# Controversial encounters between law-enforcement and civilians - the omnibus thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 10, 2014, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942 "2014-10-10T07:35:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 509
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2016, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10162 "2016-12-14T23:03:04Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The part where that’s not true. We’ve got a man who is on drugs, resisting arrest and making threatening gestures and statements. He’s a threat to the officers and the use of force to subdue him is appropriate and justified. > > They’re the ones that don’t expose the officers to greater risk. How about a taser? How about talking to the weaponless naked gentleman that is just standing there and not attacking or threatening the officers with violence? You really think the only options they had were to shoot him or to let the dog bite him? Really? Go away Smapti. Your are an awful person with a completely uncalibrated sense of right and wrong when it comes to acceptable police behavior. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10163 "2016-12-15T04:37:07Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#): > > How about a taser? How about talking to the weaponless naked gentleman that is just standing there and not attacking or threatening the officers with violence? Have you seriously not been following this thread? Because, “_We’re the Police, and you goddamn well better do exactly what we say when we say it or we will fucking take you down_” mostly seems to be the only way they know how to operate. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10164 "2016-12-15T11:05:23Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#): > > How about a taser? Thou hypocrite. We’ve already established in this thread that it is \*\*controversial \*\* and **wrong** to Tase unarmed people, especially if they’re on drugs, because it might kill them. > [@](#): > > How about talking to the weaponless naked gentleman that is just standing there and not attacking or threatening the officers with violence? They _tried_ that. The end result of it was his refusing to follow orders, while facing the officers, clenching his fists, and yelling “NO!” - which, under California law, legally comprises the crime of assault. The officers had no guarantee that a Taser would effectively subdue the criminal (notwithstanding the fact that Tasing unarmed people is **wrong** anyway as per this thread), talking to him had proven ineffective, and it was not feasible to physically engage him due to the environmental conditions. Their choices were thus limited to two options; subdue him with the dog, or shoot him. Maybe people like him should think twice before deciding to consume Schedule I drugs and get naked on public property if they don’t want to get gored. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10165 "2016-12-15T12:38:36Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > They _tried_ that. …no they fucking well did not. The time from the order to “turn around” to the dog grabbing his leg was 5 seconds by my eye. The news report says it was only 2 seconds. Don’t claim they tried talking to him because they did not try talking to him. You are either lying or you haven’t watched the tape. > [@](#): > > The end result of it was his refusing to follow orders, while facing the officers, clenching his fists, and yelling “NO!” - which, under California law, legally comprises the crime of assault. If what you say is true (and I doubt that it is) then California law is an ass. "San Diego Police Department policy states “if possible, give at least two warnings in a loud and clear manner” before allowing a dog to bite. But the video shows that no warning was given and the K9 officer wrote in his official police report that, “due to the immediate threat I did not have an opportunity to give K-9 warnings.” He went on to say that he believed the man “posed an immediate threat to officers due to the fact he was clinching his fists and walking towards them.” > **[Cops Allow Police Dog to Bite Naked, Unarmed Man](https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/cops-allow-police-dog-bite-naked-unarmed-man/63306/)** > > The NBC4 I-Team has obtained police body cam video — never before seen publicly — that shows cops allowing a K-9 to bite a naked, unarmed man, including for over 40 seconds after officers had him pinned to the ground. I’m sure you would agree with me that the police in this instance did not follow procedure, don’t you agree? > [@](#): > > The officers had no guarantee that a Taser would effectively subdue the criminal (notwithstanding the fact that Tasing unarmed people is **wrong** anyway as per this thread), talking to him had proven ineffective, and it was not feasible to physically engage him due to the environmental conditions. But they did physically engage him. So your claim that “it was not feasible to physically engage him due to the environmental conditions” is yet another lie. There was no guarantee a dog would effectively subdue the criminal and they didn’t attempt to talk to him. > [@](#): > > Their choices were thus limited to two options; subdue him with the dog, or shoot him. Another lie. I live in a country where police are not routinely armed and routinely don’t have dogs. And the police here have plenty of options when dealing with cases like this. They were not limited to only two options in this case. What a bullshit claim. > [@](#): > > Maybe people like him should think twice before deciding to consume Schedule I drugs and get naked on public property if they don’t want to get gored. The last time this happened the City of Los Angeles settled for 3.6 million dollars. So it looks like the tax payers of Los Angeles are the ones who are going to get gored because these officers couldn’t follow procedure. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10166 "2016-12-15T20:24:02Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > Another lie. I live in a country where police are not routinely armed and routinely don’t have dogs. And the police here have plenty of options when dealing with cases like this. They were not limited to only two options in this case. What a bullshit claim. In America police have to resort to lethal force much sooner because perps may be packing guns…oh, wait, he was naked? And unarmed?..well, he still could have been packing, it was just really well hidden, if you know what I mean. ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10167 "2016-12-15T21:16:10Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …no they fucking well did not. > > The time from the order to “turn around” to the dog grabbing his leg was 5 seconds by my eye. The news report says it was only 2 seconds. Don’t claim they tried talking to him because they did not try talking to him. You are either lying or you haven’t watched the tape… **Smapti** demonstrates grand master level contortionist skills defending any and all extremism by police. News at… Hell. Every fucking post he makes here. ---
**Author:** ![Crazy\_Canuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazy_canuck/32/5282_2.png) [@Crazy\_Canuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazy_Canuck)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10168 "2016-12-15T23:00:36Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Maybe people like him should think twice before deciding to consume Schedule I drugs and get naked on public property if they don’t want to get gored. What a fucking waste of humanity you are. That police dog has more humanity in him than you ever will. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2016, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10169 "2016-12-15T23:01:56Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Maybe people like him should think twice before deciding to consume Schedule I drugs and get naked on public property if they don’t want to get gored. God you’re a disgusting, goal-post moving, dishonest, inhuman shitstain. Go fuck yourself, you useless piece of trash. ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10170 "2016-12-19T17:57:32Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > Or, if they’re tampered with: > > [Probe underway of alleged doctored Albuquerque police videos](http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/us/article/US-investigating-allegations-on-Albuquerque-10785315.php) When the [Albuquerque cops](http://hpub.org/To_Bust_People_for_Buying_Crack%2C_Cops_Are_Now_Manufacturing_and_Selling_People_Crack-55862/) are manufacturing crack, you know the war on drugs is nothing short of a farce. > [@](#): > > [Burque Media](https://www.burquemedia.com/2016/05/13/breaking-apd-gets-approval-to-manufacture-crack-cocaine-for-buy-bust-operation/) exclusively revealed APD’s intentions to become temporary crack manufacturers, after a confidential source shared the affidavit about the impending bust. > > “Powdered cocaine may be taken into APD’s Criminalistics Unit to be made into crack cocaine,” reads the Affidavit and Motion to Release Evidence, dated February 25, 2016, and signed by a District Court Judge. In addition to the police-manufactured crack, APD is also permitted to use methamphetamine, cocaine, and heroin from its cataloged evidence stores to become drug dealers in order to catch individuals who use those illegal substances. > > “Once the transaction is completed,” the document continues, “the individual purchasing the drugs will be arrested and charged with Felony Possession of a Controlled Substance. The detectives will attempt to immediately retrieve the drugs sold.” A reverse buy and bust so they can catch some low level drug users. ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10171 "2016-12-19T19:06:33Z")
Kind of a tossup whether to put this here or in Stupid Gun News… [US Marshal arrested for pointing gun at McDonald’s cashier](http://nypost.com/2016/12/18/us-marshal-arrested-for-pointing-gun-at-mcdonalds-cashier/) But I just had to see how **Smapti** will tell us how the Deputy Marshal was completely justified because the cashier was hindering law enforcement by taking too long providing him with his Happy Meal. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10172 "2016-12-19T19:33:23Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > God you’re a disgusting, goal-post moving, dishonest, inhuman shitstain. Go fuck yourself, you useless piece of trash. [Moderating] Telling other posters to fuck themselves is a violation of the Pit’s language rules. Please avoid this in the future. No warning issued. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10173 "2016-12-19T19:49:19Z")
> [@Projammer](#): > > Kind of a tossup whether to put this here or in Stupid Gun News… > > [US Marshal arrested for pointing gun at McDonald’s cashier](http://nypost.com/2016/12/18/us-marshal-arrested-for-pointing-gun-at-mcdonalds-cashier/) > > But I just had to see how **Smapti** will tell us how the Deputy Marshal was completely justified because the cashier was hindering law enforcement by taking too long providing him with his Happy Meal. Too bad there wasn’t a “good guy with a gun” there. I am sure that that would have made the situation go much more smoothly. “Can I get a side order of crossfire with that please? And make it to go.” ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10174 "2016-12-19T22:00:58Z")
> [@Projammer](#): > > Kind of a tossup whether to put this here or in Stupid Gun News… > > [US Marshal arrested for pointing gun at McDonald’s cashier](http://nypost.com/2016/12/18/us-marshal-arrested-for-pointing-gun-at-mcdonalds-cashier/) > > But I just had to see how **Smapti** will tell us how the Deputy Marshal was completely justified because the cashier was hindering law enforcement by taking too long providing him with his Happy Meal. US Marshall, _justified_… This could be on TV. Art Mullen: Tell me about the shooting. Raylan Givens: It was justified. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10175 "2016-12-20T18:50:35Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Yeah, except it isn’t. And I would have called you a lying piece of shit for claiming that it was. But I’ve come to the realization that you are genuinely too stupid to recognize that it isn’t, so I forgive you, you poor stupid man. Sorry to jump into this so late but if SA actually said what you claim he said, why do you expect me to go digging through a monster thread looking for it? Either he said it or he didn’t. Its starting to sound like you guys worked yourselves into an anti-SA lather in that thread and started to put words in his mouth and then started believing the words that you put into his mouth actually came out of his mouth. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10176 "2016-12-20T19:29:04Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I wonder if all the people who are complaining about this will STFU when it turns out that this guy was on PCP or if they will find some other reason to turn Terence Crutcher’s death into a conspiracy, > **[Okla. Medical Examiner Releases Terence Crutcher Autopsy Report](https://www.theroot.com/okla-medical-examiner-releases-terence-crutcher-autops-1790857198)** > > Terence Crutcher, the unarmed black man who was fatally shot by a white female police officer in Tulsa, Okla., had PCP in his system when he died from the fatal gunshot wound, according to a medical examiner’s report released Tuesday, the Washington... I guess the answer is no. After all the demands for proof that Terence Crutcher was on PCP, when the proof is delivered, it turns out that they didn’t really care if he was on PCP or not, they just wanted cites for the sake of getting cites. The notion that there was no probable cause just goes out the fucking window if he was on PCP. No jury will agree with that. Terence Crutcher was on PCP. This is going to make it much harder to convict officer Shelby. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10177 "2016-12-20T19:48:42Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Sorry to jump into this so late but if SA actually said what you claim he said, why do you expect me to go digging through a monster thread looking for it? I don’t expect you to do anything. Read it or don’t, I really don’t care. If you don’t want to read it then shut the fuck up about it–it doesn’t concern you. I don’t understand why the fuck you jump into a conversation I’m having with someone else and expect me to summarize for you because you’re too fucking lazy to read a thread yourself. Jesus fucking Christ, find another hobby. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10178 "2016-12-20T21:04:01Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > I don’t expect you to do anything. Read it or don’t, I really don’t care. If you don’t want to read it then shut the fuck up about it–it doesn’t concern you. > > I don’t understand why the fuck you jump into a conversation I’m having with someone else and expect me to summarize for you because you’re too fucking lazy to read a thread yourself. Jesus fucking Christ, find another hobby. IIRC you brought it up in the context of a reply to one of my posts. ---
**Author:** ![sobredinero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d26b3c/32.png) [@sobredinero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sobredinero)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10179 "2016-12-20T21:05:36Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > I’m glad for this thread because I wanted to bitch about this incident but didn’t want to add yet another What The Fuck Is _Wrong_ With Police? thread. > > [NYC police steal $1300 in a stop and frisk.](http://www.cbsnews.com/news/nypd-cop-allegedly-steals-1300-during-stop-and-frisk/) > > They take his money. Pepper spray him when he starts yelling for them to give him his money back and then pepper spray his sister when she asks for his badge number. Thats despicable. Bad apples dont get pointed out often enough so they keep getting away with it. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10180 "2016-12-20T21:23:24Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > IIRC you brought it up in the context of a reply to one of my posts. I wouldn’t have invited you to lunch if I’d known I’d have to chew your food for you. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2016, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/10181 "2016-12-21T06:16:49Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > The notion that there was no probable cause just goes out the fucking window if he was on PCP. Is that how probably cause works? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=508) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=510)