# Controversial encounters between law-enforcement and civilians - the omnibus thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 10, 2014, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942 "2014-10-10T07:35:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 582
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11622 "2017-10-13T15:20:22Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Yep. Look at Tamir Rice. He was a small target, yet easy to hit as he stood still. He wasn’t a small target. > [@](#): > > Tamir was big for his age — 5-foot-7 and 175 pounds, with a men’s XL jacket and size-36 pants… [Cite](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/12/28/why-prosecutors-keep-talking-about-tamir-rices-size-36-pants/?utm_term=.4404c81c53ee). Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11623 "2017-10-13T15:23:31Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > So don’t flee from the fucking cops then. Black people have plenty of well documented reasons to fear for their lives with police. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11624 "2017-10-13T15:26:52Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#): > > Black people have plenty of well documented reasons to fear for their lives with police. > [@Shodan](#): > > He wasn’t a small target. > [Cite](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/12/28/why-prosecutors-keep-talking-about-tamir-rices-size-36-pants/?utm_term=.4404c81c53ee). > > Regards, > Shodan That white cops are scared of 12 year old black kids who happen to be tall for their age is but one reason.☹ ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11625 "2017-10-13T15:29:29Z")
Another is if they point a gun at you, try to run you over, etc. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11626 "2017-10-13T15:31:48Z")
Another is laying on the ground with their hands up pleading not to be shot. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11627 "2017-10-13T15:32:41Z")
NM ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11628 "2017-10-13T15:33:41Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > So don’t flee from the fucking cops then. I dunno, you probably should [run](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-40959693) [from](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Holtzclaw) [these](http://www.clarionledger.com/story/news/local/2017/08/28/mississippi-fake-cop-rape/608002001/) [fucking](http://thefreethoughtproject.com/two-children-raped-cop-former-officer-gets-work-release-probation/) [cops](https://www.thedailybeast.com/cop-accused-of-beating-three-wives-and-raping-a-blind-woman-didnt-lose-his-job-5). ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11629 "2017-10-13T16:04:01Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Horrifying. > [li][Two weeks before an election, in the middle of the night, Charlottesville police arrested a DA candidate who was vowing to rein in police abuse](https://theintercept.com/2017/10/12/before-charlottesville-was-in-the-spotlight-police-arrested-their-most-prominent-critic-in-the-middle-of-the-night/). ([theintercept.com](http://theintercept.com))[/li] This one is horrifying. It sounds like the plot of a bad movie. Bad, because it would be hard to believe that a town and their police force could be so openly evil. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11630 "2017-10-13T16:14:13Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > The person who was shot had just run over the officer’s partner. This seems like about as good of a reason to shoot someone as you’ll get in this thread. We do not employ the police to dole out punishment. ---
**Author:** ![Wolf333](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf333/32/3460_2.png) [@Wolf333](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolf333)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11631 "2017-10-13T16:39:11Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Another is if they point a gun at you, try to run you over, etc. > > Regards, > Shodan Cite that he pointe the gun at them? I seem to recall reading that is was in his pocket. ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bruce\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11632 "2017-10-13T18:04:58Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > We do not employ the police to dole out punishment. I don’t agree with your characterization of the shooting being a “punishment”. She was still driving. You could argue that he was preventing her being a danger to anyone else. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11633 "2017-10-13T20:27:03Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Yep. Look at Tamir Rice. He was a small target, yet easy to hit as he stood still. And the asshole that shot him, had already been declared UNFIT by another police department. I saw the video. it was little more than a drive-by murder. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11634 "2017-10-13T22:46:18Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#): > > I would be careful with this sub. I have been perusing it for a long time (well over a year) and while it does always have a record of the latest bit of police brutality (much of which I have posted here), it is also full of Russian trolls and links to fake news / propaganda sites trying to stir up racial animus. Good reason to pay attention to link URLs. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2017, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11635 "2017-10-18T00:31:33Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Tonight we go to tiny, Euclid, Ohio (population 50k +/-): [Dashcam video shows white cop punching black man during stop](http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_POLICE_ARREST_VIDEO_OHOL-?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2017-08-18-20-59-56)It’s hard for me to believe that that last bit didn’t throw up all kinds of red flags, but then I realized that I was talking about _cops_ and they think that all sorts of really fucked up things are perfectly normal, so who knows what “I think danger is really cool” would indicate to a police HR rep? > > Anyway, it’s good to see that the police really care about the public they serve and that they have processes in place to weed out the bad cops… > > Oh, wait. > > [Here is the dash cam footage](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12y_twVJnbU). The violence begins at about the 2:00 minute mark. Well, he’s finally been [fired](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/17/us/ohio-police-fired-hubbard.html), and it seems that the only reason he was fired is the fact that there’s video and it went public. He has a history of terrible behavior, but never suffered anything more than a write-up from the department. > [@](#): > > According to documents obtained by The Associated Press, Mr. Amiott received four letters of reprimand and one formal citizen complaint in his three years as a Euclid officer, but he was never disciplined beyond written citations. > > He was cited for pistol-whipping a driver with a handgun, mishandling evidence, losing his temper in front of his commanding officer and being involved in two crashes in police vehicles, The A.P. reported. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11636 "2017-10-19T13:00:59Z")
Sorry; not feeling very diplomatic jut now. I am, however, very happy to see that [this scumbag was finally convicted](https://apnews.com/563920376d11478dbc0f981c3916eee7/Jury-convicts-ex-Oklahoma-police-officer-in-4th-murder-trial). > [@](#): > > A white former Oklahoma police officer was convicted of first-degree manslaughter late Wednesday in the off-duty fatal shooting of his daughter’s black boyfriend after jurors in three previous trials couldn’t decide whether to find him guilty of murder. > > Jurors deliberated about six hours before finding ex-Tulsa officer Shannon Kepler, 57, guilty of the lesser charge in the August 2014 killing of 19-year-old Jeremey Lake, who had just started dating Kepler’s then-18-year-old daughter, Lisa. > > The jury recommended a sentence of 15 years in prison. > [@](#): > > Prosecutors said Kepler first watched his daughter and Lake from his SUV before approaching them on the street. Lake’s aunt disputed Kepler’s self-defense account and has said her nephew was reaching out to shake Kepler’s hand to introduce himself when Kepler fired. > [@](#): > > Kepler told investigators Lake was armed and that he was acting in self-defense, but police didn’t find a weapon on Lake or at the scene. Kepler retired from the force after he was charged. So an off-duty cop killed the black guy that had just started dating his daughter, just shot him in cold blood right in front of her (what kind of message might that have been intended to send to her, eh) and then he lied about why he did it. But that just wasn’t enough for former-Officer Kepler; he had to try and take this to the next level: > [@](#): > > Another racial element had been recently added to the case when Kepler argued that he couldn’t be tried by state prosecutors because he’s a member of an American Indian tribe. A judge determined the fourth trial in less than a year could move forward in state court. Kepler says he’s 1/128th Muscogee (Creek). :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11637 "2017-10-19T13:04:37Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > The person who was shot had just run over the officer’s partner. This seems like about as good of a reason to shoot someone as you’ll get in this thread. > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > We do not employ the police to dole out punishment. > [@Bruce\_Wayne](#): > > I don’t agree with your characterization of the shooting being a “punishment”. She was still driving. You could argue that he was preventing her being a danger to anyone else. You could, but that wasn’t what I was replying to, was it? I didn’t characterize it as punishment, **BPC** did. I stand by my statement. And you should too, but it seems that maybe we don’t feel the same about the role of the police in society. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11638 "2017-10-19T18:20:57Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Sorry; not feeling very diplomatic jut now. I am, however, very happy to see that [this scumbag was finally convicted](https://apnews.com/563920376d11478dbc0f981c3916eee7/Jury-convicts-ex-Oklahoma-police-officer-in-4th-murder-trial). In any other situation, everyone would be disgusted about going to a _fourth_ trial because the previous three didn’t give the desired verdict. It still makes no sense that retrials like this don’t breach double jeopardy rules. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11639 "2017-10-19T18:58:41Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > In any other situation, everyone would be disgusted about going to a _fourth_ trial because the previous three didn’t give the desired verdict. It still makes no sense that retrials like this don’t breach double jeopardy rules. The previous three trials didn’t give _any_ verdict. They were mistrials. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11640 "2017-10-19T19:01:02Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > In any other situation, everyone would be disgusted about going to a _fourth_ trial because the previous three didn’t give the desired verdict. It still makes no sense that retrials like this don’t breach double jeopardy rules. What verdict was that? I thought that they were mistrials, in which case there was no verdict returned. Can you cite which of his trials returned a “not-guilty” verdict that would have made this a double jeopardy situation? ETA: ninja’d by Bayard. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2017, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/11641 "2017-10-19T19:09:07Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > ETA: Just watched [the video](http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/miami-beach/article177867966.html). Not sure she needed to be shot. I’ve never seen one of these vidoes that doesn’t scream ‘amateur policing’. Really, wtf is he doing standing in front of a crashing car with the driver at the wheel. It’s just pathetically piss poor. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=581) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=583)