# Corporal Punishment - Yay or nay? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 8, 2008, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075 "2008-10-08T21:51:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/81 "2008-10-09T17:32:37Z")
Kids are powerless. They rely on their parents for food,clothing,training and education.,for everything Then their parents beat them. The lesson is it OK to hit those less powerful. Smack dependents, show then who the boss is. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/82 "2008-10-09T17:39:09Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Are the people in this thread who are totally against corporal punishment also extreme pacifists? Hell, no! Personally, I am in favor of the death penalty in murder cases. I have also been in a coupla fist fights, although I did not provoke the fight. (He started it!!!) I just could never hit my kids. When my daughter was 5 or 6, I can’t remember what she did, but it was remarkable. Maybe involved lying. I sighed and told her I was disappointed in her. She cried like I broke her heart. At the time, I would have given anything to take back my words. Hit her? I’d rather take a bullet. ---
**Author:** ![Jayn\_Newell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Jayn\_Newell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jayn_Newell)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/83 "2008-10-09T18:05:54Z")
I like what **WhyNot** said about it being the ‘nuclear option’. That’s how it was treated in my home. Overall I’ve always been a pretty obedient kid, but I also have a fairly big stubborn streak. Spanking was never the first resort–it was used when I simply refused to listen to reinforce that I wasn’t the one in control. I could probably count how many times it happened on one hand. It was traumatic at the time, but I know now that I deserved it when it did happen and that I could have avoided it–I just chose not to. I don’t have kids yet, but I’ll probably be the same with them when I do–if I do resort to spanking, it’ll be after other measures have failed. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/84 "2008-10-09T18:06:50Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > Spanking, in most places in the U.S., is not illegal. In some places it is, though. And in most places when a spanking crosses the line into a beating, or a brutal beating, it may constitute assault. Why not test it out by asking your local constabulary if you’ve committed a crime? If you’ve done nothing wrong, he’ll just tell you, “I’m busy, don’t bother me with such petty stuff,” and you’re good (in the law’s lights). But offenders are very poor judges of their transgressions, and great justifiers of them, so why not try getting an independent view? Even if you get arrested (unlikely, but possible) you’ll get a hearing before a judge to determine if you’ve broken the law. Again, there’s no danger to you, because every court in the land views spanking as a desirable parenting tool, so why not take the chance and prove me wrong? I hope, of course, that you get a fair-minded judge who’ll prove me right, but you maintain, I think, that no court in land would see this issue my way. You just lack the courage to test my thesis out, I suspect. Go ahead, try it the next time you spank your kid, and report back–if you have internet access where you’re going. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/85 "2008-10-09T19:21:13Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > In some places it is, though. It is? Where? (I’m not being snarky, I really didn’t think that spanking - not beating - was illegal when done by parents. Schools are another story, of course.) ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/86 "2008-10-09T20:08:53Z")
Ok this is going to make me sound like grandpa simpson but i firmly believe that the rise in “never spank your children” parenting has had a very direct and noticeable result in the amount of horrible children running around. I’m sorry but your method doesn’t work, at all. I’m sure your children are great, don’t get me wrong there is plenty of adorable well behaved darlings out there. But most children i see in public SHOULD be getting regular beatings. Now get off my lawn. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/87 "2008-10-09T20:17:14Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > In some places it is Where? Cite? Not saying you’re wrong. Just want to see some specific statutes. > [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > though. And in most places when a spanking crosses the line into a beating, or a brutal beating, it may constitute assault. Why not test it out by asking your local constabulary if you’ve committed a crime? And once again, a smack on the ass is not a beating or even a BRUTAL BEATING. You’re equating 2 different things. You may feel a spanking=brutal beating, but the law doesn’t! > [@DigitalC](#): > > Ok this is going to make me sound like grandpa simpson but i firmly believe that the rise in “never spank your children” parenting has had a very direct and noticeable result in the amount of horrible children running around. I’m sorry but your method doesn’t work, at all. I’m sure your children are great, don’t get me wrong there is plenty of adorable well behaved darlings out there. But most children i see in public SHOULD be getting regular beatings. Now get off my lawn. My aunt use to have a saying that went something like _“beat your kids everyday. If you don’t know why, THEY do”._ That’s a joke folks, a joke. I don’t endorse “beating” kids. It’s a joke ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/88 "2008-10-09T20:25:47Z")
> [@Brandon](#): > > ust how out of line do you consider corporal punishment? Do you believe a zero-tolerance approach is best or is it acceptable if it is done within reason? Count me in the latter column. It is sometimes necessary to demonstrate to children that sometimes push comes to shove. Also, it is a lesser evil for one’s father to deck you than you be electrocuted (arguably this is a reaction more than a punishment). But in each case, the punishment must be for the child’s eventual benefit; if it’s not for the child’s benefit then it’s not okay. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/89 "2008-10-09T20:27:17Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Ok this is going to make me sound like grandpa simpson but i firmly believe that the rise in “never spank your children” parenting has had a very direct and noticeable result in the amount of horrible children running around. I’m sorry but your method doesn’t work, at all. I’m sure your children are great, don’t get me wrong there is plenty of adorable well behaved darlings out there. But most children i see in public SHOULD be getting regular beatings. Now get off my lawn. Agreed. “Never spank your children” is stupid and will result in a lot of really shitty human beings. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2008, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/90 "2008-10-09T23:49:45Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > Where? Cite? Not saying you’re wrong. Just want to see some specific statutes. Why? You already admitted that spanking is illegal in some places in the U.S.: [QUOTE=you] Spanking, in most places in the U.S., is not illegal. [/QUOTE] If spanking is legal most places (not “everywhere,” but “most places”) in the U.S., then by your definition it’s illegal some places in the U.S. IOW, your post is my cite. ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/91 "2008-10-10T00:17:04Z")
I cannot find a single law on the matter that doesn’t use phrases like “excessive”. Others say things like “reasonable” physical force is allowed. Others define abuse directly, which spanking doesn’t meet. I know my own state (MA) tried to pass an anti-spanking law but it didn’t pass, to the best of my knowledge. [The definition of abuse](http://www.mass.gov/?pageID=eohhs2terminal&L=5&L0=Home&L1=Consumer&L2=Family+Services&L3=Violence%2c+Abuse+or+Neglect&L4=Child+Abuse+and+Neglect&sid=Eeohhs2&b=terminalcontent&f=dss_c_can_definitions&csid=Eeohhs2) is: “the non-accidental commission of any act by a caretaker upon a child under age 18 which causes, or creates a substantial risk of, physical or emotional injury; or constitutes a sexual offense under the laws of the Commonwealth; or any sexual contact between a caretaker and a child under the care of that individual. This definition is not dependent upon location (i.e., abuse can occur while the child is in an out-of-home or in-home setting.” Physical injury: “Death; or fracture of a bone, subdural hematoma, burns, impairment of any organ, and any other such nontrivial injury; or soft tissue swelling or skin bruising, depending upon such factors as the child’s age, circumstances under which the injury occurred and the number and location of bruises; or addiction to a drug or drugs at birth; or failure to thrive.” I suppose one might suggest spanking results in “soft tissue swelling or skin bruising,” but I’m skeptical this law would get a parent busted for child abuse. Here’s a sort of terrible cite on other states I dug up: [蜂の子をネット購入するときは、ここに注意](http://www.familyrightsassociation.com/info/spanking_laws.htm) They’re, like, a bit overly excited about spanking kids. Anyway, I can’t find anything substantive. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/92 "2008-10-10T00:27:43Z")
I use spanking for my child like New Hampshire uses the death penalty. It is there as an option for an egregious offense, and she knows that. But, in practice, I never use it anymore. I’m not against it at all, if that is what it takes to make your child behave, but it is far more effective punishment more me to take away her toys, her TV, or her friends for a while. That hurts her more than any spanking I could give. YMMV, IANAL, and as a kid I had my ass blistered more times than…well at lot of times. And I think that these people who equate corporal punishment with child abuse are not very well adjusted human beings if they cannot make the distinction between the two… ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/93 "2008-10-10T00:31:32Z")
Oh, I can see the distinction. When you whack your helpless child, it’s a character-building introduction to discipline and responsibility. When someone else whacks his helpless child, it might be child abuse–but what do you care, cuz it’s a private family matter anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Oregon\_sunshine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/50afbb/32.png) [@Oregon\_sunshine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oregon_sunshine)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/94 "2008-10-10T00:46:02Z")
Really and truly, I thought no one ever read my posts. So, has anyone taken the time yet to _really_ remember what it was like to be a small child and to get “spanked”? ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/95 "2008-10-10T00:52:12Z")
> [@Oregon\_sunshine](#): > > Really and truly, I thought no one ever read my posts. So, has anyone taken the time yet to _really_ remember what it was like to be a small child and to get “spanked”? Sure I remember. I remember it happening twice, and I remember crying. I remember being very, very sorry for whatever it was I had done (it was clear to me at the time, but I don’t remember now) and I didn’t do whatever it was again. I did have a fondness for spanking in a sexual context in college - think it was related? (I don’t.) ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/96 "2008-10-10T01:00:50Z")
I am fairly sure I was spanked twice, but I only remember the one time, for drinking beer. It (the spanking experience) was terrible. I never even felt the urge to drink beer until my “rebellious” teens. I remember there was this terrible, neverending moment of dread before the spanking, even though the whole experience (from “I was caught” to “spanking over”) couldn’t have lasted more than like two minutes. For me, it was effective. I won’t irresponsibly generalize only from my own case and say it is therefore always effective or must be effective for all people or etc. ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/97 "2008-10-10T01:01:22Z")
I was never spanked as a child. However, I clearly remember what it was like to be “spoken to severely” about my misdemeanors - generally, soul-witheringly, sink-into-the-ground awful. Which, I guess, is kind of the point - as a punishment, it’s _supposed_ to feel bad, is it not? Is a slap on teh hand really so much worse? (personally, I often thought I would have preferred that. Whether it would have taught me right from wrong better is another matter) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/98 "2008-10-10T01:20:28Z")
I am in favor of flogging, Wednesdays, round at my place. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/99 "2008-10-10T01:38:50Z")
> [@Oregon\_sunshine](#): > > Really and truly, I thought no one ever read my posts. So, has anyone taken the time yet to _really_ remember what it was like to be a small child and to get “spanked”? It hurt. It sucked. It made me not want to do what it was that got me spanked. Ergo, it worked. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2008, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075/100 "2008-10-10T01:55:08Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > I remember being very, very sorry for whatever it was I had done (it was clear to me at the time, but I don’t remember now) Oh! I remember one of the infractions: for some odd reason, I lied to my mother and told her that Jane had been over and took Daddy and I to see that movie that I wanted to see while Mommy was at a class. Unbeknownst to me but knownst to Mommy, Daddy had been having an affair with Jane. :smack: Mommy went OFF on Daddy, and then when they figured out I was lying, I got a spanking. Only fight my parents had in 14 years of marriage, followed by a spanking (and a divorce a few months later). In retrospect, hearing them fight had me far more upset than the spanking. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/corporal-punishment-yay-or-nay/467075.md?page=6)