# Controversial encounters between law-enforcement and civilians - the omnibus thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 10, 2014, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942 "2014-10-10T07:35:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 443
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8842 "2016-09-22T19:53:27Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > PCP (AKA angel dust) sort of detaches you from your nervous system so that you don’t really feel anything. The reason its called angel dust is because you can’t feel your feet hitting the floor as you walk so it feels like you are floating like an angel. So if you are actually on PCP, most bullets will not slow you down unless they hit you in the head or heart. You are effectively immune from shock and not entirely rational (you are also unlikely to be very accurate with a gun). > > With that said, you don’t shoot to kill anyone that you think is on PCP. > > BTW, they found PCP in the guy’s car. > > [Police say PCP found in vehicle occupied by Terence Crutcher on Friday](http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/local/police-say-pcp-found-in-vehicle-occupied-by-terence-crutcher/article_d965a1f2-072b-57bf-a682-6b1cfb22b246.html) I’m aware of PCP. I’ve had to deal with a couple of people who were (probably) on it. I accidentally smoked some myself a couple of decades ago when I took a couple of hits off a joint that had been laced with the stuff. PCP does cause disorientation, numbness, and bad behavior. Of course so does alcohol, if you drink enough. It does not give superpowers. You can’t lift anything you couldn’t when sober. (You might tear your muscles lifting something you shouldn’t) You can’t punch any harder than you would when sober. If you break your knee you might not feel it, but you aren’t going to be able to walk. It’s a terrible drug, and should be avoided, but it’s not magic. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8843 "2016-09-22T20:00:09Z")
If it was magic like that, you’d see terrorists using it before carrying out attacks. “Oh Akmar, you will have the strength of 20 men and be invincible to their bullets! You have seen the American police videos, yes? You will kill many before you are martyred!” You’d see Mexican cartels using it before raids on other cartels. It would be the go-to drug for every violent sect or organization. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8844 "2016-09-22T20:22:27Z")
I have used PCP on a number of occasions. I acted like a complete hyper-asshole, but I did not get super strength and I was still able to feel pain. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8845 "2016-09-22T20:22:36Z")
**Tyre King Likely Running Away at Time of Shooting, According to Forensic Pathologist** > [@](#): > > Dr. Diaz notes: “Based on the location and the direction of the wound paths it is more likely than not that Tyre King was in the process of running away from the shooter or shooters when he suffered all three gunshot wounds." Dr. Diaz describes Tyre as a “small-framed adolescent boy, standing 5’0” and weighing less than 100 lbs.” [https://www.waltonbrownlaw.com/news/30](https://www.waltonbrownlaw.com/news/30) ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8846 "2016-09-22T20:37:17Z")
Yup, and the authoritarians believe that running away from Police deserves death. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8847 "2016-09-22T20:43:47Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > **Tyre King Likely Running Away at Time of Shooting, According to Forensic Pathologist** > > [https://www.waltonbrownlaw.com/news/30](https://www.waltonbrownlaw.com/news/30) That’s the young kid that the cops say he pointed a bb gun with a laser sight at them? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8848 "2016-09-22T20:44:36Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > **Tyre King Likely Running Away at Time of Shooting, According to Forensic Pathologist** > > [https://www.waltonbrownlaw.com/news/30](https://www.waltonbrownlaw.com/news/30) I believe I’ve asked before: Do we have the actual description from the victim of the person/persons involved? ---
**Author:** ![PeskiPiksi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e495f1/32.png) [@PeskiPiksi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PeskiPiksi)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8849 "2016-09-22T20:57:26Z")
Officer Shelby has been [charged](http://www.kjrh.com/news/local-news/the-tulsa-county-district-attorneys-officer-to-hold-a-press-conference-regarding-terence-crutcher)with 1st degree manslaughter. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8850 "2016-09-22T20:58:41Z")
Tulsa officer that shot Terence Crutcher charged with manslaughter. > **[Tulsa police officer charged with manslaughter | CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/22/us/tulsa-officer-charged/index.html?adkey=bn)** > > Tulsa, Oklahoma, police officer Betty Shelby has been charged with felony manslaughter in the first degree, Tulsa County District Attorney Steve Kunzweiler told reporters Thursday. ---
**Author:** ![PeskiPiksi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e495f1/32.png) [@PeskiPiksi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PeskiPiksi)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8851 "2016-09-22T21:20:51Z")
Supposed to be a protest rally less than a mile from my house tonight. Might be interesting…hopefully will stay peaceful as all the rest of them have, although I’m hearing whispers of “protesters” being bussed in from out of town. In any case, I will be taking the long route home so I can approach my house from the opposite direction this evening. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8852 "2016-09-22T21:47:03Z")
> [@PeskiPiksi](#): > > …although I’m hearing whispers of “protesters” being bussed in from out of town… For sure, organized by the New Black Panther Party and ACORN, with financing from Soros. Rumors about involvement of the Insane Clown Posse are just stories, and can safely be ignored. ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_Rat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_Rat)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8853 "2016-09-22T21:49:03Z")
> [@PeskiPiksi](#): > > Supposed to be a protest rally less than a mile from my house tonight. Might be interesting…hopefully will stay peaceful as all the rest of them have, Hopefully more peaceful than Charlotte. I think the rioters there are now 1:1 with the cops in number of killed. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8854 "2016-09-22T22:01:19Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > I have used PCP on a number of occasions. I acted like a complete hyper-asshole, but I did not get super strength and I was still able to feel pain. I hope you apologized to your primary care physician. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8855 "2016-09-22T22:41:07Z")
People still use PCP? I remember when it was hyped as a scourge upon our youths – thirty-five fucking years ago. Is that where Tulsa is, stuck in the early 80s? ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8856 "2016-09-22T23:22:44Z")
[Everything I know about PCP I learned from Smokey](https://youtu.be/SHgDkTf4nac?t=80). ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8857 "2016-09-22T23:36:34Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > People still use PCP? I remember when it was hyped as a scourge upon our youths – thirty-five fucking years ago. Is that where Tulsa is, stuck in the early 80s? They never stopped. The media just found new things to scare people with. ---
**Author:** ![MikeF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MikeF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeF)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8858 "2016-09-22T23:46:59Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > How about waiting to see if the suspect _actually_ has a weapon? Is that really too much to ask? Actually, yes, that really is too much to ask. The officer is already reacting to what a suspect is doing and that results in a lag. This is known as the “reactionary gap”. By the time an officer has confirmed it is actually a weapon but before he can react, the suspect can have already fired multiple rounds. This has been shown time and again in various studies. I personally ran an airsoft (bb gun) scenario where officers were confronted with a burglary suspect facing them with his hands in his coat pockets. Around 200 officers took part. 90% of officers said “Show me your hands” or something similar. 100% had the suspect at gunpoint. The suspect then drew a pistol from his pocket and fired an un-aimed shot (or shots) at the the officer. 100% of the time the suspect was able to get off the first shot(s), hitting the officer around 90% of the time. Therefore, the training (and policy/law) is - the totality of the circumstances determine what you may do. Waiting to confirm it is a firearm when you have other reasons to believe the suspect may be armed carries with it a very substantial risk that you will be shot. There is no legal or moral requirement that you do so. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8859 "2016-09-22T23:53:41Z")
> [@MikeF](#): > > Around 200 officers took part. 90% of officers said “Show me your hands” or something similar. 100% had the suspect at gunpoint. The suspect then drew a pistol from his pocket and fired an un-aimed shot (or shots) at the the officer. 100% of the time the suspect was able to get off the first shot(s), hitting the officer around 90% of the time. Bullshit. From how far, 16"? Almost everyone is a shitty shot with a pistol, and theres no way anyone but a trained tactical marksman hits anything farther away than dick length more than 10% of the time on a shot like that. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2016, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8860 "2016-09-22T23:53:41Z")
> [@MikeF](#): > > I personally ran an airsoft (bb gun) scenario where officers were confronted with a burglary suspect facing them with his hands in his coat pockets. Around 200 officers took part. 90% of officers said “Show me your hands” or something similar. 100% had the suspect at gunpoint. The suspect then drew a pistol from his pocket and fired an un-aimed shot (or shots) at the the officer. 100% of the time the suspect was able to get off the first shot(s), hitting the officer around 90% of the time. So…police should shoot anyone with their hands in their pockets? Outside of movies or suicide attempts, I wonder how many criminals, confronted by multiple police with guns pointed at them, decide to try to shoot one of the police? ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2016, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/8861 "2016-09-23T00:10:50Z")
> [@MikeF](#): > > Therefore, the training (and policy/law) is - the totality of the circumstances determine what you may do. Waiting to confirm it is a firearm when you have other reasons to believe the suspect may be armed carries with it a very substantial risk that you will be shot. There is no legal or moral requirement that you do so. Well, the totality of the circumstances did NOT determine this, as the office is question is now facing manslaughter charges. The police should have a _reasonable_ suspicion that a suspect may be armed, and that reason should not be black skin. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=442) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=444)