# Could there be a Queen Meghan? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 23, 2018, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691 "2018-05-23T18:17:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/21 "2018-05-23T21:30:28Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Philip isn’t the King because husbands of ruling Queens are not called King in the UK. The only exception to this was Philip of Spain who was married to Mary I (and that ended badly), and William III, who was married to Mary II, but was second in line for the throne anyway (behind Mary’s sister Anne), and he was allowed to keep the throne after Mary’s death, and Anne succeeded him when he died. He wasn’t second in line and allowed to keep the throne. The Bill of Rights provided that William and Mary were joint monarchs during their lifetimes. > [@](#): > > King George V’s wife, Queen Mary, was German. Mary was born in England, so she was British. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/22 "2018-05-23T21:32:26Z")
So what would happen under Monaco’s system if a monarch died without any descendants at all (even adopted ones)? ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/23 "2018-05-23T21:43:31Z")
Prince Phillip became a British citizen, and so, it is assumed, will the Duchess of Sussex. If you want the story of a dysfunctional marriage, you should read about George IV and his wife. They were, to say the least, estranged when he was crowned. Supposedly she tried to get into the cathedral during the coronation, and had to be turned away. ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/24 "2018-05-23T22:01:49Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > So what would happen under Monaco’s system if a monarch died without any descendants at all (even adopted ones)? It would get annexed by France. Since Monaco’s government is financed by the casinos, rather than income tax, Monaco’s people take a much greater interest in succession crises than in other countries. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/25 "2018-05-23T22:21:28Z")
Barring an act of parliament to the contrary Camilla will automatically become queen consort the moment Charles ascended the throne; whether she actually uses the title is a different story. Right now she’s legally just as much a Princess of Wakes as Diana was, she just uses one of her husband’s lesser titles instead. Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![TSBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@TSBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TSBG)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/26 "2018-05-23T22:25:35Z")
Wiki says the Monaco succession rules changed in 2002 to allow collateral descendants to rule. Now, it may be that the page is being sabotaged by desperate potential Monegasque heirs. But also, that may not be the case. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/27 "2018-05-23T22:54:46Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > No, he’s 6th. The rule is first born then all their first born descendants, recursively, until you get to the end of the branch, then go back up one generation to next born. So Charles, then Charles eldest descendant William, then William’s eldest descendant George. George has no descendants, so then its William’s next descendant Charlotte, who has no descendants, then William’s next descendant Louis. Louis has no descendants, and we’ve exhausted William’s descendants, so now it goes up a level back to Charles next descendant, Harry. Harry has no descendants, so after him it would go to Elizabeth’s next born Andrew, and his kids, etc. etc. And even so, Charlotte would’ve been down 1 spot if she were older (2011 I think) due to gender. Now it’s gender-agnostic. Still no filthy Papists, though their spouses are allowed. > [@mbh](#): > > That was the Turkish Sultan, not the Byzantine Emperor. Under Ottoman law, all sons had equal inheritance rights. A new Sultan had to eliminate his brothers in order to avoid a civil war. Yeah, the Byzantines were more civilized. They only blinded and/or castrated potential rivals! ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/28 "2018-05-24T00:16:10Z")
If events unfold so that Harry becomes king, then his wife will formally be “HM the Queen” - no personal name involved. Of course, she will often be referred to as Queen Meghan, and that wouldn’t be incorrect. But it’s not what will appear in official documents, the court circular, etc. Should King Harry die, and be survived by his wife, she would most probably then become “HM Queen Meghan”, unless she chooses to use some other name, which is unlikely. ---
**Author:** ![GinoC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f4b2a3/32.png) [@GinoC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GinoC)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/29 "2018-05-24T01:33:10Z")
> [@Baker](#): > > If you want the story of a dysfunctional marriage, you should read about George IV and his wife. They were, to say the least, estranged when he was crowned. Supposedly she tried to get into the cathedral during the coronation, and had to be turned away. The story goes that upon the death of Napoleon, George IV was informed that his greatest enemy was dead and he replied, “is she, by God?”. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/30 "2018-05-24T02:52:32Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > …Should King Harry die, and be survived by his wife, she would most probably then become “HM Queen Meghan”, unless she chooses to use some other name, which is unlikely. The only reason Elizabeth II’s mother was specifically styled “HM Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother” was because “HM Queen Elizabeth” would cause too much confusion with her daughter. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/31 "2018-05-24T03:09:41Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > He wasn’t second in line and allowed to keep the throne. The Bill of Rights provided that William and Mary were joint monarchs during their lifetimes. > > Mary was born in England, so she was British. He was second in line behind Anne. He got the throne under the Bill of Rights because he was second in line behind Anne. Mary was of the Teck family. The Tecks were German nobility. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/32 "2018-05-24T03:24:15Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Is that why a new Byzantine emperor’s first task was to have all of his siblings strangled? As noted, that was the Ottoman practice. The Byzantine practice was to mutilate your brothers. One of the requirements to hold the throne was that you couldn’t have any physical disabilities. So if you wanted to eliminate your brother’s potential claim, you would have him blinded or castrated or cut off his nose and therefore render him ineligible. You’d then usually send him off a monastery to avoid awkward conversations around the dinner table. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/33 "2018-05-24T03:28:59Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > He was second in line behind Anne. He got the throne under the Bill of Rights because he was second in line behind Anne. Actually he got it because he was married to Mary, and she refused to take the throne except on terms acceptable to him, and he refused unless he could be co-sovereign with Mary. The he himself was relatively high in the succession may have made it easier for Parliament to accept his demands. > [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Mary was of the Teck family. The Tecks were German nobility. Mary was not of the Teck family. She was Mary Stuart, a daughter of James II, and her mother was Anne Hyde. Mary of Teck was a completely different person who married George V of England and was queen consort from 1910 to 1936. There was no House of Teck during Mary Stuart’s time. The last Duke of Teck died in 1439, and the title wasn’t revived until 1863, when it was awarded to the man who a few years later begat Princess Mary of Teck. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/34 "2018-05-24T03:39:24Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > Actually he got it because he was married to Mary, and she refused to take the throne except on terms acceptable to him, and he refused unless he could be co-sovereign with Mary. The he himself was relatively high in the succession may have made it easier for Parliament to accept his demands. > Mary was not of the Teck family. She was Mary Stuart, a daughter of James II, and her mother was Anne Hyde. > > Mary of Teck was a completely different person who married George V of England and was queen consort from 1910 to 1936. > > There was no House of Teck during Mary Stuart’s time. The last Duke of Teck died in 1439, and the title wasn’t revived until 1863, when it was awarded to the man who a few years later begat Princess Mary of Teck. Who was talking about Mary Stuart? As I said, and as you were replying to, Quote: **King George V’s wife, Queen Mary, was German.** ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/35 "2018-05-24T04:26:01Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Mary was of the Teck family. The Tecks were German nobility. And she was born at Kensington Palace to a British princess, and lived all but two years of her life in Britain. If having one German parent made her German, then she was also at least equally British. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/36 "2018-05-24T04:59:27Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > I thought you had to be English to be Queen (Consort) (or King (Consort)). That’s why Prince Philip wasn’t called the King Consort, or King Philip. No you have to be female to be Queen. That is why Prince phillip is not Queen Phillip. Basically, they don’t call the consort King. But they do call the female consort Queen. But the complication is that non-noble non-royal american divorcee Meghan… well thats a different case… there’s no precedent but they are moving to be less strict. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/37 "2018-05-24T05:18:19Z")
Two different “jobs” (reigning queen and consort) being called queen isn’t too weird. In English we use “Prince” for both the son of a king and a reigning leader of a principality, as in Monaco. A distinction is preserved in some languages, like German, which uses Prinz and Fürst. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/38 "2018-05-24T05:36:06Z")
> [@Isilder](#): > > But the complication is that non-noble non-royal american divorcee Meghan… well thats a different case… there’s no precedent but they are moving to be less strict. There have been previous non-royal, non-noble and non-British consorts, although the combination of the three characteristics in one person is a first, I admit. But the only really novel aspect of Meghan Markle is that she’s a divorcee. If she were to become queen consort she would, I think, be the first divorced person do to so. Queen Catherine Parr has been twice married before she married Henry VIII, but both of her earlier marriages had been ended by death, not divorce. But Meghan’s chances of her ever becoming consort are pretty small. ---
**Author:** ![Oswald\_Bastable](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oswald_bastable/32/214_2.png) [@Oswald\_Bastable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oswald_Bastable)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/39 "2018-05-24T05:53:46Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > As noted, that was the Ottoman practice. The Byzantine practice was to mutilate your brothers. One of the requirements to hold the throne was that you couldn’t have any physical disabilities. So if you wanted to eliminate your brother’s potential claim, you would have him blinded or castrated or cut off his nose and therefore render him ineligible. You’d then usually send him off a monastery to avoid awkward conversations around the dinner table. Wow, that’s quite Byzantine. OB ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691/40 "2018-05-24T05:56:47Z")
How is one royal but not noble? Wallis Simpson was not all three, but of course abdicated before marrying her. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-there-be-a-queen-meghan/814691.md?page=3)