# Controversial encounters between law-enforcement and civilians - the omnibus thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 10, 2014, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942 "2014-10-10T07:35:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 186
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2015, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3701 "2015-06-12T23:54:17Z")
Uh, how did the post you were replying to not answer this question? ---
**Author:** ![AtomicDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@AtomicDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AtomicDog)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3702 "2015-06-13T00:06:04Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > And I’ll ask the same thing to you: You think it is okay to generalize about all police, based on the actions of a few? Yes or no will suffice. [When they will punish their own when they dare to speak out about their fellow officers’ misdeeds?](http://www.inquisitr.com/2167165/randy-henry-state-trooper-demoted/) My answer has to be yes. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3703 "2015-06-13T00:28:40Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Do you have any reason to think people are actually pretending to be cops to rob houses? It’s funny, in post #3551in this thread you complain about not using google, but here what is easily searchable you seem totally ignorant of. [Here is my search.](https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&es_th=1&ie=UTF-8#safe=off&q=impersonating+police+home+invasion) [MAN CHARGED WITH HOME INVASION, IMPERSONATING POLICE IN LINCOLN PARK](http://abc7chicago.com/news/man-charged-with-home-invasion-impersonating-police-in-lincoln-park/549759/) [ [URL=“http://abc13.com/news/hpd-4-men-impersonating-police-invade-sw-houston-home/504135/”] HPD: 4 MEN IMPERSONATING POLICE INVADE SW HOUSTON HOME](http://kxan.com/2015/05/13/police-teen-impersonates-police-officer-during-san-marcos-home-invasion/) [Police: 5 men planned cop-impersonation robberies of drug dealers after meeting in prison](http://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/5-men-accused-of-impersonating-police-officers-in-home-burglaries-in-suffolk-1.10219768) [Fake cop home invasions grow into a frightening new Houston trend: Imposters have uniforms](http://houston.culturemap.com/news/city-life/12-13-13-fake-cop-home-invasions-grow-into-a-frightening-new-houston-trend-imposters-have-uniforms/) That’s from the first page of the search. Then there is [Ryan Frederick:](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Frederick) > [@](#): > > On the night of January 17, Frederick awoke to his dogs barking at an individual who was breaking in his front door. According to local interviews, Frederick fired his pistol at Detective Jarrod Shivers as he tried to enter through one of the lower door panels. The bullet struck Shivers in the side, killing him. > > … > > Ryan David Frederick is a prisoner in Virginia. On February 4, 2009, he was sentenced to 10 years imprisonment following conviction for voluntary manslaughter for the January 17, 2008 shooting death of police officer Jarrod Shivers. Of course, there’s Adrian Perryman where things went the other way: > [@](#): > > SAPD’s tactical response unit was executing a no-knock search warrant. The occupants in the house at the time were Perryman, his girlfriend Rebecca Flores, and Flores’s 3 year old grand daughter Savannah. > > When Flores saw two shadowy men on the security cameras, she woke up Perryman, and tossed him his gun. > > According to MySA News, Flores recalled the events of that night to the jury. “I put my body over Savannah’s,” she said, recalling for jurors what she did in the moments after handing Perryman the gun and before he opened fire. “He said ‘I’ve got a gun and I’m going to shoot — stay out!’” > > … > > After a 9 hour deliberation, a jury has found Adrian Perryman, not guilty on all four counts of aggravated assault on a peace officer. It’s probably not super common, but yes criminals at times impersonate police to facilitate their crimes. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3704 "2015-06-13T00:46:28Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > She lived. I don’t know why that would disappoint you. Or are you crying tears of joy? You’ve been whooshed. Cut your losses. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3705 "2015-06-13T00:57:30Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Well, thank you for answering. Do you further feel it is okay to generalize about other groups that are formed by the choice of the members, based on the actions of some of the members? Or do you feel that only the police deserve this type of generalization? Well, the cops certainly don’t seem to have a problem doing it. Oh, and “Gang Member”. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3706 "2015-06-13T02:09:25Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > Its pretty damn rare for a department or a union to come out and say “That guy is a dick, and he’s on his own!” Usually, they say “He is one of us and we are standing with him, defending him”\*. In light of that, painting them with the same brush is kinda unavoidable. My cousin is married to an officer. I posted a link to the article about Casebolt resigning, and his chief saying that 11 of his 12 officers on the scene had followed there training, and one was out of control when he got there, and stayed out of control. She posted back her disappointment that his department didn’t have his back. I really thought that him resigning would be something everyone could agree on. And my cousin is normally pretty rational. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3707 "2015-06-13T03:31:44Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Well, the cops certainly don’t seem to have a problem doing it. > > Oh, and “Gang Member”. [Speaking of which…](http://i.imgur.com/pFu4FLi.jpg) (yes, I know, different country. Still priceless.) ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3708 "2015-06-13T04:57:47Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Well, thank you for answering. Do you further feel it is okay to generalize about other groups that are formed by the choice of the members, based on the actions of some of the members? Or do you feel that only the police deserve this type of generalization? Yes. Librarians like books. Astrophysicists are smart. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3709 "2015-06-13T10:16:47Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > So, again, you are saying it’s okay to make generalizations about ALL police based on the actions of a few, because it is a profession, and they choose to be in that profession, they are not born as police? > > The small words “yes” or “no” will suffice, if you can manage that. No, you idiot, that’s what you’re saying in a vain attempt to get me to say, “hay-yuk, ya got me boss.” We are discussing the behavior of people who choose to become police officers and the apparent break-down in rationality when it comes to dealing with minorities … an issue that is at the forefront of the American zeitgeist at the moment. I’m sorry that this doesn’t give you a free pass to make sweeping generalizations about black people, but them’s the breaks, Cletus. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3710 "2015-06-13T13:55:19Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > [And proud we are of all of them](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/06/11/1392348/-Fox-s-Key-McKinney-Witness-Sean-Toon-and-his-Wife-were-with-people-who-attacked-Pool-Party-Host). That links to an interesting story. It turns out that FoxNews’ key informant on the Casebolt assaults was Sean Toon. Toon’s wife participated in the racist slurs and pushing that began the altercation. Toon himself is a convicted felon, and was arrested for a separate aggravated assault with a deadly weapon. (I suppose in FoxNews’ view, such criminal arrests and conviction make Toon an expert on the justice system.) ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3711 "2015-06-13T14:44:44Z")
Man, Looney Toons has grown _dark_. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3712 "2015-06-13T15:18:18Z")
[Cameras are evil](http://abc13.com/news/cops-caught-on-camera-eating-marijuana-joking-about-kicking-amputee/779882/). _Evil!_ They must be destroyed! ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3713 "2015-06-13T15:21:05Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > …She posted back her disappointment that his department didn’t have his back. I really thought that him resigning would be something everyone could agree on. And my cousin is normally pretty rational. (post shortened) How dare people have opinions that do not agree with yours. :rolleyes: The anti-cop lynch mob-types, professional protesters, and MSNBC and CNN were pretty quick to condemn police, make claims of racism, demand “justice” based on innuendo and rumors, and begin making death threats. Of course, they’ve had a lot of practice recently, so they’ve becoming pretty efficient at spinning the facts before the whole story is available. In spite of the fact that many people have publically disagreed with the lynch mob-types, you really thought that eVeRyOnE would agree on anything. I think your cousin sounds pretty rational. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3714 "2015-06-13T15:40:19Z")
See, that’s the problem with the cops and cop supporters. “Anyone who speaks out against the police is a bad person” You people complain about good cops being lumped in with the bad, but goddamn, look how quickly you do it to everyone who complains about the police! It’s almost as if you can’t help but accuse everyone else of doing this because it’s your entire fucking mindset and you can’t imagine any other reason why people would complain. Rather binary, isn’t it? Good guys = Police and pro-cops, Bad Guys = Criminals and anyone who complains about police behavior? I want a police force. I want the rule of law. I want a civilized order of law enforcement that does actually lives up to “To Protect and Serve” without becoming an occupying force or a force of subjugation. One that understands that it is a necessary part of a free society and yet is still a part of that free society. One where police who abuse citizens are swiftly dealt with and subject to criminal charges for criminal behavior. Once where the police are under the same damned civilian control and oversight that we insist on for the Military. One where the police are NOT militarized or even “Para-Military” as my former cop security bosses kept insisting as they waved their dicks around. What the fuck is so wrong with that idea that it gets the cop’s dander up and starts this ‘putting words in people’s mouths trying for a Gotcha! moment’ defensive bullshit? ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3715 "2015-06-13T16:03:00Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > I think your cousin sounds pretty rational. Well, sure, but then \*you \*wouldn’t know what actual rationality looks like if it came to your house to beat you senseless with a tire iron, so. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3716 "2015-06-13T16:09:27Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > See, that’s the problem with the cops and cop supporters. I suspect doorhinge has a number of problems, but you’re right that this particular one is unfortunately commonplace. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3717 "2015-06-13T16:16:05Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > The anti-cop lynch mob-types, professional protesters, and MSNBC and CNN were pretty quick to condemn police, make claims of racism, demand “justice” based on innuendo and rumors, and begin making death threats. Were MSNBC and CNN making death threats? If not, I suggest you work on the clarity of your sentences. Try adding some judiciously-placed semicolons. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3718 "2015-06-13T16:47:12Z")
S\*\*\* hits the fan in Dallas: gunman with armored van, explosives attacks police HQ > **[Dallas Gunman Killed After Attack on Police Headquarters (Published 2015)](https://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/13/us/dallas-police-shooting.html?_r=0)** > > The suspected gunman who attacked Police Headquarters from inside an armored van and left bags filled with pipe bombs around the building was shot and killed by a police sniper. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3719 "2015-06-13T17:20:40Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > S\*\*\* hits the fan in Dallas: gunman with armored van, explosives attacks police HQ > > [http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/13/us/dallas-police-shooting.html?\_r=0](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/13/us/dallas-police-shooting.html?_r=0) A solitary raging fuckwit does not constitute anything “hitting the fan”. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/3720 "2015-06-13T17:44:23Z")
Yeah, I’m not quite clear how that particular news item fits in this thread TBH. Nutcase goes postal on whichever boogeyman he’s ascribed all of his ills to in his fevered little mind, gets gunned down by the police. Good. What’s the controversy ? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=185) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=187)