# Could you remain friends with a person who left their spouse because the spouse had been crippled? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 29, 2014, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480 "2014-12-29T22:18:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/141 "2014-12-31T01:52:29Z")
And even if she did leave him because his disability didn’t fit with her life plan, it’s clear that she wasn’t really in love with him in the first place and both are better off apart. No need to pass judgment, people rush into marriage all the time. Not every relationship goes thru such a powerfully clarifying experience as a cervical spinal cord injury. ---
**Author:** ![Waymore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Waymore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waymore)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/142 "2014-12-31T02:02:43Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > And even if she did leave him because his disability didn’t fit with her life plan, it’s clear that she wasn’t really in love with him in the first place and both are better off apart. No need to pass judgment, people rush into marriage all the time. Not every relationship goes thru such a powerfully clarifying experience as a cervical spinal cord injury. Is there anybody who doesn’t pass judgment? Call a spade a spade. I’m not saying that the woman that inspired the thread deserves to be ill treated, or that, being her former friend, I wouldn’t offer help if she found herself in a bad situation. But to pal around with somebody who behaved so contemptibly towards the person who has a just claim to her love and devotion, _especially_ after being sentenced to life in a wheelchair? I don’t have it in me to be that fake. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/143 "2014-12-31T02:14:32Z")
> [@Waymore](#): > > Is there anybody who doesn’t pass judgment? Call a spade a spade. > > I’m not saying that the woman that inspired the thread deserves to be ill treated, or that, being her former friend, I wouldn’t offer help if she found herself in a bad situation. But to pal around with somebody who behaved so contemptibly towards the person who has a just claim to her love and devotion, _especially_ after being sentenced to life in a wheelchair? I don’t have it in me to be that fake. Let’s assume, for the sake of this discussion, that this couple is not truly in love. Erica pretty obviously isn’t in love with Geoff and it wouldn’t be much of a stretch to think that Geoff really didn’t love Erica, either. He may be in an incredibly vulnerable, pitiable position in his life right now but that doesnt mean he needs the company of a woman/partner who doesnt want to be there. He has money, nurses are within his means. He (and she) deserves more. ---
**Author:** ![Waymore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Waymore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waymore)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/144 "2014-12-31T02:20:34Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Let’s assume, for the sake of this discussion, that this couple is not truly in love. Erica pretty obviously isn’t in love with Geoff and it wouldn’t be much of a stretch to think that Geoff really didn’t love Erica, either. He may be in an incredibly vulnerable, pitiable position in his life right now but that doesnt mean he needs the company of a woman/partner who doesnt want to be there. He has money, nurses are within his means. He (and she) deserves more. I think the fact that Erica left when she did is proof positive that she wasn’t really in love. I don’t know how you can surmise the contents of Geoff’s heart from the information presented. Maybe Geoff will be better off without her, maybe not. I don’t see how we can judge that knowing as little as we do, and even if we could, it’s beside the point. Erica is demonstrably an incredibly selfish person. Knowing that, if I were to honestly answer the question that is the title of this thread, the answer would be no. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/145 "2014-12-31T02:26:17Z")
Of course he is better off without her. How could you possibly say anything but? What would the situation be in which he _wasn’t_ worse off staying in an utterly loveless marriage? ETA: And a marriage in which only one partner is in “love” I would say is a loveless marriage. ---
**Author:** ![Waymore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Waymore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waymore)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/146 "2014-12-31T02:34:14Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Of course he is better off without her. How could you possibly say anything but? What would the situation be in which he _wasn’t_ worse off staying in an utterly loveless marriage? > > ETA: And a marriage in which only one partner is in “love” I would say is a loveless marriage. How could you say her actions aren’t selfish? I don’t think I can judge a counterfactual involving people I’ve not met. I’ll reserve judgment on that. The way you define a “loveless marriage” seems problematic. If one partner is in love, then _ipso facto_ there’s love in the marriage. Might be more sensible to call it a marriage of requited love. ---
**Author:** ![Chief\_Pedant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@Chief\_Pedant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chief_Pedant)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/147 "2014-12-31T16:51:35Z")
Not sure if it’s been addressed, but if Geoff is actually rich, Erica is easily replaceable with an attractive alternative for Geoff. There’s a physical tragedy, but not a relationship tragedy, here for Geoff. Real life proves over and over again that money can buy companionship for even the most disabled or dysfunctional people. If Erica does bail w/o a share of Geoff’s financial largesse, I’m betting she comes to regret it. Free and poor when you couldda been rich sucks. But Geoff oughtta boot her out the moment he catches wind she wants to be free. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/148 "2014-12-31T18:14:47Z")
> [@Waymore](#): > > Is there anybody who doesn’t pass judgment? Call a spade a spade. > > I’m not saying that the woman that inspired the thread deserves to be ill treated, or that, being her former friend, I wouldn’t offer help if she found herself in a bad situation. But to pal around with somebody who behaved so contemptibly towards the person who has a just claim to her love and devotion, _especially_ after being sentenced to life in a wheelchair? I don’t have it in me to be that fake. if you think people owe loyalty to their spouses (which they do), don’t they also owe duties of loyalty to their friends? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/149 "2014-12-31T18:17:09Z")
> [@Waymore](#): > > Is there anybody who doesn’t pass judgment? Call a spade a spade. > > I’m not saying that the woman that inspired the thread deserves to be ill treated, or that, being her former friend, I wouldn’t offer help if she found herself in a bad situation. But to pal around with somebody who behaved so contemptibly towards the person who has a just claim to her love and devotion, _especially_ after being sentenced to life in a wheelchair? I don’t have it in me to be that fake. No one inspired this thread. Erica is as imaginary as Bob X the daddy superhero. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/150 "2014-12-31T21:42:35Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > You know, being married to a disabled person does not mean being shackled to a disabled person. > > I married a disabled man and there are some things he just can not do. However, he has NEVER stopped me from doing those things. Indeed, he _encourages_ me to do things even when he can not join me in doing them. > > Thus - assuming this couple is financially well off and Erica is not the only caretaker - Erica would NOT have to be the “live in nurse”, she could still go to restaurants (actually, quads can go to restaurants, too), long drives in the country, and yes, even travel the world. She may not be able to do it _with Geoff_. Many people just dislike doing stuff alone, or simply even without their SO. I know of some who might or might not stay with a newly disabled spouse but who, in any case, wouldn’t ever take vacations without him. I’m not trying to excuse Erika at all costs, just saying that it’s impossible to assess her behaviour, let alone judge her, without knowing a whole lot more about her. ---
**Author:** ![CrazyCatLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CrazyCatLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrazyCatLady)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/151 "2014-12-31T22:51:55Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > I married a disabled man and there are some things he just can not do. However, he has NEVER stopped me from doing those things. Indeed, he _encourages_ me to do things even when he can not join me in doing them. Well, and we encourage each other to go do stuff we can’t/don’t want to take part in all the time. But it’s generally stuff that involves non-shared hobbies, or temporary restrictions. It works great in those cases. He spends three days sweating his ass off in a field listening to hugely amplified loud music while I sit at home in the air conditioning knitting. I spend a couple days filling my car with unwashed fleece and learning about tools I’ll never break down and buy while he stays home and starts a batch of homebrew. Sometimes he goes on an awesome trip while I go to work, and he calls and tells me about all the stuff I just have to see and do when we go back together. Sometimes I go on a trip while he works and call and tell him about the stuff he just has to see and do when we come back together. And that’s _great_. > [@](#): > > Thus - assuming this couple is financially well off and Erica is not the only caretaker - Erica would NOT have to be the “live in nurse”, she could still go to restaurants (actually, quads can go to restaurants, too), long drives in the country, and yes, even travel the world. She may not be able to do it _with Geoff_. That would be a hell of a lot less great. Doing those things with him is half the fun of doing them at all, and besides I would hate consistently going out and doing things he wants to do and can’t and then coming home to tell him how awesome it is. It would be rubbing lemon juice and salt in a psychological paper cut and would make me feel like world’s biggest asshole. I can’t imagine it wouldn’t eventually make him resentful. Or vice versa, really. Besides, I get homesick waking up in a hotel room without him, even if I only left the afternoon before. We can travel together for a couple of weeks, and I don’t get homesick. I get ready to see the dog and sleep in my own bed and go back to my daily life, but I don’t get homesick. I can visit family for a few days without getting homesick. But one night in a hotel without him, and I’m like a little kid going to sleep-away camp for the first time. > [@jsgoddess](#): > > And more, I only want to be married to someone who wants to be married to me, and is not staying out of some sort of obligation or, worse, some weird attempt at saintly self-sacrifice. Exactly. I don’t want to be the pity-spouse, the millstone around his neck, or the backup plan. I deserve better than that, and so does he. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2014, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/152 "2014-12-31T23:16:12Z")
I definitely couldn’t be friends with someone who abandoned a child, disabled or otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/153 "2015-01-01T00:09:02Z")
> [@bump](#): > > That’s just it… to me, Erica’s way of thinking shows a profound immaturity as far as her concept of marriage is concerned. This is basically an extraordinarily extreme version of the "woman got fat and tits sagged after having kids. She may be fat & saggy & not excite you like when you first met but she can still intimate. Can Geoff be intimate? Can he have sex? Can he cuddle or caress her? Is her draping his arm over her the same feeling as him _holding_ her? Is asking a relatively young woman to never be intimate again fair? Even if she had his blessing, could she/would she want casual sex from someone else or would she only want to be intimate with someone she has feelings for? Don’t skewer me here, I’m only asking questions, not stating what I’d do in a hypothetical situation > [@Broomstick](#): > > You know, being married to a disabled person does not mean being shackled to a disabled person. > > I married a disabled man and there are some things he just can not do. However, he has NEVER stopped me from doing those things. Indeed, he _encourages_ me to do things even when he can not join me in doing them. > > Thus - assuming this couple is financially well off and Erica is not the only caretaker - Erica would NOT have to be the “live in nurse”, she could still go to restaurants (actually, quads can go to restaurants, too), long drives in the country, and yes, even travel the world. She may not be able to do it _with Geoff_. We all come into this with our own backgrounds & perspectives. I’ve interacted with quads before, & they were all vent-dependent. Since it wasn’t stated, is Geoff? If so, he can’t go to a restaurant or for a long drive, meaning she can basically interact with him in one room. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/154 "2015-01-01T00:51:07Z")
> [@CrazyCatLady](#): > > That would be a hell of a lot less great. Doing those things with him is half the fun of doing them at all, and besides I would hate consistently going out and doing things he wants to do and can’t and then coming home to tell him how awesome it is. It would be rubbing lemon juice and salt in a psychological paper cut and would make me feel like world’s biggest asshole. I can’t imagine it wouldn’t eventually make him resentful. Or vice versa, really. We just don’t know, do we? I can enjoy the fact my spouse is enjoying something I can’t do with him, for whatever reason. If I was that disabled I wouldn’t want to stop him from going out, seeing friends, basically doing stuff even if I couldn’t. Of course, not everyone has that capability. I do find it interesting that there’s a tendency for those of us this in this thread who are either disabled or living with someone disabled tend to be more sympathetic to Erica than those who aren’t in either of those categories. ---
**Author:** ![Waymore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Waymore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waymore)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/155 "2015-01-01T08:03:42Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > if you think people owe loyalty to their spouses (which they do), don’t they also owe duties of loyalty to their friends? Yes, but it’s not a duty to look away or excuse incredibly selfish behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Waymore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Waymore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waymore)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/156 "2015-01-01T08:04:51Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > No one inspired this thread. Erica is as imaginary as Bob X the daddy superhero. Duely noted. ---
**Author:** ![Weedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/weedy/32/301_2.png) [@Weedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weedy)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 9:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/157 "2015-01-01T09:40:58Z")
I think I would still be friends with Erica. My partner became moderately disabled after I met him (not wheelchair level, though) and it can be tough at times. I don’t always handle things perfectly, and he doesn’t always handle his disability perfectly either. We mostly manage to find a way to deal with problems but I can easily see how maybe some couples wouldn’t work it out or how some of the issues could take a relationship completely off the rails. Reading this thread, most people’s sticking point seems to be the marriage vows. I’m not a big believer in marriage so I don’t really care about that side of it. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/158 "2015-01-01T14:32:04Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > I can enjoy the fact my spouse is enjoying something I can’t do with him, for whatever reason. If I was that disabled I wouldn’t want to stop him from going out, seeing friends, basically doing stuff even if I couldn’t. Of course, not everyone has that capability. Maybe this is just me exposing my own selfishness and immaturity, but I wouldn’t be able to enjoy hearing about all the fun adventures my SO was having if I was confined to a bed and a small room, parked in front of a TV all day. I’d enjoy it the first fifty or sixty times, perhaps. But after then, I wouldn’t want to hear about it. And I wouldn’t want to have to pretend to enjoy it either. I don’t think love is that powerful that it would keep me from feeling resentment. If I can’t move or go anywhere or do anything, I’d feel especially entitled to my feelings and emotional reactions. Having to pretend I’m happy all the time would rob me of the last shred of agency I have let. I want to be able to feel crappy without anyone telling me I must be strong for _them_. Or without them trying to guilt me by saying stuff like, “If you loved me, you’d want to hear about me cave-diving, since this is what we’d always talked about doing before the accident.” If I were Goeff, I’d be relieved that Erica wanted a divorce. I’d want one too. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/159 "2015-01-01T15:33:13Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > And even if she did leave him because his disability didn’t fit with her life plan, it’s clear that she wasn’t really in love with him in the first place and both are better off apart. Agreed. > [@Ambivalid](#): > > No need to pass judgment, people rush into marriage all the time. Not every relationship goes thru such a powerfully clarifying experience as a cervical spinal cord injury. Why not judge? After a _powerful clarification_ seems like the best possible time to reassess what you see in the character of others (or yourself). Now you have _evidence_, where before you had hopes, assumptions, expectations. ---
**Author:** ![missred](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/missred/32/14096_2.png) [@missred](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missred)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480/160 "2015-01-01T21:14:41Z")
I have a question for those who would defriend Erica: if instead of the accident that left Geoff a quadriplegic, he was mentally ill and stopped taking meds, would your opinion be the same? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/could-you-remain-friends-with-a-person-who-left-their-spouse-because-the-spouse-had-been-crippled/708480.md?page=9)