# Could someone explain the whole thing about ZPG Zealot? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 16, 2012, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731 "2012-01-16T21:24:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2012, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/41 "2012-01-16T23:49:00Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Why not? It’s simple honestyand if it prevents causing someone embarassment or a worse great guilt for having violated their religious tenets common courtesy would be to disclose. It’s no different then when I have guests for dinner or bring food to a potluck at work, I am always careful to label dishes that contain pork, meat, gluten whatever, so that no one violates their food beliefs. Besides if adoption is nothing to be ashamed of why do you care who knows it? It’s not so much that I care, it’s that I wonder why their personal issues have to become my problem. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2012, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/42 "2012-01-16T23:50:55Z")
Jesus. People didn’t have a problem with you not wanting to shake hands. People had a problem with the fact that you felt put out to simply say, “I’m sorry, my culture doesn’t believe in shaking hands with the opposite sex”, or whatever. If you don’t want to shake hands, find. Accusing the guy of _rape_? THAT’S what peple are making fun of you for, dumbass. > [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Well, actually, I can see increased infanticide being an _inevitable_ (or at least highly likely) outcome of a strict abortion ban, but I assume when she said it, it was nutty. True, but what I’m saying is that she endorses it, and would actually _encourage_ it. I also think she said that if you found out that you were switched at birth, you should start calling your parents “Mr” and “Mrs”. Because of course, they were not actually your parents. Even though you THOUGHT they were. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2012, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/43 "2012-01-16T23:58:50Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > IIRC, she also believes that if abortion were outlawed, infanticide would be an acceptable alternative. Real, actual infanticide. > > And breastfeeding is evil, or something like that, and women who do so are perverted. Honestly, what do you expect women to do iif they can’t get safe abortions. Sit back and let the state use their bodies as incubators? I personally think the overemphasis on breastfeeding is just one more anvil our society has created to hang around the necks of women that want a life beyond babies (and in that respect I suppose it could be considered evil). There is nothing wrong with formula and those who choose to use it shouldn’t be guilt tripped. Besides if breastfeeding were so important, why how can we possibly allow babies to be adopted when that doesn’t allow breastfeeding. Women who go on message boards to talk about how good nursing feels or have hysterical fits because they can’t breastfeed, have a lot more than feeding a baby going on in their heads. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/44 "2012-01-17T00:00:37Z")
Well, magellan01 has the same terminology hangup about “marriage”, and the same “gosh, I can’t understand why everyone’s getting so _upset_” attitude that is either profound stupidity or determined disingenuity (or some combination). I’m not sure that he has a psychological problem, though, aside from homophobia. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/45 "2012-01-17T00:01:45Z")
> [@Sarahfeena](#): > > It’s not so much that I care, it’s that I wonder why their personal issues have to become my problem. I feel the same way about assholes that stick their hands out at me. It’s just basic courtesy to try not to offend people. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/46 "2012-01-17T00:03:27Z")
Well, sauce for the gander - do you pre-emptively tell people you don’t like to shake hands, as you suggest people pre-emptively announce that they were adopted? ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/47 "2012-01-17T00:03:37Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > I feel the same way about assholes that stick their hands out at me. It’s just basic courtesy to try not to offend people. Uh…sorry, but getting offended when someone sticks their hand out at you is once again making your issues into someone else’s problem. You seem to have trouble understanding why that is, though, so I won’t try to explain it to you (again). ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/48 "2012-01-17T00:06:48Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > She believes it justified if the father kills _the woman_ if she becomes pregnant and won’t abort. Ah, yes, thanks for the correction. You’re right. The part about killing a baby was the “it’s crying and won’t stop.” ETA: and of course, **ZPGZealot** ’s own words in this thread are ample evidence of…something not right upstairs. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/49 "2012-01-17T00:07:41Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Man, what did irony do to deserve that? That was funny. Thank you for the laugh. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/50 "2012-01-17T00:13:03Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > I feel the same way about assholes that stick their hands out at me. It’s just basic courtesy to try not to offend people. No normal human being who understands the basic rules of social interaction in American society is offended by people offering to shake hands. No normal human being refuses to consider that the larger societal mores of social interaction might differ from one’s personal culture, and that those differences are not persecution. No normal human being takes offense when someone attempts to follow the rules of basic courtesy of the society in which they live. ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/51 "2012-01-17T00:13:43Z")
OK, y’all. I have Roma friends. Really. I do. A family of them befriended me years ago. And I I realize none of you are confronting **ZPG** on that basis. But if she (she? not sure… someone help me out here) is really part of that folk, then she is NOT the same culture that any of us have grown up with. If s/he really is a Roma… a ‘Gypsy’ (hope that isn’t a taboo word) then danggit, wouldn’t it be cool to learn from her experiences rather than kicking her/him to the curb? Asking, for example, why infanticide makes sense? Good OG, the idea makes me want to puke. But… and this is this point I want to make… that is not a universal idea. I used to be an anthropologist, back when I as in college, before I made my way writing software. I still read the journals, occasionally As has been stated upstream, leaving unwanted infants to be ‘taken by the gods’ was a common practice in many cultures. I don’t need a cite. Just Google it. Surely you’ll all know this happened. in my not so humble option when we learned how to decrease the incidence of infant deaths, that mothers (and to a lesser sense fathers) attached themselves to the babies they had generated. Apparently, and this is backed by a lot of evidence, women are immediately attached to their offspring in a very profound way. Lots of studies indicate that because the mother and child share an overwhelming amount of experience (think, y’all the last three months in the mother’s womb is when the baby’s brain is able to receive information), and that the mother is aware of this (and this is where the evidence is unclear). Well dang. It seems like these two folks NEED to be together. Not for some weepy reason, but because of biology. Females produce young. Intelligent and self-aware young Said _young_ should be associated with their producing females. That being said, not all producing females or their males (if available) are capable of handling the care of the offspring. We have dealt with this a society relatively well. After all, when was the last time y’all saw a hill with a baby on it so that the birds and other animals could pull it apart and eat it? That is what several human cultures have done in the past. Feel good about yourselves, collectively, that we don’t do so today. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/52 "2012-01-17T00:14:25Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Honestly, what do you expect women to do iif they can’t get safe abortions. Sit back and let the state use their bodies as incubators? I personally think the overemphasis on breastfeeding is just one more anvil our society has created to hang around the necks of women that want a life beyond babies (and in that respect I suppose it could be considered evil). There is nothing wrong with formula and those who choose to use it shouldn’t be guilt tripped. Besides if breastfeeding were so important, why how can we possibly allow babies to be adopted when that doesn’t allow breastfeeding. Women who go on message boards to talk about how good nursing feels or have hysterical fits because they can’t breastfeed, have a lot more than feeding a baby going on in their heads. Oh for crist sakes how many times to do I have to explain to you that nursing releases chemicals that feel good? There’s nothing wrong with wanting that experience. Nursing is often a pleasant experience. It often helps a mom relax, aids her in losing the pregnancy weight and puts her baby to sleep. Really STFU about this subject. As a nursing mom I ask you to officially stop spreading ignorance about it. Just shut up about anything related to reproductive matters because you’re truly batshit crazy when you write about them. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/53 "2012-01-17T00:19:30Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > If s/he really is a Roma… a ‘Gypsy’ (hope that isn’t a taboo word) then danggit, wouldn’t it be cool to learn from her experiences rather than kicking her/him to the curb? Uh-huh… what part of the “Roma experience” frowns on breastfeeding? For every quirk of ZPG’s you can attribute (however clumsily) to her Roma culture, she’s glad to broadcast one that is best attributed to general nuttiness. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/54 "2012-01-17T00:22:13Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > Oh for crist sakes how many times to do I have to explain to you that nursing releases chemicals that feel good? There’s nothing wrong with wanting that experience. Nursing is often a pleasant experience. It often helps a mom relax, aids her in losing the pregnancy weight and puts her baby to sleep. Really STFU about this subject. As a nursing mom I ask you to officially stop spreading ignorance about it. > > Just shut up about anything related to reproductive matters because you’re truly batshit crazy when you write about them. Yes…that was actually the most sane thing she’s ever said on the subject of breastfeeding. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/55 "2012-01-17T00:22:14Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Honestly, what do you expect women to do iif they can’t get safe abortions. Sit back and let the state use their bodies as incubators? Honest question: is there a mob of crazed men beating down your door to use YOU as an incubator? I’ll wait if you want to check first. If not, maybe you should relax a bit. Take some deep breaths. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/56 "2012-01-17T00:45:46Z")
I’m fairly certain she also encouraged her relatives to pickpocket non-Romas. ---
**Author:** ![LeeshaJoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e8cbc/32.png) [@LeeshaJoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LeeshaJoy)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/57 "2012-01-17T00:50:22Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Honestly, what do you expect women to do iif they can’t get safe abortions. Get _un_safe abortions, as they have for centuries in every culture on Earth where abortion is illegal or even just frowned upon? ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/58 "2012-01-17T01:01:51Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Honest question: is there a mob of crazed men beating down your door to use YOU as an incubator? I’ll wait if you want to check first. > > If not, maybe you should relax a bit. Take some deep breaths. I have had to walk through mobs of crazed anti-abortion protesters (Operation Rescue) to get birth control. If those assholes get their way, the scenario you described is not impossible. My first husband certainly tried to use me as an incubator, so I am familiar with the baby-crazed mentality. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/59 "2012-01-17T01:03:00Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > More or less for most of my life, I have had to defend myself from anti-Roma persecution. I’m talking about here on these boards. I have no doubt that you have encountered anti-Roma prejudice in your life, but this thread is specifically about this message board and how you are treated here. Have you suffered “anti-Roma persecuation” here? Because your initial post, in the context of this discussion, implied that you have. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731/60 "2012-01-17T01:06:22Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > Oh for crist sakes how many times to do I have to explain to you that nursing releases chemicals that feel good? There’s nothing wrong with wanting that experience. Nursing is often a pleasant experience. It often helps a mom relax, aids her in losing the pregnancy weight and puts her baby to sleep. Really STFU about this subject. As a nursing mom I ask you to officially stop spreading ignorance about it. > > Just shut up about anything related to reproductive matters because you’re truly batshit crazy when you write about them. If you don’t want to hear my opinions on breastfeeding, stop bringing them up. I wasn’t the one that started the discussion. As a woman who values herself as more than a milk producting machine (hey, my neighbors’ goats can do that), STFU about glorifing breastfeading as this holy grail of womanly behavior. There is nothing wrong with not wanting the experience either and the constant badgering of pro-breastfeeders is just another weapon used to keep women barefoot and in the kitchen. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-someone-explain-the-whole-thing-about-zpg-zealot/609731.md?page=4)