,” or “We need your name for the report.” _Any_ reason they give for wanting an ID is bullshit. The real reason is to see if there’s a warrant out for them. And they’re hoping-n-praying there _ **is** _ a warrant out for them, for two reasons: 1) Immediate retaliation; to arrest them and “teach them a lesson” for not bowing to their authority, and 2) to short-circuit the process during detainment. For the later, they can immediately stop the investigation and arrest the person if there’s a warrant for them, which is a real timesaver for the cops. ---
**Author:** ![HeyHomie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heyhomie/32/207_2.png) [@HeyHomie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HeyHomie)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3206 "2023-02-01T15:10:01Z")
It’s like their jobs depending on getting ID from everyone within range. I’m not sure what the most egregious example of this is, but a contender has to be this incident from Colorado. TLDWatch: Mr. Sowl happened to be at the scene when a motorcylce accident occurred. Johnny Law decides that he’s getting ID from everyone who was in the parking lot. Mr. Sowl refuses and Johnny Law roughs him up but good. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/cv_oTM80PlA/maxresdefault.jpg "Officers Arrest Good Samaritan After Aiding Crash") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cv_oTM80PlA) ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2023, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531/3207 "2023-02-01T15:13:40Z")
I am convinced that, _every time_ a cop has an encounter with someone they say to themselves, “Hmmmm. I wonder if this person has an active warrant out on them? I hope so.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531.md?page=159) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread-2/912531.md?page=161)