# Could the NFL players and owners really be this dumb? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [December 5, 2010, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983 "2010-12-05T00:34:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/21 "2010-12-07T19:21:42Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Not to mention the fact that [their own players’ union doesn’t care about them after they retire](http://www.insurancenewsnet.com/article.aspx?a=top_lh&id=56338). The players need to get paid while they can, and everybody, including the owners, know it. BTW, this is a dead link. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/22 "2010-12-07T19:37:25Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > BTW, this is a dead link. It works for me. ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/23 "2010-12-07T20:00:00Z")
OK, that time it worked–same browser and everything. Very strange. ETA: Come on though, **Airman** , an article from 2006? Long before the all of the concussion issues were widely known? I should have realized something was up when the article started talking about Gene Upshaw as if he were still alive… ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/24 "2010-12-07T20:31:24Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > No, you know what’s insulting? Green Bay, the only publicly owned team in the league, in a year where they sold out Lambeau Field every game, all 73,928 seats, [had a profit of $9.8 million](http://www.packers.com/news-and-events/article-1/Finances-Show-Profit-But-Troubling-Trends-Remain/131dac2e-ce57-4798-aade-384c565d01fb). That’s it. You are complaining about a business that made $10mil profit in a terrible economic climate? Sorry, but I am hardly crying for the Packers or any other franchise. > [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Now, we may assume that they are not representative of the rest of the league. Even if we assume that, we may safely assume that other teams that are subject to blackout every week (Jacksonville, Tampa, Detroit, et al., [article about it here](http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2010-09-06-nfl-tv-blackouts-forecast_N.htm)), are in a much more dire financial position. But the owners have a revenue sharing agreement. If that agreement means some teams are left out in the cold, then they need to reform that. They shouldn’t just demand more money from the players. The problem here is that you are comparing the worst preforming franchises to this largely fictional super-rich player. The players aren’t coming out of this smelling like roses either. You already linked to the older players who are without proper healthcare. Yes, the packers may find themselves in a bad financial position (relatively), but compared to the average player, they are doing great. The average NFL [career](http://www.livestrong.com/article/15527-long-average-career-nfl-player/) is only 3.3 years. These people have trained for decades to have their professional career end on average in 3.3 years, often due to significant injury. Hardly seems like the owners have such a bad deal considering the alternatives. > [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > So, what should be done about this? The NFL and the owners are not a charity, they are in it to make money. It doesn’t take a genius to see that if one of the most popular teams in the league with an enviable reputation second to none makes [less than their own starting quarterback per year](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aaron_Rodgers#Starting_seasons) there’s a problem. You keep looking at this as if the NFL is a normal business. Tiger woods makes more than the CEO of Nike. Several college coaches are the highest paid employees at their schools (occasionally the highest paid state employee). There are plenty of examples like this in situations where the product is basically a person. You see the same with actors, and other entertainers. Doesn’t really mean much by itself. > [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > The owners want to rectify this, and the players are content to keep things as they are. Where I come from, that is called cutting off your nose to spite your face. But that’s just me. Then they should open their books to prove they are in dire financial straits. More importantly, if their financial situation is worsened by their own decisions (building an expensive stadium, etc.) that will ultimately help their bottom line when they sell the team, they shouldn’t extract money from the players for that. ---
**Author:** ![PunkyPoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/6bbea6/32.png) [@PunkyPoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunkyPoo)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/25 "2010-12-07T20:41:46Z")
I’ll be surprised if we miss any regular season games, but these types of deal never get done till the last minute. Or even a few minutes later. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/26 "2010-12-07T21:21:51Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > OK, that time it worked–same browser and everything. Very strange. > > ETA: Come on though, **Airman** , an article from 2006? Long before the all of the concussion issues were widely known? I should have realized something was up when the article started talking about Gene Upshaw as if he were still alive… So what has changed? Has the union turned around and said that Upshaw (since dead) was wrong and they’re going to back the veterans, or are they still largely ignoring them? I haven’t heard anything about any changes. The attitudes are still largely the same, they haven’t changed since Upshaw died so the views are still relevant. > [@brickbacon](#): > > You are complaining about a business that made $10mil profit in a terrible economic climate? Sorry, but I am hardly crying for the Packers or any other franchise. You must be joking. A multi-billion dollar business, and that’s their cut? That’s embarrassing. That’s like paying a guy $20 an hour and finding out at the end of the year that you’re netting the equivalent of $7.50 and you own the business. As far as revenue sharing goes, it’s apparent from the Green Bay example that there’s little to share, what with salaries growing twice as fast as revenues. You can’t squeeze blood from a turnip. ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/27 "2010-12-07T21:34:07Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > As far as revenue sharing goes, it’s apparent from the Green Bay example that there’s little to share, what with salaries growing twice as fast as revenues. You can’t squeeze blood from a turnip. If salaries are a fixed proportion of revenues, how can they be growing “twice as fast”? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/28 "2010-12-07T21:44:28Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > If salaries are a fixed proportion of revenues, how can they be growing “twice as fast”? Read the linked article about the Packers’ finances. ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/29 "2010-12-07T21:54:07Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Read the linked article about the Packers’ finances. I did read the article, but it also said that the Packers’ salary increases were also inflated by unusually large payments during the year of the study: > [@](#): > > This past year’s $22.1 million increase in player costs was substantial, in part due to significant long-term contracts given to veteran players Ryan Pickett, Nick Collins and Chad Clifton. Are other NFL teams dealing with the same issues? Honestly, I don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/30 "2010-12-08T00:28:08Z")
> **[How Long Is the Average Career of an NFL Player?](https://careertrend.com/how-long-is-the-average-career-of-an-nfl-player-3032896.html)** > > The career of the average NFL player tends to be short. The National Football League is extremely competitive, so players must compete hard to keep their jobs against new players entering the league every year. The injury rate among NFL players is... The ave. NFL career is 3.3 years. Running back 2.57, kicker 4.7 , QB 4.4 , cornerback 2.94 . The players really do need a big pay check, because it has to last them their whole life. They show themselves to be good athletes when they are young and schools help them dedicate their whole lives to getting better at the game. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/31 "2010-12-08T01:52:18Z")
They can’t get another job after FB is over? They did all go to college for at least 3 years. Lots of former players have regular jobs, they don’t all go into coaching or TV. But there are guys who go flat broke because they spend all their money when they are playing - even high paid guys, not just a backup TE. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/32 "2010-12-08T02:20:51Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > They can’t get another job after FB is over? They did all go to college for at least 3 years. Lots of former players have regular jobs, they don’t all go into coaching or TV. > > But there are guys who go flat broke because they spend all their money when they are playing - even high paid guys, not just a backup TE. These guys are trained athletes with their heart and soul put into the game. The schools will do anything to keep them eligible, except provide a real education. They are going to football school at a university. Most are not there for an education and the school has no interest in providing one. Keep it simple and keep them passing until they leave early with little education at all and no real world experience. There are exceptions. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/33 "2010-12-08T02:27:08Z")
Yes but they can also go back to school and be real student and get a good degree when their career is over. I have no problem with these guys wanting to make a lot of money, I just disagree that they need to earn enough to live on for the rest of their life. There are guys who invest smartly and do that, but it’s not required. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/34 "2010-12-08T02:41:31Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > Yes but they can also go back to school and be real student and get a good degree when their career is over. Some undoubtedly can (and do). Unfortunately, an awful lot of them would have never gone to college had they not been exceptional athletes. Even the third-string tight end on the weakest team in the NFL was one of the best athletes his high school ever produced, and was one of the top players on his college team. If he was smart, as well, great, but a lot of these guys get exceptional help\* while they’re in school, just to achieve the minimum GPA to remain academically eligible to play ball. Once he’s no longer a ballplayer, and just another guy trying to finish school, in many cases, he’s not going to have the study skills, and maybe not even the smarts, to actually succeed in school on his own. - – tutoring at a minimum, but we’ve all heard stories about student-athletes who get better grades than they’ve earned, due to pressure placed by their coaches or alumni. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/35 "2010-12-08T03:09:00Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > Yes but they can also go back to school and be real student and get a good degree when their career is over. > > I have no problem with these guys wanting to make a lot of money, I just disagree that they need to earn enough to live on for the rest of their life. There are guys who invest smartly and do that, but it’s not required. You think they are college students who happen to play good football? They are football players who put it all into the game. Many have very little schooling from the time they were kids. Many are unable to handle college at all. You don’t play linebacker for 7 or 8 years and sharpen your intellect. Some do but most are lost and set adrift when playing ends. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/36 "2010-12-08T03:19:29Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > You think they are college students who happen to play good football? They are football players who put it all into the game. Many have very little schooling from the time they were kids. Many are unable to handle college at all. You don’t play linebacker for 7 or 8 years and sharpen your intellect. Some do but most are lost and set adrift when playing ends. And why should I find myself overly concerned about that? What do we owe them? They had the chance to learn for free while growing up, they had the chance to go to college for free, they had the chance to make ludicrous money that most of us will never see in our lifetimes for playing a game, and they have the chance to spend some of their lucre on completing their education after they retire. How many chances do they need such that I should feel sorry for their plight? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/37 "2010-12-08T04:09:09Z")
I sure as hell don’t feel sorry for the owners. At least the players actually work for a living, and give me some entertainment. The owners are just useless parasites. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2010, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983/38 "2010-12-08T04:33:03Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Now, we may assume that they are not representative of the rest of the league. Even if we assume that, we may safely assume that other teams that are subject to blackout every week (Jacksonville, Tampa, Detroit, et al., [article about it here](http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2010-09-06-nfl-tv-blackouts-forecast_N.htm)), are in a much more dire financial position. The Buccaneers had one blackout last season, and hadn’t one since 1997 before that. Why are all 8 games blacked out this season, you ask? Because the team is 40 million dollars under the cap. Coincidentally, that’s the same amount Manchester United is in the red. The Glazer family got greedy, and gutted the franchise to make ends meet. Don’t get me wrong- I, and I imagine most Tampa fans, are delighted that the team is competitive this year, but it is in some sense a fluke. We have the lowest payroll (and lowest-paid head coach) in the league, and we’ve had payrolls among the bottom 10 in the league for each of the last six years. The fans know why. The Jacksonville Jaguars made a $27 million profit last year, and, I might add, have appreciated in value by about $700 million since Wayne Weaver bought the team in 1993. The Lions made $17 million (after posting negligible losses the previous two seasons). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-the-nfl-players-and-owners-really-be-this-dumb/562983.md?page=1)