# Controversial encounters between law-enforcement and civilians - the omnibus thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 10, 2014, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942 "2014-10-10T07:35:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 150
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2981 "2015-05-28T17:17:16Z")
> [@Mona\_Lott](#): > > Please explain to me how a one second glance at a cell phone magically becomes texting while driving. Thank you. [When the law of your state defines it as one, I suppose;](http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.668) > [@](#): > > (1)(a) Except as provided in subsection (2)(a) of this section, a person operating a moving noncommercial motor vehicle who, by means of an electronic wireless communications device, sends, reads, or writes a text message, is guilty of a traffic infraction. That’s the law in my state. It’s more than likely that your state has a similar law. You would do well to follow it so that you don’t allow drunk drivers to plow into you and kill you while you’re distracted. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2982 "2015-05-28T17:17:03Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Lots of things which in no way absolve their victims of the things that they are also responsible for. Lots of things? Really? In the case of the child-killing cops, could you name a few? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2983 "2015-05-28T17:18:39Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Actually, no. I agree that there is a right to defend against actual threats, I don’t agree that persons who cannot tell a real threat from an imaginary ones should carry weapons. Short of amending the Constitution to provide for psychic readings prior to any transfer of firearms, I don’t know how you expect to enforce such an idea. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2984 "2015-05-28T17:19:41Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Lots of things? Really? > In the case of the child-killing cops, could you name a few? Provide an example of a case in which cops unjustifiably killed a child, and we’ll talk. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2985 "2015-05-28T17:20:47Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > **Smapti** , I sincerely hope that one day it occurs to you that maybe there’s a good reason that so many respond to your political and philosophical ideals with such vehement disagreements, such that even your political allies think that you’re totally insane. My beliefs are based on nothing other than that which I have personally observed to be true. I cannot choose to believe something I know to be false for the sake of getting people to like me. I’d make a horrible politician. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2986 "2015-05-28T17:21:53Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Provide an example of a case in which cops unjustifiably killed a child, and we’ll talk. You, **Smapti** , are incapable of rationally evaluating whether the actions of cops (or other authority figures) are justified; as you are similarly incapable of evaluating the morality of many other actions and circumstances (such as those involving slavery, civil disobedience, military duty, and many more). ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2987 "2015-05-28T17:24:35Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > My beliefs are based on nothing other than that which I have personally observed to be true. I cannot choose to believe something I know to be false for the sake of getting people to like me. You don’t have to; I just hope that some day you might consider that your preconceived notions, and the philosophical underpinnings behind your beliefs about authority and society, might be incorrect and skewed due to your personal traumatic experiences. > [@](#): > > I’d make a horrible politician. Based on what you’ve posted, you’d also make a horrible soldier, a horrible cop, a horrible neighbor, a horrible citizen, and a horrible human being. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2988 "2015-05-28T17:24:37Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Jesus, all these negative comments about the police. Here we have a situation where someone threatens suicide–so the helpful police helpfully help him to achieve his goal: > [http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/05/28/man-calls-suicide-line-police-kill-him.html](http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/05/28/man-calls-suicide-line-police-kill-him.html) The “helpful police” comment sounds sarcastic, but it almost appears that was indeed police intent: > [@](#): > > [Police Detective] Smith then told her about “this new trend in law-enforcement now—it’s called suicide by cop.” She said Smith explained “suicide by cop” is when suicidal people provoke the police in an effort to end their own lives. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2989 "2015-05-28T17:25:40Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Short of amending the Constitution to provide for psychic readings prior to any transfer of firearms, I don’t know how you expect to enforce such an idea. I think some training should be mandatory for cops to help them determine what is a danger and how to defuse situations without the use of deadly force. Shooting first and asking questions later is for John Wayne movies, not real life. > [@Smapti](#): > > I’d make a horrible politician. I heartily agree! ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2990 "2015-05-28T17:26:21Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Provide an example of a case in which cops unjustifiably killed a child, and we’ll talk. I didn’t say unjustified, so go ahead and talk. While you’re at it, could you tell us where exactly the toy gun was when those officers rushed up to that 12 year old child? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2991 "2015-05-28T17:31:30Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I didn’t say unjustified, so go ahead and talk. So we _agree_ the shooting of Rice was justified, then? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2992 "2015-05-28T17:48:15Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > So we _agree_ the shooting of Rice was justified, then? The only thing agreed upon is that they killed a child. Quit trying to add things to the story that aren’t there, and answer the question. BTW, where was the toy gun when they rushed up to the 12 year old child? I know why you refuse to answer that: If you admit that he didn’t have a toy weapon in his hand when they came up to him, they no longer have any excuse, even a poor excuse, to be immediately afraid for their lives. That is why, in your mind’s eye, you cannot look directly at that child and at what that child was doing when he was gunned down. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2993 "2015-05-28T17:50:35Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > BTW, where was the toy gun when they rushed up to the 12 year old child? > I know why you refuse to answer that: If you admit that he didn’t have a toy weapon in his hand when they came up to him, they no longer have any excuse, even a poor excuse, to be immediately afraid for their lives. That is why, in your mind’s eye, you cannot look directly at that child and at what that child was doing when he was gunned down. In his waistband where he was reaching for it. Check and mate. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2994 "2015-05-28T17:52:07Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > In his waistband where he was reaching for it. Check and mate. So he was brandishing something in his pants? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2995 "2015-05-28T17:57:55Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > My beliefs are based on nothing other than that which I have personally observed to be true. I cannot choose to believe something I know to be false for the sake of getting people to like me. But you could choose to shut the fuck up about it, rather than constantly vomiting your vile “opinions” onto the board at every opportunity, you twisted, morally debased piece of shit. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2996 "2015-05-28T17:58:19Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > In his waistband where he was reaching for it. Check and mate. And once again, some dickwad gave a very good reason why he might have been reaching for it: > [@Smapti](#): > > They told him to drop the gun. If he’d done as he was told, he’d be alive. You just checkmated yourself, dickwad. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2997 "2015-05-28T18:07:06Z")
I’m sorry you can’t be bothered to keep this civil. Can you not at least agree that he should _not_ have responded to the police’s arrival by reaching for his piece? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2998 "2015-05-28T18:10:00Z")
First you say he was brandishing it. But it was in his pants. And that he should have dropped it. But it was in his pants. How does one drop something without picking it up? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/2999 "2015-05-28T18:18:11Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > First you say he was brandishing it. But it was in his pants. And that he should have dropped it. But it was in his pants. How does one drop something without picking it up? By not taking a hold of it, which is what he _did_ do. Please, do continue to elaborate on how “grab at the toy gun in your waistband” is a completely logical thing to do when confronted by the cops and how it’s exactly what you would teach your children to do. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2015, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3000 "2015-05-28T18:19:09Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I’m sorry you can’t be bothered to keep this civil. > > Can you not at least agree that he should _not_ have responded to the police’s arrival by reaching for his piece? We are _way_ past “civil”, you lying sack of shit, so tell me how he could have possibly dropped the gun without reaching for it in the first place? If you stick to your story that they told him to drop the “weapon”, _then they shot him down for trying to comply with police orders._ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=149) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=151)