# Could I print "No ID required" on my credit card? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 20, 2007, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846 "2007-05-20T21:01:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![shefDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@shefDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shefDave)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2007, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/21 "2007-05-21T11:51:22Z")
It’s not that merchants aren’t allowed to ask for ID: > [@](#): > > **Requesting Cardholder ID** > When should you ask a cardholder for an official government ID? **Although Visa > rules do not preclude merchants from asking for cardholder ID, merchants > cannot make an ID a condition of acceptance.** Therefore, merchants cannot > refuse to complete a purchase transaction because a cardholder refuses to > provide ID. Visa believes merchants should not ask for ID as part of their regular > card acceptance procedures. Laws in several states also make it illegal for > merchants to write a cardholder’s personal information, such as an address or > phone number, on a sales receipt. (emphasis mine) However, the merchant can’t refuse to complete the transaction if the cardholder can’t/won’t/doesn’t produce ID. See [here](http://www.usa.visa.com/download/merchants/rules_for_visa_merchants.pdf?it=r%7C/merchants/new_acceptance/merchant_responsibility.html%7CRules%20for%20Visa%20Merchants) (PDF, page 28) ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2007, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/22 "2007-05-21T13:07:25Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > The retailer has a strong interest in protecting itself from charges related to a stolen credit card and still needs to check id. To think otherwiseis idiocy because you aren’t the one responsible in the event of theft or fraud. A merchant is not responsible for charges on a stolen card (or any other fraudulent card) if the purchase is authorized by the association, the card is signed, and the signature matches the charge slip. I don’t know why merchants would insist on ID to protect themselves against fraud that they are not responsible for. The guiding philosophy of the credit card associations is to make the card as easy to use as possible, to maximize the use of the card. Asking for ID is counter to this philosophy. Visa (et al) figures the the added revenues is well worth the added risk. I managed billing & payment systems for an online merchant and our contracts with Visa and MasterCard expressly prohibited us from asking for ID if the customer presented a signed unexpired credit card. (All our transactions were online so this was a moot point, but it was a standard contract.) I will grant that it is possible for large merchants to have customized contracts, but I do not know if that is the case with Best Buy as mentioned in this thread. I do know that my merchant acquirer’s biggest merchant was Wal-Mart, who had negotiated special rates, so I suppose it’s possible to negotiate ID requirements. We had a large number of problems with fraud, but that’s because the transaction was online and we had no way to show that the customer had presented a card. So we usually had to eat the charges. The rules are different if a card is presented in person. The document linked by \*\*shefDave \*\* is authoritative and the best info on this topic I have seen in several threads. ---
**Author:** ![spifflog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@spifflog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spifflog)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2007, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/23 "2007-05-21T14:20:03Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Slant] The advantage is convenience and privacy. Convenience… you don’t have to bother pulling out the ID. Privacy… this way, your date of birth, medical conditions and home address are not exposed to business employees. The stores do it for their protection, not yours. If you didn’t buy it, one call to the CC company, and the invoice goes away, and the merchant pays. [/QUOTE] Seems like biting off your nose to spite your face. What does your id card weigh? What makes it so hard to break the thing out. Sure these companies are protecting themselves. And in turn protecting us from higher prices due to fraud theft etc. It seems that the people that complain the loudest about increases in prices refuse to accept any reasonable approach to keep them down. ---
**Author:** ![Will\_Repair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a698b9/32.png) [@Will\_Repair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Will_Repair)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/24 "2007-05-22T16:56:08Z")
With [this](http://www.tyner.com/magnetic/msr_card_writer.htm) mag stripe writer you can have your [card say anything](http://www.smartcardsupply.com/Content/Cards/cards.htm) . ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/25 "2007-05-22T17:04:34Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] Trouble is, the UK implementation of chip and pin isn’t very secure unless they’ve fixed that now. [/QUOTE] Really? Why’s that? Not saying you’re wrong, I’d just be interested in reading a link on this. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/26 "2007-05-22T17:06:02Z")
Don’t want to show ID? Use cash… ---
**Author:** ![dgrdfd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eb8c5e/32.png) [@dgrdfd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dgrdfd)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/27 "2007-05-22T17:18:04Z")
[QUOTE=mlees] Don’t want to show ID? Use cash… [/QUOTE] Why should people when the PFD linked above explicitly says we don’t have to? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/28 "2007-05-22T17:38:19Z")
[QUOTE=spifflog] SNIP What makes it so hard to break the thing out. SNIP [/QUOTE] Well, for one, all the other stuff in my wallet. I’m not terribly interested in debating my personal choice, but I will note that the less information you have about me, the safer _I_ am from _you_ trying to open up accounts as Mr. Slant. There are occasionally evil people behind the counter. What about female customers? Would they willingly disclose their home address to a strange man? What makes it different when he is behind a counter? Are convicted rapists barred from operating cash registers? Personally, I vote with my feet. I don’t bother arguing with merchants about it, I just complain to my bank and shop elsewhere. If all local brick and mortar retailers require my ID for an item, I’ll usually wind up buying the item online. ---
**Author:** ![ChrisBooth12](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@ChrisBooth12](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChrisBooth12)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/29 "2007-05-22T18:32:30Z")
From someone who see and charges credit cards everyday I can tell you it wont matter. Saying SEE ID, is not your signed name and actually invalidates your card. And to the people who are worried about ID theft…are you that scared? ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/30 "2007-05-22T19:25:37Z")
Don’t expect clerks to pay any attention to the back of your credit card. The back of mine has my signature and “ASK FOR PHOTO ID,” but only one clerk in 20 looks at the back of the card and asks for ID. ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/31 "2007-05-22T19:27:44Z")
I feel a little silly when right after I fill up my gas tank for $40 at the pump and then buy $300 worth of supplies at the self check-out at Home Depot without ever seeing a human or having my ID checked to have the barista at Starbucks ask to see my ID for a $3 coffee. If you think “SEE ID” is going to stop someone from using your card your kidding yourself. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/32 "2007-05-22T19:42:31Z")
[QUOTE=dgrdfd] Why should people when the PFD linked above explicitly says we don’t have to? [/QUOTE] I did not see a PDF in the link provided above. (But I could be blind…) I saw a commercial company site offering blank credit card, smart card, and corporate ID badge products, with all the accessories needed to make them useful. They may _offer_ smart card systems that do away with the need for additional (photo) ID, but that does _not_ mean that any other companies _must_ allow you to purchase their merchandise without photo ID. They are merely offering these merchants the means to offer you that type of service. (In other words, it’s optional.) ---
**Author:** ![desdinova](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8baadc/32.png) [@desdinova](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/desdinova)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/33 "2007-05-22T19:43:02Z")
[QUOTE=AskNott] Don’t expect clerks to pay any attention to the back of your credit card. The back of mine has my signature and “ASK FOR PHOTO ID,” but only one clerk in 20 looks at the back of the card and asks for ID. [/QUOTE] Hell, it seems like half the time anymore the clerk doesn’t even touch my card. They make me swipe it myself through a reader, they either give me a receipt to sign or I electronically sign the reader, and not once do they even glance at my credit card. Plenty of clerks have even rolled their eyes at me for handing them my card because I didn’t notice the you-swipe-it-yourself reader located inconveniently at the other end of the counter. ---
**Author:** ![desdinova](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8baadc/32.png) [@desdinova](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/desdinova)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/34 "2007-05-22T19:48:59Z")
[QUOTE=mlees] I did not see a PDF in the link provided above. (But I could be blind…) I saw a commercial company site offering blank credit card, smart card, and corporate ID badge products, with all the accessories needed to make them useful. They may _offer_ smart card systems that do away with the need for additional (photo) ID, but that does _not_ mean that any other companies _must_ allow you to purchase their merchandise without photo ID. They are merely offering these merchants the means to offer you that type of service. (In other words, it’s optional.) [/QUOTE] Look at **shefDave** ’s post above, it’s post #21. He says the relevant bit is on page 28 but it’s actually on page 29 at the bottom. He even quotes the relevant part for you 🙂 I’m pretty sure the other major credit networks have similar provisions as Visa. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/35 "2007-05-22T20:27:27Z")
> [@](#): > > Look at shefDave’s post above, it’s post #21. He says the relevant bit is on page 28 but it’s actually on page 29 at the bottom. He even quotes the relevant part for you > > I’m pretty sure the other major credit networks have similar provisions as Visa. Doh! I clicked on the first link I found, while scrolling up… _forehead smack_ From page 4: > [@](#): > > Your merchant agreement and the Visa U.S.A. Inc. Operating Regulations take precedence over this guide or any updates to its information. > > **For further information about the rules or practices covered in this guide, > contact your merchant bank.** So, isn’t it still possible that my Visa card, which is backed by the Navy Federal Credit Union, may still require ID verification, as required by NCFU? From page 19: > [@](#): > > In traditional sales environments, merchants are required to take all reasonable > steps to assure that the card, cardholder, and transaction are legitimate. > Proper card acceptance begins and ends with sales staff and is critical to > customer satisfaction and profitability. Short of a PIN system, the only way a merchant can verify that a cardholder is a/the legitimate cardholder, photo ID springs to mind… no? (The next page, they discuss comparing the signature on the receipt matches the one on the back of the card.) From the sidebar on page 26: > [@](#): > > Authorization should be seen as an indication that account funds are available > and a card has not been reported as lost or stolen. It is **not** proof that the true > cardholder or a valid Visa card is involved in a transaction. Why this warning? hmmm… From page 29: > [@](#): > > \*\*Although Visa rules do not preclude merchants from asking for cardholder ID, merchants cannot make an ID a condition of acceptance. \*\*Therefore, merchants cannot > refuse to complete a purchase transaction because a cardholder refuses to provide ID. _Visa believes_ merchants should not ask for ID as part of their regular card acceptance procedures. (Bolded and Italisized by me.) The bolded portion seems contradictory to me… Furthermore: “Visa believes”…? Is this similar to “Visa feels”, or “In Visa’s opinion”? Hehe. Well, it seems to me that Visa is satisfied with signature matching, because any disputed charges are reversed right back onto the merchant… ---
**Author:** ![LinusK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/258eb7/32.png) [@LinusK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LinusK)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2007, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/36 "2007-05-22T21:06:03Z")
Visa doesn’t want merchants asking for ID, because Visa wants people using their cards. If they ask you for ID, they’re basically saying, “Hey, I think you might be a thief.” You might not feel that way, but some people do, and it discourages them from using their credit cards. Plus, it slows the transaction down, and makes other purchase options (like cash) relatively easier. Personally I avoid shopping at places that ask for IDs, telephone numbers, home addresses, or anything else. Mostly they just collect that stuff so they can sell it to junk mailers. If anybody’s going to make a buck off my info, it ought to be me. > [@](#): > > I’ve never had to dispute a charge on my CC, so two questions: > > 1. Is it really that easy? > 2. How is this fair to the merchant? I bought a computer from HP almost a year ago. A couple of months later, there was a charge for almost three hundred dollars from HP. I didn’t know what it was for, so I called them and asked. They said they didn’t know either (seriously). But I’d have to pay it, unless I faxed various documents to them, to a special department with a special long-distance number. In which case they’d “review” it, and let me know. I called the credit card company, and a few weeks later they credited my account. I was pretty sure they would, because, well, they’re a pretty good company. But if they hadn’t, that would have been the last time I’d used their card. As far how it’s fair to the merchant, I don’t know, except that if HP hadn’t been complete dumbasses, we probably could have resolved it on the phone, and I wouldn’t have had to dispute it with the card co. … In fairness to HP, their CS might suck, but this computer’s pretty good. ---
**Author:** ![AmbushBug](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ambushbug/32/4600_2.png) [@AmbushBug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AmbushBug)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/37 "2007-05-23T06:36:11Z")
As it happens, I sent a letter via US Mail earlier today to Visa International: > [@](#): > > To whom it may concern: > Some months ago I used my properly-signed, _bank name_ branded Visa debit card to purchase take-out food. I disagreed with the security practices and policy of the merchant, but I did not confront the merchant about their policy at the time. Instead, I sent a letter to my card issuer describing the event (copy attached), and received a response (also attached). > > I had expected my issuer to investigate the incident through the merchant acquirer and confirm what Visa policy is in the area of merchants requiring signatures as a condition of sale or as a matter of routine policy. I was disappointed in my issuer’s response, which states that “requiring photo identification is at the merchant’s discretion.” > > I have been led to believe by several (doubtless very expensive) television commercials, some with A-list celebrities, touting the use of the Visa check card with emphasis that identification is not required to be presented in order to use it, unlike the use of paper checks. > > As this has happened several more times recently, I request that Visa international investigate and clarify this matter for me. I am not comfortable with showing my driver’s license to merchants; I feel that exposing my address in this manner is less secure for me and for Visa, as the numeric portion of the Visa cardholder billing address is often used as a security feature for “card not present” transactions. The requirement as specified on the Visa website stating “Don’t volunteer any personal information when you use your credit card, other than by displaying personal ID as requested by a merchant” troubles me. > > I would appreciate it if this could be investigated - I wish to be kept informed of any actions or decisions taken and made regarding this complaint. I’ll report back in a week or two when I get a response. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/38 "2007-05-23T18:14:49Z")
[QUOTE=anson2995] Checking your ID is not for your protection. Its for their protection. Refusing to show your ID only makes the process longer, which defeats your goal. If you’re really interested in speeding up the process, hand the clerk your ID with your card. If it’s a matter of corporate policy (like at Best Buy), what’s to be accomplished by arguing the merits of the practice with a teenage clerk? Just have your ID out and show it to them. And yes, I’d suspect that if you refused to show your ID on request, merchants would refuse to accept your card. [/QUOTE] Just to point something out important here: They cannot refuse to process a transaction for the refusal to show ID. It’s part of their contract with Visa/MasterCard. We’ve discussed this multiple times here in the past. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-i-print-no-id-required-on-my-credit-card/404846/39 "2007-05-23T18:30:42Z")
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