# Could this be a scam against my Mom? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 20, 2022, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540 "2022-10-20T12:00:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![3AxisCtrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/ecd19e/32.png) [@3AxisCtrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3AxisCtrl)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/21 "2022-10-20T14:33:12Z")
> [@Mike\_Mabes](#): > > **Could this be a scam against my Mom?** This thread title had me thinking “About 95% likely” before I clicked on it. > [@](#): > > The other day while on her computer a screen came up with a warning that her computer may be compromised. This had me revising my estimate to 100%. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/22 "2022-10-20T14:34:28Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > You can call me racist if you wish, but if you follow this advice, you will avoid 80% of today’s scams. > > If the tech/clerk has an Indian accent, assume the worst, and do not engage. 80% of scams originate in India. I don’t know if that’s actively racist so much as simply shortsighted. It seems to assume that Indian scammers are incapable of hiring operators who don’t have noticeably Indian accents. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/23 "2022-10-20T14:40:25Z")
Mike\_Mabes: Forgive me for continuing my rant, but this is a subject I have been following for a long time. If you catch it in time, your Mom may only be out $20. It might be best to write that off. You may be tempted to get a refund, and if you contact the credit card company (thru the number on the back of the card), they might give you a refund. BUT… There is another common scam out there, the Refund Scam. You get a call from someone who is offering you a refund (for a payment, a service, a subscription, whatever). Although it may seem like they had a change of heart, DO NOT CONTINUE with this phone call. Here’s how it works. The scammers claim they will send you the refund directly to your bank account. (How nice!) In order to do this, they connect to your computer and… The scam takes several paths from here on, but the “connect to your computer” is where it becomes dangerous. You are now back to my first advice, where I said your entire life has been compromised. @Kimstu: Obviously that [hiring better English speakers] is possible, but they don’t seem to have caught on yet. I’m sure they will. Meanwhile, an Indian accent is a warning flag. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/24 "2022-10-20T14:43:42Z")
> [@Mike\_Mabes](#): > > it would be undetected by a scan by the pro version of Avast? I’ve had good luck with the free version of MalwareBytes, just to do a one-time scan. I would run that as well. I wouldn’t bother with Avast (after having it do a good, deep scan) – Windows Defender is probably just as effective and it’s free. Is there anything your mom does with that computer than couldn’t be done on a Chromebook? Just less likely to get pwned on a Chromebook. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/25 "2022-10-20T14:46:04Z")
As others have said, your mother’s machine is compromised and I wouldn’t trust it one bit without wiping the system disk and doing a new clean install. Even the best virus scanners do not catch anything, and the scammers had full access to the system and could have installed a bunch of bad stuff that’s hard to detect. Even if an antivirus catches it, removal is still another story and sometimes futile. So backup your data, wipe the disk, do a clean OS install and change all online and local passwords your mother had. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/26 "2022-10-20T14:47:10Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > Obviously that [hiring better English speakers] is possible Off-topic nitpick: Okay, now that arguably is a bit racist. I’ll assume that what you meant to say is “operators who are better at American English dialects” or “operators who don’t ‘sound Indian’ in their speech” or similar. People who speak Indian English dialects or speak with Indian accents are not automatically “worse English speakers” than English speakers using other dialects and accents. /OTN ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/27 "2022-10-20T14:50:25Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > You can call me racist if you wish, but if you follow this advice, you will avoid 80% of today’s scams. > > If the tech/clerk has an Indian accent, assume the worst, and do not engage. 80% of scams originate in India. > > For more info, I suggest you search for Jim Browning on YouTube. He shows exactly how this and other scams work. You may even find the exact screen your Mom saw and the script she heard in Jim’s samples. > > For more good sources, do a YouTube search for Pierogi, Pleasant Green, and Trilogy Media. There are active White Hat hackers out there trying to combat this scourge, filling in where governments fear to tread. - There’s also Kitboga and our own @Mangetout (as Atomic Shrimp) ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/28 "2022-10-20T14:51:00Z")
@Mike_Mabes: It’s a cat and mouse game. As soon as the anti-virus software dudes invent a scheme to detect something, the crooks invent a scheme to get around it. So Avast or any other program might or might not detect the stuff you want to find. Personally, I wouldn’t trust it completely, but the choice is yours. A clean OS install, as much of a hassle as it is, is less risky. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/29 "2022-10-20T14:55:24Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > Last advice: Learn not to be gullible. Just because someone makes a claim does not mean it is true. There are crooks everywhere. Verify with trusted sources (no, not the ones that say, “You can trust us!”). Check before action if in doubt. I really don’t like the assumptions in this comment, and we’ve had discussions in the past about victim blaming people who fall for tech/IT scams, especially when they’re ageist in nature. Yes, the basic sentiment is 100% correct (this isn’t a slam on @musicat after all) - but the scams hit people who may be fully intelligent, but just not at their best on that day, or may for whatever reason seem more plausible. As an example that didn’t happen, the OP mentioned going a few days with minimal sleep, and not being at their best - sure, it didn’t happen to their computer, but things slip by when you’re over tired, upset, or on medication. Yes - always try to be aware, but not everyone is as suspicious and investigative as we SD types tend to be. 😜 For cross reference, I’m linking this to the Omnibus Scam thread, which is chock full of scams and Scam-baiters. > [@Scam (Internet and Otherwise) Omnibus Thread](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scam-internet-and-otherwise-omnibus-thread/962265): > > Continuing the discussion from ["Is this a scam?" chapter seventy-billion, need answer fastish](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-this-a-scam-chapter-seventy-billion-need-answer-fastish/962247/17): This thread, one of many recently, got me thinking that it might be worthwhile to have an omnibus thread where everyone can share and SEARCH scams that have already been identified. This isn’t so much for complaining about scammers although it’ll probably be inevitable to a degree, but to see if other posters have had a similar experience before anyone makes a mistake. I’m linking several scam threa… ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/30 "2022-10-20T14:56:05Z")
…and Rinoa Poison, Mark Rober, Scammer Payback, and IRLRosie. And check out People’s Call Center, where several of these White Hat Hackers got together for a week to give the scammers something to worry about. They were able to warn some potential victims in time and even get some money back. ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/31 "2022-10-20T14:58:58Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > If the tech/clerk has an Indian accent, assume the worst, and do not engage. 80% of scams originate in India. I own an IT company and have 5 full time employees in India plus about 40% of my staff in Canada are Indian born. While I agree that many of these scams are Indian-based (and the OP’s story indicates 100% scam), you are painting with a broad-brush here. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/32 "2022-10-20T15:10:02Z")
Mark Rober’s glitter-bombing/fart-spraying videos are completely juvenile, and yet I enjoy the heck out of them. That said, over the years he’s gotten more and more serious about prevention and working with law enforcement, and it’s been good to watch him and these other scam-fighters joining forces. ---
**Author:** ![minor7flat5](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minor7flat5/32/258_2.png) [@minor7flat5](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minor7flat5)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/33 "2022-10-20T15:12:45Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > As others have said, your mother’s machine is compromised and I wouldn’t trust it one bit without wiping the system disk and doing a new clean install. Word. My mom fell for this scam some years back, but I had warned her well, so while she was talking to some guy named Michael from Florida who was super friendly, she let him know she needed to call her son. As soon as she did I told her to hang up and “Unplug your computer right now.” I treated it as compromised in the worst way, since he had had his way with the machine for some time before she called. As she didn’t really use it for much, and she used her iPad for day to day things, I had her ship it to me across the country so I could grab her documents and reimage it. I yanked the old hard drive, put in a nice SSD for her, restored MacOS and put the handful of files she had back. Thankfully she didn’t keep huge amounts of stuff on the machine. I then shipped the machine back to her and she was as pleased as punch. Public floggings of these criminals might be interesting to watch. ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Mabes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mike_mabes/32/1782_2.png) [@Mike\_Mabes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mike_Mabes)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/34 "2022-10-20T15:28:15Z")
What I am going to do today is Reset the PC, then run Malware bytes. Then I will look into a clean reinstall, I know she does not have a DVD drive so I’ll have to go through the steps to do it from a USB drive. Or maybe I’ll just contact a tech company, I’m too tired to think about it now. BTW I work 3rd shift, so this is when I would normally be sleeping I see that a clean reinstall is the only way to be 100% sure, but by now the scammers probably know they have been found out. They’ll probably just move on to the next victim, there must be hundreds. Are they really going to come back to Mom’s computer and try again? It’s possible Oh, one last thing. Can I create the USB to reinstall on my computer? It would be easier. ---
**Author:** ![Kron](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kron/32/12444_2.png) [@Kron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kron)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/35 "2022-10-20T15:43:31Z")
> [@Mike\_Mabes](#): > > Can I create the USB to reinstall on my computer? It would be easier. Yes. > **[Create installation media for Windows - Microsoft Support](https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/create-installation-media-for-windows-99a58364-8c02-206f-aa6f-40c3b507420d)** > > Learn how to create installation media for installing or reinstalling Windows 7, Windows 8.1, or Windows 10. ETA: I believe you need an 8GB USB thumb drive; it will be completely reformatted during the installation creation process. ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Mabes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mike_mabes/32/1782_2.png) [@Mike\_Mabes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mike_Mabes)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/36 "2022-10-20T15:44:37Z")
I really am tired and was just about to edit. Why wouldn’t I be able to do it here? Not sure what version of Windows she has, probably 8 or 9, I guess I will do 11. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/37 "2022-10-20T15:49:49Z")
If they had access to the computer for an hour, it may be possible that the UEFI was modified. If they were able to manage that (not sure it is still doable these days) a clean OS install might not be sufficient to eliminate the vulnerability. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/38 "2022-10-20T15:49:54Z")
I agree. I feel that 80% of legitimate tech people I talk to online have Indian accents, so the presence of an Indian accent is not indicative of anything to me. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/39 "2022-10-20T15:52:48Z")
In the case of the story in the OP, the bit that should have raised suspicions wasn’t the Indian accent but the pop-up box warning of the compromise and providing a number to call. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2022, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540/40 "2022-10-20T18:18:12Z")
> [@Mike\_Mabes](#): > > I see that a clean reinstall is the only way to be 100% sure, but by now the scammers probably know they have been found out. They’ll probably just move on to the next victim, there must be hundreds. Are they really going to come back to Mom’s computer and try again? It’s possible Of course they’ll keep trying. Because it’s not “them”, it’s their computers. They have automated stuff on her computer now that will absolutely positively phone home as soon as she logs onto her bank again. And you’ll / she’ll be right back where she started: totally vulnerable to rampant theft. I STRONGLY suggest you quit trying to do this the apparently easier way, with malware scans, etc., that may well miss some of what was done. In the biz they simply wipe a machine that had this happen. Anything else simply has too low a success percentage to be worthwhile. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-this-be-a-scam-against-my-mom/973540.md?page=3)