# Counting French Toast **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 1, 2017, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764 "2017-10-01T20:55:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2017, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/21 "2017-10-01T23:36:58Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > A loaf of bread is not a sandwich. If you made the 12" loaf into a sandwich and then cut it in half, you would be getting two half sandwiches, not two sandwiches. That’s exactly the situation I specified. It was made as a 12" sandwich, then cut in half and sold as two 6" sandwiches. We can even suppose that the 6" wasn’t specified at all. You’re at a deli–not upscale but maybe a step or two above Subway. They offer sandwiches for $7. You order two and get a 12" cut in half. Is that a problem? > [@Colibri](#): > > If you ordered a typical sandwich of the kind made from two slices of bread in a restaurant, would you in fact feel like you got a whole sandwich if you got one made on two half slices of bread (unless the menu indicated that was the case)? It depends entirely on the size of the bread. In fact that exact situation has happened to me: I ordered “a sandwich” and it came on two half-slices of bread. But the bread was from a large sourdough and the halves were still larger than a typical 100 mm square slice. So I wasn’t disappointed. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2017, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/22 "2017-10-01T23:40:24Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > There’s another way of answering this–the FDA specifies the serving size for French toast: > [CFR - Code of Federal Regulations Title 21](https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/cfrsearch.cfm?fr=101.12) > > _French toast, crepes, pancakes, variety mixes > 110 g prepaed_ [sic] _for French toast, crepes, and pancakes; 40 g dry mix for variety mixes > \_piece(s) (\_g); \_cup(s) (\_g) for dry mix_ > > So, 110 g for a piece. That actually sounds like a lot to me–more, I suspect, than even a normal single slice. We’ve all been cheated! Not for _a piece_ - for a _serving size_. At say 28 grams per slice of bread, double the weight after soaking in egg, the FDA serving size for French Toast is 2 slices of bread, or 4 pieces. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2017, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/23 "2017-10-01T23:47:43Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Not for _a piece_ - for a _serving size_. At say 28 grams per slice of bread, double the weight after soaking in egg, the FDA serving size for French Toast is 2 slices of bread, or 4 pieces. Ahh, I misread the third column. Although it specifies “pieces”, that doesn’t necessarily imply that a piece is that large. It’s just that they’re required to report in units of pieces. So it doesn’t really answer anything unless we have a baseline expectation for translating pieces to serving size. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2017, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/24 "2017-10-01T23:55:30Z")
Or another one to toast your noggin: You decide to make French toast from a baguette. You can cut the slices perpendicular to the long axis. Or, you can cut the pieces on a sharp diagonal, then cut them in half again. The final area is the same in both cases. Is there a problem? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/25 "2017-10-02T01:39:30Z")
You know, I initially voted one piece, but, after deep reflection and soul-searching, I have been swayed to the other side. It’s one slice, but two pieces. While I am not a French toast afficianado, and while I do make French toast from time to time, I always do one piece = one slice. That said, it is common to slice the bread diagonally and fry it up in two pieces. If I have a stack of these French toasts pieces in the middle of the table and ask someone to pass me a piece of French toast, I would expect them to pass me one triangular half, not two halves to make up a slice. So, please remove one vote from the “Yes” column and put it in the “No” column. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/26 "2017-10-02T01:53:32Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > That’s exactly the situation I specified. It was made as a 12" sandwich, then cut in half and sold as two 6" sandwiches. You did not specify that. > [@](#): > > We can even suppose that the 6" wasn’t specified at all. You’re at a deli–not upscale but maybe a step or two above Subway. They offer sandwiches for $7. You order two and get a 12" cut in half. Is that a problem? Depends entirely on how it’s advertised. But a loaf is not a slice. > [@](#): > > It depends entirely on the size of the bread. In fact that exact situation has happened to me: I ordered “a sandwich” and it came on two half-slices of bread. But the bread was from a large sourdough and the halves were still larger than a typical 100 mm square slice. So I wasn’t disappointed. I specified a “typical sandwich,” which presumes made from a typical slice of bread. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/27 "2017-10-02T01:56:00Z")
I think Colibri has made the strongest argument. Suppose you and your friend went to a restaurant to eat. Your friend orders a cheeseburger. You’re feeling hungry so you order two cheeseburgers. Your orders arrive and the two of them are identical except that your cheeseburger has been cut in half. Would anybody argue that this was legit? You don’t turn cheeseburger into two cheeseburgers by cutting it in half. And you don’t turn one piece of French toast into two pieces of French toast by cutting in half either. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/28 "2017-10-02T01:58:12Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Or another one to toast your noggin: > You decide to make French toast from a baguette. You can cut the slices perpendicular to the long axis. Or, you can cut the pieces on a sharp diagonal, then cut them in half again. The final area is the same in both cases. Is there a problem? What exactly is your point regarding the OP? We’re not talking about that situation. You of course can make up other unusual scenarios but that doesn’t really bear on the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/29 "2017-10-02T02:10:31Z")
The underlying issue in the OP is whether the husband is right in thinking he was shortchanged in what he received based on what the menu said. I’m presuming that the OP is talking about a situation in which the slice is a typical piece of bread in the US, 4" to 5" on a side. I know nitpicking is a favorite pastime around here, so you can develop scenarios where half a slice of some very large loaf might not be considered shortchanged, but I don’t think that’s the basic question. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/30 "2017-10-02T02:12:47Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Or another one to toast your noggin: > You decide to make French toast from a baguette. You can cut the slices perpendicular to the long axis. Or, you can cut the pieces on a sharp diagonal, then cut them in half again. The final area is the same in both cases. Is there a problem? I think anyone would feel shortchanged if they received two slices from a baguette, either perpendicular of diagonal, when they were expecting two slices of regular bread. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/31 "2017-10-02T02:15:31Z")
I did not understand the question and voted incorrectly. There was one piece of French toast cut in half on that plate. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/32 "2017-10-02T02:16:48Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > What exactly is your point regarding the OP? We’re not talking about that situation. You of course can make up other unusual scenarios but that doesn’t really bear on the OP. If a claim doesn’t handle the general case, then it can’t be said to be true. As I read it, the claim is something like “cutting a food item in half can’t leave you with two food items”. I say that’s false, as demonstrated by the sandwich example and the fact that there are many possible variations on what a “piece” of French toast might be. So yes, a half-slice of French toast certainly qualifies as a “piece”. As could a quarter-slice or whatever. Whether we should be annoyed depends entirely on the size of the resulting piece and not on how it got to be that shape. Perhaps the claim was not meant to be general, and only applies to French toast _specifically_. But you’re the one that brought up sandwiches. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/33 "2017-10-02T02:25:38Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > I think anyone would feel shortchanged if they received two slices from a baguette, either perpendicular of diagonal, when they were expecting two slices of regular bread. Sure. But I was comparing the situations against each other. Does the fact that one is cut and the other not change the accounting, even though the area is the same? The shortchanging comes from the volume, not the cut. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/34 "2017-10-02T02:29:13Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > You did not specify that. I said “make”, then “cut”. For all I care, they can make a 72" sandwich and slice it into 12 pieces (well, as long as it doesn’t sit around for too long). > [@Colibri](#): > > I specified a “typical sandwich,” which presumes made from a typical slice of bread. When I order a sandwich in a restaurant, there’s rarely the slightest indication of what the bread will look like. I generally expect a volume roughly equivalent to a common square slice, but exactly what form that arrives in is up to the restaurant. Height also factors into it–I’ll accept a smaller piece of bread if the sandwich is well-stacked. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/35 "2017-10-02T02:59:00Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > I did not understand the question and voted incorrectly. There was one piece of French toast cut in half on that plate. Ok, then with my change of mind, we’ll trade votes and are good with the count. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/36 "2017-10-02T03:11:23Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I think Colibri has made the strongest argument. Suppose you and your friend went to a restaurant to eat. Your friend orders a cheeseburger. You’re feeling hungry so you order two cheeseburgers. Your orders arrive and the two of them are identical except that your cheeseburger has been cut in half. > > Would anybody argue that this was legit? But you’re not asking for a “piece” of something. You’re asking for a cheeseburger. This makes a difference. Granted, you can’t ask for “a French toast” but you can ask for a “slice” of French toast, versus a “piece” of French toast. Sometimes, when I make regular toast, I use slices of rye bread that can’t fit completely into the toaster. So I cut them in half. Each half is a “piece” of toast to me. Like I said above, if they’re on a plate and someone asks me to pass them a piece of toast, I would pass one half-slice, not two half-slices, and that’s what I would expect in return. > [@](#): > > You don’t turn cheeseburger into two cheeseburgers by cutting it in half. And you don’t turn one piece of French toast into two pieces of French toast by cutting in half either. But you do turn one slice of pizza into two slices of pizza by cutting them in half. (Or one “piece” of pizza into two “pieces.” Here in Chicago, we cut a pizza into squares, so each individual square is a “piece” and the pizza might be cut into bigger or fewer pizzas for any given pizza size. Some pizzerias will do 16 pieces for a 16"; some maybe do 25 or 36. It varies.) ---
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/37 "2017-10-02T03:21:00Z")
I don’t eat my French toast cut and even a restaurant I request it uncut …dennys finds it annoying … ihop dosent have a problem with it …crazy ottos never cut it in the first place … and long departed jimmys used maple flavored bread for its French toast sandwich … ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/38 "2017-10-02T08:25:25Z")
Huh, funny - just had this convo with my wife yesterday, when we told our youngest she couldn’t leave the table until she’d had one piece of toast in addition to her bacon. I meant one triangular piece, my wife thought I meant a whole slice. I said no, if I meant “slice” I’d have said “slice”, and I have a full awareness of exactly how far the Littlest Dibble can be made to eat non-meat foodstuffs :). ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/39 "2017-10-02T09:37:40Z")
Easy. The number of items dipped into the batter and placed on the skillet is the number of pieces of French toast. It doesn’t matter how many slices of bread it started out as, and in fact, breakfast for the whole family came from one piece (i.e., loaf) of bread, and is therefore one piece of French toast. Now, if the question is “How many slices?”, there might be a different discussion, since “slice” and “piece” have different definitions. As Mr. Dibble aptly points out. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2017, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764/40 "2017-10-02T14:33:22Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > If a claim doesn’t handle the general case, then it can’t be said to be true. As I read it, the claim is something like “cutting a food item in half can’t leave you with two food items”. I say that’s false, as demonstrated by the sandwich example and the fact that there are many possible variations on what a “piece” of French toast might be. > > So yes, a half-slice of French toast certainly qualifies as a “piece”. As could a quarter-slice or whatever. Whether we should be annoyed depends entirely on the size of the resulting piece and not on how it got to be that shape. > > Perhaps the claim was not meant to be general, and only applies to French toast _specifically_. But you’re the one that brought up sandwiches. But this is not an issue of semantics; it’s an issue of accepted practices. When you engage in a business transaction, both parties expect that the transaction will occur within certain known parameters. If you’re departing from those parameters you’re suppose to explicitly acknowledge it. So when I order two pieces of French toast for five dollars, I expect to receive two slices of bread, dipped in egg batter and then fried, with an appropriate accompaniment of butter and syrup, served on a plate along with eating utensils. And the owner expects me to pay in United States currency; not in Australian dollars or Monopoly money and a collection of pebbles that I’ve nicknamed dollars. If either of us is not acting within these expectations, we’re supposed to inform the other. The owner is supposed to tell me that his version of French toast is boiled, served with ketchup, and there’s a special one dollar fee for the use of a fork. Or that he cuts the slices in half and calls them two pieces. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/counting-french-toast/797764.md?page=3)