# Convince me not to convert to Islam. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 7, 2008, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133 "2008-12-07T15:14:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/301 "2008-12-16T01:31:11Z")
> [@Thing\_Fish](#): > > I start from the premise that all religions (and non-religious philosophies, meditative practices, etc.) offer valuable opportunities for spiritual growth; one may be better than another for a particular person at a particular time, but none has a monopoly on truth. Oh, but Islam _does_ have the monopoly on truth. Just ask them! They are the one true religion, and the rest of us are filthy infidels. Do you even know the first thing about Islam? Conceit like that, in the infallibility of Islam, is why people can be motivated to blow themselves up in marketplaces, and riot in the streets when somebody draws a cartoon. Islam: childish, dangerous, and wrong. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/302 "2008-12-16T01:32:05Z")
> [@Stan\_Shmenge](#): > > Oh, but Islam _does_ have the monopoly on truth. Just ask them! They are the one true religion, and the rest of us are filthy infidels. Do you even know the first thing about Islam? > > Conceit like that, in the infallibility of Islam, is why people can be motivated to blow themselves up in marketplaces, and riot in the streets when somebody draws a cartoon. > > Islam: childish, dangerous, and wrong. Because no other religion ever thinks they have a monopoly on truth? ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/303 "2008-12-16T01:37:14Z")
And quite frankly, I think the OP is a typical “Angry Young Man” ™ and probably just needs to get laid. Have much luck with the ladies, do you? This is not an insult, I legitimately think it is a big part of the whole Islam problem. Imagine being a guy (or a girl, for that matter) living under sharia. I’d be pissed off and marching in the streets and burning stuff too! ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/304 "2008-12-16T01:45:02Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Because no other religion ever thinks they have a monopoly on truth? As an atheist, I think all religions are a bunch of hot gas. I was responding to the previous poster who was asserting that “all monotheistic religions are pretty much the same and none has the monopoly on truth”. Well, Islam, even more than the others, makes it a sticking point that they in fact DO have the monopoly on truth, and everyone else on the planet must eventually convert or be murdered. That is so crazy, that it is identical to the policies of L. Ron Hubbard. The Christians, at least, have come out of the dark ages, where Islam is still, seemingly, permanently entrenched. And again, I don’t understand the reason of the OP asking the question. Either you are gullible enough and believe some fool religion, or you aren’t. Like I said upthread, this isn’t like signing up for a record club. It is a matter of faith. If you believe that Mohamed was the prophet, you are a Muslim. If you don’t believe it, you are not. End of story. To “talk him out of it” would require that we prove that Mohamed was not a prophet. I have neither the expertise or inclination to do that. ---
**Author:** ![spinky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@spinky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spinky)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/305 "2008-12-16T02:00:42Z")
> [@Stan\_Shmenge](#): > > Islam, even more than the others, makes it a sticking point that they in fact DO have the monopoly on truth, and **everyone else on the planet must eventually convert or be murdered**. (bolding mine) I was under the impression that this was a misconception. Can you educate me by providing a cite? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/306 "2008-12-16T02:34:00Z")
> [@Stan\_Shmenge](#): > > The Christians, at least, have come out of the dark ages, where Islam is still, seemingly, permanently entrenched. I think it’s more that Christians as a group have got it made, so they don’t rock many boats. It’s not a difference in the religion. It’s a difference in the economics of the areas the religions happen to be centered in. ---
**Author:** ![blinkthrice](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ba8739/32.png) [@blinkthrice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blinkthrice)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/307 "2008-12-16T02:48:04Z")
> [@Stan\_Shmenge](#): > > And quite frankly, I think the OP is a typical “Angry Young Man” ™ and probably just needs to get laid. Have much luck with the ladies, do you? > > This is not an insult, I legitimately think it is a big part of the whole Islam problem. Imagine being a guy (or a girl, for that matter) living under sharia. I’d be pissed off and marching in the streets and burning stuff too! Right, because I’m sure a guy named “Stan” gets all the chicks. You must be some sort of clown, or too lazy to read the thread and notice where I mentioned that I live with my girlfriend. Prior to “settling down” a bit, if you must know, I’ve never had a problem in that area. And with all due respect, the most adamant of atheists that I’ve come across are insecure geeks with bad skin, zero game, and terrible attitudes. Me thinks you’ve got it a little backwards. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/308 "2008-12-16T03:11:47Z")
Stan Shmenge is a handle I use here, based on the character on SCTV. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/309 "2008-12-16T03:14:02Z")
> [@ntucker](#): > > Can you educate me by providing a cite? Death to the Infidels! Death to the United States, the great Satan! Death to those who dare insult the prophet, yaddah yaddah yaddah. I guess they are chanting that for their health. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/310 "2008-12-16T03:25:15Z")
> [@blinkthrice](#): > > I mentioned that I live with my girlfriend. So, are you going to slap a burka on her when you convert? Or let her keep dressing like a western whore? Does she get any say in the matter? Will you let her out of the house without a male relative? Cause all the women I know are so into being downpressed and treated like infants. Also, she is committing adultery, so now it is time to stone her as well. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/311 "2008-12-16T03:57:05Z")
Oh, and to clarify for **ntucker** , the Koran has whole passages about it is a great idea to kill the infidel, but it isn’t really killing because it is actually Allah doing the murdering. This is the basis for their utterly false claim that they aren’t told to kill in the Koran. Any killing is simply the will of the invisible man in the sky! Remember, the Koran also advises lying to and tricking the unclean unbelievers. ---
**Author:** ![LurkMeister](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3da27b/32.png) [@LurkMeister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LurkMeister)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/312 "2008-12-16T03:57:44Z")
> [@Stan\_Shmenge](#): > > Death to the Infidels! Death to the United States, the great Satan! Death to those who dare insult the prophet, yaddah yaddah yaddah. I guess they are chanting that for their health. That is not a cite. That is quoting fanatics who make up a small percentage of the world’s believers in Islam, who get a lot of press. I could just as easily say that all Christians are nutjobs because of Fred Phelps and his ilk. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/313 "2008-12-16T03:59:04Z")
And the argument comes down to who gets laid the least. I guess it was inevitable. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/314 "2008-12-16T04:09:08Z")
> [@LurkMeister](#): > > That is not a cite. That is quoting fanatics who make up a small percentage of the world’s believers in Islam, who get a lot of press. I could just as easily say that all Christians are nutjobs because of Fred Phelps and his ilk. Phelps doesn’t exactly draw the same crowds. Islam regularly fills the streets with millions over things like silly cartoons. The shoe thrower is now a big hero in that part of the world. Listen, if the OP can be talked out of this by a few posts on this board, his faith was weak. Again, this isn’t like joining Columbia House, or a bridge club. Either the OP believes that Mohammad was the prophet or he doesn’t. So, which is it? Or this is all one big troll thread. Now he is bragging about chicks he banged and his live-in girlfriend. Sounds like a pious muslim to me! ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/315 "2008-12-16T05:52:25Z")
> [@Stan\_Shmenge](#): > > Or this is all one big troll thread. Now he is bragging about chicks he banged and his live-in girlfriend. Sounds like a pious muslim to me! OK. Enough. You are free to post your incredibly ignorant and biased views of Islam under the thought that there are enough posters who can and will point out your obvious errors. However, when you begin insulting other posters, you are in violation of this forum’s rules. Knock it off. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/316 "2008-12-16T08:21:44Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > I think it’s more that Christians as a group have got it made, so they don’t rock many boats. > > It’s not a difference in the religion. It’s a difference in the economics of the areas the religions happen to be centered in. Maybe some areas are “better off” in many ways BECAUSE that religion actually WORKS better overall? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/317 "2008-12-16T08:46:34Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Maybe some areas are “better off” in many ways BECAUSE that religion actually WORKS better overall? Maybe. But I would want to see a rigorous analysis that suggests that: I suspect you got nothing. Buddhism is in Japan (rich) and India (poor). Christianity is in the US (rich) and Africa (poor). Secularism dominates Europe (rich), Russia (middling) and China (poor but growing at an enormous rate). ## So I guess secularism wins. Also, I opine that Thing Fish gave a [terrific treatment](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10574518&postcount=300) of some of the considerations that any adult convert should consider. Kudos. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/318 "2008-12-16T11:25:13Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > What’s to elaborate? Well… I was wondering who got called “Arab Jew” and what was the underlying assumption that made it offensive. For instance, I thought that it might mean “Sephardic jew”, implying that those were trash. Or that it might mean “Arab lovers”, implying that those were traitors. And it wasn’t obvious that it was universally considered as derogatory, as opposed to being an Israeli idiosyncrasy. ---
**Author:** ![Stan\_Shmenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/94ad74/32.png) [@Stan\_Shmenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stan_Shmenge)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/319 "2008-12-16T11:31:34Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > OK. Enough. > > You are free to post your incredibly ignorant and biased views of Islam under the thought that there are enough posters who can and will point out your obvious errors. However, when you begin insulting other posters, you are in violation of this forum’s rules. > > Knock it off. > > [/Moderating] I am not sure where the insult is. I raised the possibility that the OP might be a troll, and questioned his piety. HE is the one talking about being a hit with the ladies, and how I am probably a pasty faced nerd with no “game”. What’s next? Bragging about the awesome kegger he had with his pals last weekend, praise Allah! I think **Thing Fish** had it right when he said “I would strongly suggest that you experiment with following these practices for a significant period of time before formally converting.” So, for starters, the OP either has to give the live-in GF the heave-ho, or make an honest woman of her. Islam takes a pretty dim view of shacking up. As far as statements about Islam I have made in this thread, every one can be backed with verses from the suras. It would be a good thing if more westerners were familiar with the contents of that book, so that they might know the threat Islam poses to the civilized. It doesn’t take much looking to find all kinds of stuff about nonbelievers and how they should be treated, stuff about Jews, etc. The OP asked to be talked out of joining Islam, not be re-assured that it is an OK fine thing to do. So that is what I am here to do. I would no more recommend it than I would joining Scientology. In fact, as I think about it, the two have a lot in common. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2008, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133/320 "2008-12-16T11:46:34Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Well… I was wondering who got called “Arab Jew” and what was the underlying assumption that made it offensive. > For instance, I thought that it might mean “Sephardic jew”, implying that those were trash. Or that it might mean “Arab lovers”, implying that those were traitors. > And it wasn’t obvious that it was universally considered as derogatory, as opposed to being an Israeli idiosyncrasy. I don’t think it’s much of a secret that Jews and Arabs don’t really get along these days. Is it so surprising that calling a Mizrachi (Oriental) Jew an Arab would be cause for offense? Besides, it’s not a term Jews, or anyone with any awareness of Jewish culture, ever uses. Coining new terms to define things that already have a proper definition is often regarded with suspicion - and rightfully so, as it’s rarely done in good faith. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/convince-me-not-to-convert-to-islam/476133.md?page=17)