# Counterpoint in Rock/Pop music **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 1, 2020, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762 "2020-03-01T23:30:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![carlb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carlb/32/5930_2.png) [@carlb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carlb)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2020, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/1 "2020-03-01T23:30:14Z")
At least, I think I’m using the term correctly. I was listening to Pandora today, and the Guess Who came on with, “No Sugar Tonight/New Mother Nature.” I really love the last verse, where, “No Sugar Tonight,” is sung over top of, “New Mother Nature.” You can listen to the last verse [here](https://youtu.be/yMG-Mi9I0-k?t=237) if you’re not familiar with the song. This is an example of counterpoint, yes? If not, what do you call it? Anyway, I love when this happens. See also Simon and Garfunkel beginning in the second verse of, [“Scarborough Fair/Canticle.”](https://youtu.be/-Jj4s9I-53g?t=43) What are your favorite examples of this in rock/pop music? ---
**Author:** ![jaycat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jaycat/32/3015_2.png) [@jaycat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jaycat)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/2 "2020-03-02T01:51:40Z")
[Return with us now to those days of yesteryear … (second verse).](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfWKR-6VSTA&list=PLowQCq3Ss89i7sLxA7PXFwWQrp_0ViyL3&index=7) ---
**Author:** ![Treppenwitz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treppenwitz/32/3445_2.png) [@Treppenwitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Treppenwitz)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/3 "2020-03-02T15:41:06Z")
[Tubthumping](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuNU20bDTGU) by Chumbawumba - pretty much the last minute of the record. (There’s always a place in the world for a perfect pop song. I therefore recommend you listen to all of it. More than once.) j (PS: how do you set up a youtube video to play from a specific point?) ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/4 "2020-03-02T15:47:00Z")
[Dinner Bell](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8PWHOVYhI8) by They Might Be Giants (the part starting at about 0:41). ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/5 "2020-03-02T15:58:58Z")
“The Rock” from Quadrophenia takes four musical themes and melds them into one. ---
**Author:** ![carlb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carlb/32/5930_2.png) [@carlb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carlb)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/6 "2020-03-02T16:11:58Z")
> [@Treppenwitz](#): > > [Tubthumping](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuNU20bDTGU) by Chumbawumba - pretty much the last minute of the record. (There’s always a place in the world for a perfect pop song. I therefore recommend you listen to all of it. More than once.) > > j > > (PS: how do you set up a youtube video to play from a specific point?) When you click on the “Share” button in YouTube there is a little radio button at the bottom you can click to start at a specific time. Or, it looks like you can just append, “t=XXX” to the end of the URL, where, “XXX” is the number of seconds into the track where you want to start. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/7 "2020-03-02T16:32:27Z")
> [@Treppenwitz](#): > > [Tubthumping](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuNU20bDTGU) by Chumbawumba - pretty much the last minute of the record. (There’s always a place in the world for a perfect pop song. I therefore recommend you listen to all of it. More than once.) > > j > > (PS: how do you set up a youtube video to play from a specific point?) You could also just right click on the video when it gets to the spot you want and select “Copy video URL at current time.” ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/8 "2020-03-02T16:35:25Z")
All For the Best from Godspell. The Jesus/Judas counterpoint in the last verse. ---
**Author:** ![Treppenwitz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treppenwitz/32/3445_2.png) [@Treppenwitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Treppenwitz)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/9 "2020-03-02T16:57:17Z")
Thank you **carlb** and **puly** - got it!. (On the other hand, the downside was that I had to think of another example, just so I could demonstrate that I really have got it.) Here you go: [Knowing me, knowing you](https://youtu.be/iUrzicaiRLU?t=125). (Actually, I seem to remember Abba doing this a lot). j ---
**Author:** ![74westy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/74westy/32/3950_2.png) [@74westy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/74westy)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/10 "2020-03-02T16:57:48Z")
Early on the Beatles did a lot of call and response stuff that, at its best, became counterpoint. Help! comes to mind. Later on, I’ve Got a Feeling was a mashup of a McCartney song and a Lennon song (Everybody Had a Hard Year). ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/11 "2020-03-02T17:33:48Z")
> [@carlb](#): > > What are your favorite examples of this in rock/pop music? Sleater-Kinney do a lot of this, especially on the album _The Hot Rock_. ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanub/32/132_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUB)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/12 "2020-03-02T17:36:31Z")
Does it have to be two separate, actual stand alone by themselves songs? The first thing I thought of after reading the OP is Collective Soul’s [December](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6exsatE-DUk). Somewhere around 4:30ish starts the bridge “December promise you gave unto me December whispers of treachery December clouds are now covering me December songs no longer I sing” And then at 4:57 the chorus (“don’t think about . . .”)is song on top of it. That’s always been my favorite part of the song. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/13 "2020-03-02T19:02:58Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > All For the Best from Godspell. The Jesus/Judas counterpoint in the last verse. I’d forgotten about that! Masterful. The “counterpoint” is called a Counter Melody… at least that’s what I learned from the liner notes to “From Silver Lake” on Jackson Browne’s first album. [Here it is…](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgKyhS1cC3A) skip to 2:40 for Jackson and Leah Kunkel playing off each other… ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2020, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/14 "2020-03-02T21:52:02Z")
_Should I Stay Or Should I Go?_ by The Clash ---
**Author:** ![Author\_Balk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Author\_Balk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Author_Balk)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2020, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/15 "2020-03-03T12:27:32Z")
If I understand correctly… Itsy Bitsy Spider by Carly Simon. It has Itsy Bitsy Spider along with Coming Around Again [![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/8iCR0BcvM54/hqdefault.jpg "Carly Simon - Itsy Bitsy Spider") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iCR0BcvM54) ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2020, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counterpoint-in-rock-pop-music/848762/16 "2020-03-03T13:59:56Z")
Not a lyrical counterpoint, but I always thought that the _Hawaii Five-O_ was brilliant musical counterpoint. One of the reasons I dislike the remake of the show is that they cut off the theme song before it really gets to the good part. [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zd6GyJoWPq8)