# Cormac McCarthy has died (13 June 2023) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** celebrity-death, books-writing-myths\ **Created:** [June 13, 2023, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448 "2023-06-13T19:49:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2023, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/21 "2023-06-13T23:39:51Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > If No Country left you sad, then Cormac McCarthy is not for you. I’d say this is true for all his books except last year’s _The Passenger_. It’s not a cheery book by any means, but there are dare I say fun characters and none of the brutality you find in his other works. I actually found myself laughing out loud in a few places, a first for one of his books. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2023, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/22 "2023-06-13T23:59:47Z")
_Blood Meridien_ is the novel that made me decide to write novels. An amazing writer. RIP. ---
**Author:** ![Galactus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galactus/32/3581_2.png) [@Galactus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Galactus)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/23 "2023-06-14T00:10:02Z")
Another vote for _Blood Meridien_, it is one of my favorite Cormac McCarthy novels. His voice will be missed. ---
**Author:** ![Section\_Maker\_Jupe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/section_maker_jupe/32/1424_2.png) [@Section\_Maker\_Jupe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Section_Maker_Jupe)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/24 "2023-06-14T00:50:44Z")
I just noticed that Blood Meridien is being made into a movie. I’m going to read The Passenger, Ive only read No Country ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/25 "2023-06-14T03:25:25Z")
Ok, just for reference, if on a despair scale from 1-10 No Country is a 3, Se7en is a 7, The Road and Blood Meridian are 9.5s. ---
**Author:** ![Blindmellowjelly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindmellowjelly/32/13920_2.png) [@Blindmellowjelly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blindmellowjelly)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/26 "2023-06-14T05:37:33Z")
RIP to a chaotic-good mind. Had enough to ripple the waters. ---
**Author:** ![TheTooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/919ad9/32.png) [@TheTooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheTooth)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/27 "2023-06-14T06:01:10Z")
I’ve only read The Road, and there’s either something wrong with it or something wrong with me. I thought it was excellent but I didn’t find it nearly as glum as I thought I would. Yeah, they’re wet. Yeah, they’re cold. But I didn’t really feel it. It was like reading a Chekhov play: “Are you cold?” “Yes.” “Should we stop?” “Yes. I’m cold.” “We’ll stop. It’s cold.” Maybe it’s just me. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/28 "2023-06-14T10:52:03Z")
> [@TheTooth](#): > > Maybe it’s just me. I felt pretty much the same way. Then again, I don’t remember anything about a tree full of dead babies. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/29 "2023-06-14T11:36:39Z")
Don’t want to yuck anyone’s yum, but - as you’ve said - he was not for everyone. I was awed by All the Pretty Horses when I discovered it with no foreknowledge. Proceeded to read everything he wrote up through The Crossing - when I gave up. My favorites were the least Cormac-like ones, like Suttree, Orchard Keeper, ATPH. I didn’t get the point of BM at all. Just found it an endless string or horrors. And yes, the dead babies is one image that stickes with me decades later. The Road? Just bleakness followed by more bleakness, piled under a lot more bleakness. His writing, with the lack of punctuation and the unnecessary use of $10 words (I’ve never encountered an author I had to read with a dictionary so readily at hand) - impressedme as somewhat self indulgent. But a lot of others - here and elsewhere - clearly felt otherwise. I suspected his books were bought and praised more than they were read. ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/30 "2023-06-14T12:13:00Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Undeniably depressing, but [my god that man could write.](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fyhw6lwWIAAPRZ-?format=jpg&name=small) That’s a great representative passage of his style. It could be engraved on his tombstone. BTW, I looked it up since it has no attribution in that link. I was guessing ‘Blood Meridian’, but it’s ‘The Road’. > [@TheTooth](#): > > I’ve only read The Road, and there’s either something wrong with it or something wrong with me. I thought it was excellent but I didn’t find it nearly as glum as I thought I would. Yeah, they’re wet. Yeah, they’re cold. But I didn’t really feel it. Really? in a world that takes place 10 years after an unnamed disaster that killed off almost all life, even all vegetation, and most of the few remaining survivors have turned to killing and cannibalizing the other survivors just to keep living, a man and his son try not to turn to the dark side by scrounging the few remaining canned goods and hiding from or fighting off murder cannibals. And your reaction was “eh, not so bad.”?!? I want your upbeat attitude when the apocalypse arrives! ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/31 "2023-06-14T14:15:18Z")
I’m guessing there’s a correlation to how _The Road_ impacts people and if they have kids. My kids were around the same age as the boy when I read it, and it was devastating. The scene where the cannibals are looking for the two as they hide in a ditch, and the man is planning to use his one bullet on his son if they are found…I couldn’t stop thinking about that for weeks. Yes, it’s been done before (_The Mist_), but the way McCarthy wrote it, I felt every second of that scene in my bones. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/32 "2023-06-14T14:20:07Z")
> [@Jay\_Z](#): > > > [@solost](#): > > > > I 100% agree with @Alessan’s assessment of ‘The Road’. > > > > Not too difficult to understand-- it’s an amazingly well-written apocalyptic novel that is unrelenting in its bleakness and cruelty. > > I never really saw the point in reading it once I knew what it was. Just seems like a variety of porn, reveling in a certain state. I actually thought _The Road_ was _not_ was “unrelenting in its bleakness and cruelty” as it’s often touted as, or as I went into it expecting it to be. It is, after all, a story of two people trying to survive in a post-apocalyptic wasteland, so of course it’s bleak and miserable, but that comes with the genre, and I think it works as a sort of adventure story. > [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > He also doesn’t use a lot of punctuation. He’s not an easy read. I listened to the audiobook of _The Road_, which I think made it easier. ---
**Author:** ![Jay\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Jay\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jay_Z)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/33 "2023-06-14T15:04:45Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I actually thought _The Road_ was _not_ was “unrelenting in its bleakness and cruelty” as it’s often touted as, or as I went into it expecting it to be. It is, after all, a story of two people trying to survive in a post-apocalyptic wasteland, so of course it’s bleak and miserable, but that comes with the genre, and I think it works as a sort of adventure story. I’m not opposed to the genre, but there are different takes on it. The Last Man On Earth/Omega Man/I Am Legend is in the same genre. But I think the portrayal there is less bleak. And arguably more realistic. A virus that affects most of mammalia (though likely some will survive in certain areas and recover) seems more plausible than people wandering around for very long after something that has killed all vegetation. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/34 "2023-06-14T19:13:52Z")
So, is there any positive message from Blood Meridian? Border Trilogy? The Crossing? No Country? The Road? So much of his writing just impressed me as unending bleakness. Yes, certain parts were beautifully written (tho, as I said, I thought much of it unnecessarily opaque. Of course, I am too ignorant to appreciate Faulkner or Joyce.) But what is the message other than _“Life sucks. People are assholes. You can try your best and try to be a good person, but you are likely going to lose - and lose horribly - in the end”_? I get enough ugliness and unpleasantness in my daily life that I don’t need to seek it out for entertainment. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/35 "2023-06-14T19:51:28Z")
It’s a really good question, and I’m not sure I have a good answer. Hopefully others can articulate it better than me. Off the top of my head, there are individual aspects of each book that take it way beyond a general “humanity is terrible” message. I wouldn’t say any books have a positive message, instead there are things that I consider positives in contributing to my enjoyment of a book. The Border Trilogy has very likable characters and taut plots. You really root for the characters, albeit almost always unsuccessfully. _No Country_ is a gripping thriller wrapped around a relatable feeling of getting old and being “too old for this shit.” The relationship between the father and son in _The Road_ and their attempts to “keep the fire” (be good) while the world around them goes to hell is absolutely beautiful. _Blood Meridian_ is a good antidote to the westerns with heroic characters, and although true of all his books, the prose in it is sublime. I don’t understand every word in it, but I don’t have to, because I _feel_ it. My wife prefers happier books and movies, and can’t understand why I like books like this. I think it’s because I read a happy book, and think, that’s not realistic. It’s strangely affirming to have my worldview supported by a depressing book, with a little dose of “geez, I thought I was a pessimist, but at least I’m not as bad as _that_.” You see ugliness and unpleasantness in daily life and think “I don’t need more of that in my entertainment” - a very valid feeling. I read McCarthy and think “phew, it’s not just me. I’m not seeing things when I notice the ugliness.” Which actually makes me feel better. Reading back over this, maybe I need therapy. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/36 "2023-06-14T20:34:15Z")
I like literature that is less than rainbows and puppies. My favorite writer is Harry Crews, with my faves of his The Gypsy’s Curse and Feast of Snakes. (If you are unfamiliar, you should correct that.) Like you say, the Crossing had some likeable characters that you rooted for - and they all eventually lost. No Country, I just had a problem with the bad guy as the unexplained unstoppable force. Just took me out of it. The Road - I dunno. I failed to see the beauty. BM - I failed to get much other than the apparent bottomless descriptions of man’s capacity for inhumanity. Like I said, I REALLY liked ATPH. And really liked Suttree - except for the brief impenetrable passages. At some point, I woulda listed him as one of my favorite authors. But I enjoyed it less and less as I read more and more. Good thing there are enough books out there that we can each find something we enjoy. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/37 "2023-06-14T20:38:55Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > _Blood Meridian_ is a good antidote to the westerns with heroic characters, and although true of all his books, the prose in it is sublime. I don’t understand every word in it, but I don’t have to, because I _feel_ it. I can see that. I’m afraid my favorite western writer is still McMurtry. I recently reread all of the Lonesome Dove books in order and enjoyed them ever bit as much as the first time around. ---
**Author:** ![TheTooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/919ad9/32.png) [@TheTooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheTooth)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/38 "2023-06-14T21:07:32Z")
Yup, really. But I don’t think it’s a result of my sunny disposition, I rather think other peoples’ reactions to the book are a result of theirs. I need new editions of The Second Chronicles of Thomas Covenant because I’ve worn mine out. ---
**Author:** ![Jay\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Jay\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jay_Z)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/39 "2023-06-14T22:00:05Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Like you say, the Crossing had some likeable characters that you rooted for - and they all eventually lost. No Country, I just had a problem with the bad guy as the unexplained unstoppable force. Just took me out of it. The Road - I dunno. I failed to see the beauty. BM - I failed to get much other than the apparent bottomless descriptions of man’s capacity for inhumanity. You asked earlier about were there any positives in his books. I think some people consider the father son relationship in The Road a positive. IMO McCarthy sought out bleakness, had an affinity for it. I don’t think his vision in this regard is any truer than anyone else’s. Certainly not to the lengths that he took it. As I said upthread, I don’t even know if the world in The Road is possible, I think everyone would have died fairly quickly in a world toxic enough to kill all vegetation. But it’s a world McCarthy wanted to write about. You can make a movie about Charles Manson and have it end after his murders and before his arrest. Portray the murders in grueling, unrelenting fashion. Is it “true”? Yes and no. I do think there it’s an incomplete worldview and bias on the part of the author. ---
**Author:** ![Southern\_Yankee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/southern_yankee/32/2800_2.png) [@Southern\_Yankee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Southern_Yankee)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2023, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448/40 "2023-06-14T22:22:29Z")
_The Road_ **affected** me. It stayed with me for weeks after I read it. I can’t recall too many other books that did that to me. As one poster above mentioned, having sons of my own colored my experience for sure. R.I.P. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cormac-mccarthy-has-died-13-june-2023/985448.md?page=3)