# Could you knock out an enraged chimp?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [July 7, 2010, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830 "2010-07-07T08:20:07Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 15
### Author:  [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/281 "2010-07-17T05:32:35Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> …The skull is only 1/4 inch **think** piece of bone …
:D. I make that typo a lot. But it really works here.😉
[QUOTE=Magiver]
What would help the argument either way is if I knew why the caps of water bottles are cored out on impact. Clearly the design of the bottle plays a major role in the event.
[/QUOTE]
Cored out on impact? What do you mean?
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### Author:  [@EVIL\_COW\_PIE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EVIL_COW_PIE)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/282 "2010-07-17T06:02:27Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> What would help the argument either way is if I knew why the caps of water bottles are cored out on impact.
No, what would help is you providing some cites to back up your speculations.
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### Author:  [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/283 "2010-07-17T06:13:06Z")
A printout of this thread could knock out an enraged chimp.
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### Author:  [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/284 "2010-07-17T06:28:31Z")
> [@Autolycus](#):
>
> A printout of this thread could knock out an enraged chimp.
But only if you hit him on left side of the head with the first 3 pages and the right side of the head with last 3 pages. Simultaniously of course.
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### Author:  [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/285 "2010-07-17T07:17:16Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> As I’ve said before, I’ve seen people tagged with a very innocuous looking jab to the head.
Find me youtube video of this and I can almost guarantee that you’ll see either the puncher or the punchee moving their bodyweight into the punch.
> [@](#):
>
> The skull is only 1/4 inch think piece of bone and it loses some of the dome structural integrity in the flattened sides. For discussion purposes I would expect a nominal strike speed of 10 mph. that energy would be focused on a 1/2 inch knuckle. I would expect that to be more than enough to compress the skull and transmit the kinetic energy into the brain.
Enough talk, time for you to test your theory. Remember, even the best imagined theories can be wrong! (This is something everyone in this thread but you is painfully aware of by now). Here’s the test: Get yourself a ceramic cereal bowl. It’ll be about 1/4 of an inch thick and the bottom will be flat, like the side of your head. Place it down on the floor upside-down on top of an egg. Now punch it as hard as you can!!! Now go to the hospital, because you just broke your hand. Luckily the egg will be fine. Did you videotape it? Great, upload it to youtube, thanks.
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### Author:  [@GHO57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GHO57)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/286 "2010-07-17T07:44:23Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> What would help the argument either way is if I knew why the caps of water bottles are cored out on impact. Clearly the design of the bottle plays a major role in the event.
You do realize that a 1 litre bottle dropped from 6 meters high has more kinetic energy than your double punch? Why the cap fails… is probably a hydraulics thing. Liquids tend to be non-compressible and by dropping it you’re trying to compress the liquid… which will push back… expanding the bottle…and as the bottle flexes back to shape, it’ll deliver all of that energy towards the only unoccupied space, which happens to be at the top. The narrowing of the mouth of the bottle will act as force multiplier, just like any hydraulic system, pushing against the cap… which isn’t designed to withstand the force.
Also, please do what the evil one suggested.
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### Author:  [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/287 "2010-07-17T08:11:26Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#):
>
> Here’s the test: Get yourself a ceramic cereal bowl. It’ll be about 1/4 of an inch thick and the bottom will be flat, like the side of your head. Place it down on the floor upside-down on top of an egg. Now punch it as hard as you can!!! Now go to the hospital, because you just broke your hand. Luckily the egg will be fine. Did you videotape it? Great, upload it to youtube, thanks.
Or better yet, try these two tests:
First punch the bowl on both sides at the same time. It won’t break and the egg will be fine. Now, punch the bowl from just one side with the same force. The bowl will move with enough force to break the egg inside. See what’s going here?
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### Author:  [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/288 "2010-07-17T10:07:17Z")
> [@PlainJain](#):
>
> But only if you hit him on left side of the head with the first 3 pages and the right side of the head with last 3 pages. Simultaniously of course.
What if the chimp was on a treadmill?
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### Author:  [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/289 "2010-07-17T14:20:40Z")
> [@Malacandra](#):
>
> What if the chimp was on a treadmill?
What if two people, each one on either side of the chimp, who were both standing on treadmills that were moving away from the chimp, simultaneously through double punches, so that four punches would land at once - equidistant from one another about the chimp’s head, but the speed of each punch was equal and opposite to the speed of the their respective treadmills?
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### Author:  [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/290 "2010-07-17T19:03:21Z")
> [@Darth\_Panda](#):
>
> What if two people, each one on either side of the chimp, who were both standing on treadmills that were moving away from the chimp, simultaneously through double punches, so that four punches would land at once - equidistant from one another about the chimp’s head, but the speed of each punch was equal and opposite to the speed of the their respective treadmills?
Also, this all happens inside a giant sealed box.
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### Author:  [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)
#### Post date: [July 17, 2010, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/291 "2010-07-17T20:04:39Z")
> [@Autolycus](#):
>
> Also, this all happens inside a giant sealed box.
…and before the first punch is thrown, Monty opens one of two other identical boxes.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/292 "2010-07-18T05:31:52Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#):
>
> Enough talk, time for you to test your theory.
Ceramic doesn’t bend.
I have a better test but I need a volunteer.
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### Author:  [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/293 "2010-07-18T05:47:44Z")
I’m sure there’s not just me who would be prepared to pay good money - well, up to £50! - to see **Magiver** demonstrate his patented “Double-Whammy[SUP]TM[/SUP]” blow on an enraged chimp. I’d even pay to watch him doing it on a stoned chimp, in the hope he’d enrage it!
How much could we get a chimp for, Dopers?
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/294 "2010-07-18T06:26:29Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#):
>
> I’m sure there’s not just me who would be prepared to pay good money - well, up to £50! - to see **Magiver** demonstrate his patented “Double-Whammy[SUP]TM[/SUP]” blow on an enraged chimp. I’d even pay to watch him doing it on a stoned chimp, in the hope he’d enrage it!
>
> How much could we get a chimp for, Dopers?
I was thinking one of you could put your money where your mouth is. AFAIK it would be a good chimp substitute and I wouldn’t be violating any cruelty to animals laws.
come on, you know you want to do it.
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### Author:  [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/295 "2010-07-18T06:34:30Z")
Well, at least you didn’t say you’d make a monkey out of me. If you lived anywhere near the north-west of England, I’d invite you down to the gym my cousin trains Greco-Roman wrestling in; I’m sure they’d find your Double-Whammy lessons to be very entertaining.
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### Author:  [@GHO57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GHO57)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/296 "2010-07-18T09:31:20Z")
Nobody did the math?
Ke = 0.5mv^2 (formula for kinetic energy)
v = 4.47m/s (10mph) times 2
m = 3.35kg (average arm weight [http://www.ulb.ac.be/medecine/anatemb/biblio/Chandler1975.pdf](http://www.ulb.ac.be/medecine/anatemb/biblio/Chandler1975.pdf)) times 2
Gives… about 267 Joules; calculated for just one arm, it’s something like 33 Joules.
Now, if I was to jog into an object at my normal relaxed jogging speed with fist extended… 95Kg times 3m/s gives Ke behind my fist at 427.5 Joules. In full sprint, (30kph) I’d hit 3000 and a bit Joules.
For reference Rocky Marciano’s overhand right was tested on a ballistic pendulum, and calculated to deliver 900+ Joules (that’s with a 50’s boxing glove on mind you).
_shrug_
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> I was thinking one of you could put your money where your mouth is. AFAIK it would be a good chimp substitute and I wouldn’t be violating any cruelty to animals laws.
>
> come on, you know you want to do it.
Make it worth the flight; call it €1000? and I’m willing to help test the theory, I’ll even let you take the first punch(es)… we got a deal?
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### Author:  [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/297 "2010-07-18T12:38:15Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#):
>
> I’m sure there’s not just me who would be prepared to pay good money - well, up to £50! - to see **Magiver** demonstrate his patented “Double-Whammy[SUP]TM[/SUP]” blow on an enraged chimp. I’d even pay to watch him doing it on a stoned chimp, in the hope he’d enrage it!
>
> How much could we get a chimp for, Dopers?
[This guy](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xp9Gm-aRe5A) looks like he’s up for pretty much anything - and he may very well be stoned.
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### Author:  [@Enter\_the\_Flagon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enter_the_Flagon)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/298 "2010-07-18T15:44:09Z")
> [@Magiver](#):
>
> Ceramic doesn’t bend.
>
> I have a better test but I need a volunteer.
Actually, Magiver, assuming you’re serious, there is a way that you could put this debate to rest, or at least lend substantial support to your theory.
Some martial artists have long maintained that, when a man has obtained sufficient striking ability to crush a coconut shell with his hand, he can do the same to a human skull.
This legend, apparently, [has some basis in fact:](http://www2.tbo.com/content/2009/mar/20/na-sport-science-skull-breaks-like-a-coconut/)
> [@](#):
>
> “How much pressure per square inch can a human skull take before cracking?”
>
> Viewers learned last season that a skull fractures at about 1,400 pounds per square inch, roughly the same as a coconut.
I’d really like to see a YouTube video of you being furnished with a coconut by one of our skeptical dopers, and breaking it in front of the camera with your two hand strike. That video would go a long way toward stanching all the derision being directed your way, IMO.
I suspect, though, that I’ll never see such a video. Instead, I believe that, after reading this post, you’ll hie to the grocery store for a coconut, try out your two hand strike on said coconut, hurt yourself, and either:
A) disappear from this thread entirely, never having admitted defeat, or
B) claim to have utterly destroyed the coconut, but never produce a video that could satisfy a reasonably skeptical observer.
Prove me wrong.
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### Author:  [@EVIL\_COW\_PIE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EVIL_COW_PIE)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/299 "2010-07-18T17:42:08Z")
You’ll notice \*\*Magiver \*\*is pretty selective in his responses. I think **Plain Jain** makes a pretty reasonable case in her test suggestions above for example, but nary a peep from **Magiver** which has been SOP in the last half of this thread. At this point he is cherry-picking.
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### Author:  [@shijinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shijinn)
#### Post date: [July 18, 2010, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-knock-out-an-enraged-chimp/545830/300 "2010-07-18T17:59:09Z")
is there a word or phrase for this? where someone plain refuses to see your point and continues to draw out the argument on his own terms?
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