# Could Congress Kill The Judiciary? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 15, 2025, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074 "2025-04-15T16:09:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/1 "2025-04-15T16:09:41Z")
By withholding funding? It’s that simple. What would happen if Congress zeroed out the budget for the federal judiciary and the president signed the spending bill? Wouldn’t that effectively shut down the system? Could anything be done about it? ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/2 "2025-04-15T16:12:41Z")
There was once a time when such a hypothetical would be met with a “don’t be stupid”. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/3 "2025-04-15T16:25:39Z")
Except for the Supreme Court which is established in the Constitution, Congress has sole power to establish inferior courts so I presume they could kill off all of them except for SCOTUS as long as they don’t fire the out-of-work judges (put them on a sinecure?) unless Congress impeaches/convicts all of them. ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/4 "2025-04-15T16:28:06Z")
But even SCOTUS needs money. Maybe the justices would work without pay, but a quick Google search indicates they have 500 employees, and of course they have to pay electric bills, heat the building, buy pens, paper, laptops… ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/5 "2025-04-15T16:30:12Z")
> [@OldOlds](#): > > But even SCOTUS needs money. Maybe the justices would work without pay, The Justices need to be paid without a reduction in salary as per Article III. Nothing demands that Congress pay for anything else. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/6 "2025-04-15T16:37:07Z")
😢 The good old days. Four months ago. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/7 "2025-04-15T16:41:26Z")
I suppose they could, but would killing the judiciary necessarily work to their benefit? ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/8 "2025-04-15T16:55:07Z")
'Twas just a thought experiment on how a president/congress might further dismantle something that stood in their way. Not intended to be seen as a fear or a prediction. Just “Would this work?” ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/9 "2025-04-15T16:57:58Z")
Strangling the judiciary to marginality (by defunding or just reducing their jurisdiction over specific areas) and then creating ‘special’ courts to administrate by Congressional or Presidential direction. That’s how the Nazis did it: > **[Law and Justice in the Third Reich](https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/law-and-justice-in-the-third-reich)** > > After the Nazi rise to power in 1933, the German system of justice underwent "coordination" (alignment with Nazi goals). Learn more about law and justice in the Third Reich. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/10 "2025-04-15T17:21:01Z")
The U.S. Constitution, specifically Article III, Section 1, provides that federal judges “shall, at stated Times, receive for their Services, a Compensation, which shall not be diminished during their Continuance in Office.” This is known as the Compensation Clause and is designed to protect judicial independence by preventing Congress or the President from reducing the salaries of sitting federal judges as a form of retaliation or political pressure. ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/11 "2025-04-15T17:29:37Z")
Sure, but again, if we paid the judges but provided for nothing else- no heat, no staff, no bailiffs, no computers, etc. could they even function? ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/12 "2025-04-15T17:34:15Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > The Justices need to be paid without a reduction in salary as per Article III But if the justices are out of a job, who is going to declare the law unconstitutional? ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/13 "2025-04-15T17:36:11Z")
> [@OldOlds](#): > > but provided for nothing else- no heat, no staff, no bailiffs, no computers, etc. could they even function? Go for Corporate Sponsorship. It’s the American Way!™ I mean, they’ve already approved bribery just so long as you can plausibly claim it was “Just the a tip”, so how hard could this be? If you’re worried about conflict of interest, well, don’t be, but if you insist, then make sure they get bribed by both sides in any dispute. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/14 "2025-04-15T17:50:26Z")
“coordination”… I can see how the term _coordination_ would appeal to Trump and his flying monkeys. * * * > [@Horatius](#): > > Go for Corporate Sponsorship. Oh, wow! What a fantastic idea! This judge is sponsored by so-and-so company, and this judge is brought to you by this-and-that company. And the robes would have sponsorships listed on the back like Little League uniforms. _“Get your own judge, get 'em while they’re hot!”_ I think that will definitely catch on. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/15 "2025-04-15T18:51:10Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > This judge is sponsored by so-and-so company, and this judge is brought to you by this-and-that company. And the robes would have sponsorships listed on the back like Little League uniforms. So make public what they try to keep private. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/16 "2025-04-15T20:03:44Z")
They need 60 votes in the Senate to accomplish anything, so the answer is “only if Chuck Schumer lets them”. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/17 "2025-04-15T20:08:50Z")
Even dictators want courts. 1. They distribute the work. 2. They offer the veil of legitimacy. What they don’t want are _honest_ courts. They want ones who understand the agenda and advance the agenda. A fascistic Congress would want abilities to purge, promote, and punish. Removal just isn’t interesting. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/18 "2025-04-15T20:49:19Z")
Well, the easy way to get a pliant judiciary is to shut down the one they have, and create a whole new system using the same buildings and staff, but all new judges to go w the all new prosecutors. The total salary of every federal judge is a rounding error in the court’s budget. Pay them for life to stay home. Then bring in the ringers. Imprison a few vocal whiners _pour encourager les autres_. Done. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/19 "2025-04-15T20:52:05Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > They need 60 votes in the Senate to accomplish anything, so the answer is “only if Chuck Schumer lets them”. Unless they decide they only need 50 votes. Like they did in Trump’s first administration, on multiple occasions. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2025, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074/20 "2025-04-15T20:55:04Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Unless they decide they only need 50 votes. Good luck getting Thune, McConnell, Murkowski, Collins, and Paul onboard with abolishing the filibuster. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-congress-kill-the-judiciary/1017074.md?page=2)