# Controversial encounters between law-enforcement and civilians - the omnibus thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 10, 2014, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942 "2014-10-10T07:35:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 63
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1241 "2015-03-19T18:40:38Z")
Ah I’m being accused of being a brony… I’m not, and I’ve no idea why I should consider it offensive. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1242 "2015-03-19T18:46:12Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > … so believe me or not, it’s your choice. Tough one. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1243 "2015-03-19T18:51:33Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > I’m using his own views on race against him, where expressing any idea that could be construed in any way as negative towards a particular race is racism. He’s repeatedly said he trusts white people less than others. Which is understandable given that he’s from SA, but not defensible given his stated positions on race and racism. > > I’m not searching through thousands of posts to find one, so believe me or not, it’s your choice. I’m not searching through the posts either, so I’ll remain skeptical. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1244 "2015-03-19T20:36:51Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Except that you’ve admitted your dislike of Whitey on many occasions. Liar. Or do you have a link to me doing so _this_ time? Unlike the last time, when you just slunk away when pressed. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1245 "2015-03-19T20:38:18Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > He’s repeatedly said he trusts white people less than others. Liar. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1246 "2015-03-19T20:39:38Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > And I’ve no fucking idea what a “yiffer” is _Suuuuure_ you don’t 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1247 "2015-03-19T21:04:18Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Liar. No u. You just love to call people racists without a shred of fucking evidence, based on nothing but your projections of your own views onto theirs, but you’re incapable of looking at yourself the same way. Sad. pathetic moron that you are. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1248 "2015-03-19T22:56:56Z")
I had to google Yiffer. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1249 "2015-03-19T22:57:58Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > No u. > > You just love to call people racists without a shred of fucking evidence, based on nothing but your projections of your own views onto theirs, but you’re incapable of looking at yourself the same way. Sad. pathetic moron that you are. I’d love to see a cite – you made some rather specific claims about **MrDibble.** ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2015, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1250 "2015-03-19T23:33:24Z")
Well, [here](http://www.giraffeboards.com/showpost.php?p=1158182&postcount=6)’s the first obvious one where he makes it clear that he doesn’t give a shit about racism towards white people. Just read that whole thread if you’re bored, it’ll tell you a great deal about **Dibble**. And me, but I doubt you’ll need too much more evidence that I can be an abrasive cunt when provoked. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1251 "2015-03-20T00:03:20Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I had to google Rainbow Dash. 🙂 Me too. Am I better for it, though? And \* yif er\*? Yikes. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1252 "2015-03-20T00:09:56Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Ah I’m being accused of being a brony… I’m not, and I’ve no idea why I should consider it offensive. Hoofs Up… Don’t Shoe! ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1253 "2015-03-20T00:11:11Z")
Conservatives here seem to think you have to know a lot about a person to detect racism. You don’t really. Words and deeds are usually quite sufficient. See, it doesn’t matter if we can’t prove that you are a racist “in your heart” or whatever bullshit standard is thrown up. What you say and how you say it is quite enough. We don’t have to know whether you are a racist as a matter of status or identity. Acting racist is enough. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1254 "2015-03-20T00:15:49Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Acting racist is enough. That’s something I’ve said all along. However, some people seem to think that, despite someone neither saying or doing anything racist, they can read some sort of “code” that says they actually are. I’m glad to see you disagree with that sort of thinking, and will now take people at their word when they say they’re not racist. Especially if their deeds match that. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1255 "2015-03-20T00:16:02Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Well, [here](http://www.giraffeboards.com/showpost.php?p=1158182&postcount=6)’s the first obvious one where he makes it clear that he doesn’t give a shit about racism towards white people. Just read that whole thread if you’re bored, it’ll tell you a great deal about **Dibble**. And me, but I doubt you’ll need too much more evidence that I can be an abrasive cunt when provoked. I’m not particularly concerned about racism towards white people either (in the United States, anyway) – it certainly exists, but it’s nowhere near the problem that other forms of racism are, has a tiny fraction of the history of it, and has barely caused a smidgen of the grief that other forms of racism have caused. And that thread doesn’t tell me much about **MrDibble** that I didn’t already know. So I see nothing hear that he doesn’t trust “whitey” or anything comparable, nor do I see any actual racist statements by him. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1256 "2015-03-20T00:19:16Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > That’s something I’ve said all along. However, some people seem to think that, despite someone neither saying or doing anything racist, they can read some sort of “code” that says they actually are. > > I’m glad to see you disagree with that sort of thinking, and will now take people at their word when they say they’re not racist. Especially if their deeds match that. The difference (obviously) is which statements one thinks qualifies as “racist”. For example, I see the following statement (and many variations that say the same thing) as racist: “black people are inherently less intelligent on average due to their genetics”. It doesn’t matter, to me, whether the one saying it is a white guy in white sheets, or a black scientist in a lab – the statement is racist by itself. I also see the following statement (and its many variations) as racist (or bigoted, to be more specific): “Jews are inherently less trustworthy and more greedy on average due to their genetics”. It doesn’t matter, to me, whether the one saying it is a goosestepping asshole with a swastika tattoo or a Jewish scientist – the statement is bigoted by itself. What about you – do those statements qualify as racist/bigoted to you? ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1257 "2015-03-20T00:22:02Z")
Saying he doesn’t care about racism towards white people makes him _at least_ as racist as me, the standard I’m gonna use to judge him. Now, I think I’m not particularly racist, and if I am it’s unintentional and if it actually caused a problem I’d deal with it. But that, to **Dibble** , makes me almost Hitler. So he needs to accept he’s exactly the same. Basically, if you’re actually concerned about racism, you should be concerned about _all_ of it, and support measures towards equality that will make things better for all sufferers, whatever their race. Because if a white person has their life ruined by racism - even if it’s only one person in the whole country - they’re just as fucked as any black or brown person who the same thing happens to. And the same solutions should work for both instances - treat people as you find them, regardless of skin colour or racial identification. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1258 "2015-03-20T00:29:32Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Saying he doesn’t care about racism towards white people makes him _at least_ as racist as me, the standard I’m gonna use to judge him. Now, I think I’m not particularly racist, and if I am it’s unintentional and if it actually caused a problem I’d deal with it. But that, to **Dibble** , makes me almost Hitler. So he needs to accept he’s exactly the same. > > Basically, if you’re actually concerned about racism, you should be concerned about _all_ of it, and support measures towards equality that will make things better for all sufferers, whatever their race. Because if a white person has their life ruined by racism - even if it’s only one person in the whole country - they’re just as fucked as any black or brown person who the same thing happens to. And the same solutions should work for both instances - treat people as you find them, regardless of skin colour or racial identification. I don’t know if you’re racist. I don’t recall any racist statements by you, off the top of my head. But not being particularly concerned about anti-white racism is _not racism_ – that just reeks of “anti-racism is code for anti-white”… racism has a history, and it’s not an “even” or “balanced” history. It’s reasonable to be most concerned with the forms of racism that have actually caused immense suffering and grief, and to not be as concerned with the forms that have caused a relatively miniscule amount of suffering and grief. I’m not that concerned about anti-white racism _in society_ or _as an institutional problem_. It doesn’t mean that I (and presumably **MrDibble** ) don’t have sympathy for a white guy who is beaten because he’s white – that sucks just as much as any black guy getting beaten for being black. But I’m not as concerned with the former as a problem in society because _it has happened much, much less often_ than the latter, and has caused so much less grief than the latter. Are you as concerned with women raping men as you are with men raping women? I certainly am not, even though the former occasionally happens, and when it does, it’s as bad as the latter. But I’m just not nearly as concerned with it as a _societal problem_, because it’s so much less of a problem in society. Does that make sense? ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1259 "2015-03-20T00:29:35Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > What about you – do those statements qualify as racist/bigoted to you? We were talking about whether people are racist, not statements, and that’s a fundamental difference in my opinion. If the scientist finds proof of that statement, then they are not racist to point it out, because it’s true. And the race of the scientist is irrelevant. Fundamentally, what matters is whether a statement is true or false. Whether different groups have different genetic predispositions to intelligence, and whether those groups correlate with race, are (theoretically) testable propositions. Statements, ultimately, are neither racist nor non-racist, because racism is a property of behaviour (and by extension, the people behaving). So, what you need to judge is whether the _utterance_ of the statement is racist behaviour. And this is where the difference between the guy in the sheet and the scientist comes in. One is uttering a statement the have no reason to believe is true, for the purpose of white supremacy. The other is uttering a statement he reasonably believes to be true, for the purpose of scientific advancement. A term that includes both types of speech, and denigrates both of them equally, is so broad as to be meaningless, in my opinion. Which is a very longwinded way to say “no, they’re not”. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942/1260 "2015-03-20T00:35:40Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Does that make sense? Yes, absolutely. But that’s not the standard **MrDibble** has used to (repeatedly) call me racist. I’m pointing out that, by his own standards, he’s racist. I’m about as concerned about racism towards whites as I am with anti-straight discrimination - it happens, but whatever consideration it gets should be included with concerns about prejudice in general, they don’t need their own movement or whatever. However, it’s important to be careful with things like that. One example would be domestic violence, which has traditionally (and with some good reason) been treated as a problem for women only. However, at least a quarter of victims here in the UK are men, usually from female partners but also gays, and there is almost no provisions for them. The amount of shelter beds is a fraction of a percent of that for women, and it’s treated as a joke mostly. Point being, if ever there is a credible claim of discrimination in a different way to normal, it shouldn’t be dismissed out of hand. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=62) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/controversial-encounters-between-law-enforcement-and-civilians-the-omnibus-thread/700942.md?page=64)