Colonials = Americans I assume?
LoL. It makes me feel all warm and fuzzy to hear this. Kind of like my Mom telling me that even though I am 26 years old I will always be “her baby”.
You guys just keep backing us up in all of our crazy wars, and we will make sure to not put you in a nursing home as you get old and crazy. 
But DEBASER you never write, you never phone… not like your nice brothers Australia and Canada.
This is supposed to be the BBC dammit; I expect better.
>> If you own a hedge, why can’t you cut it down?
>> If you own a cottage why can’t you remove thatch from it?
You do not have absolute property rights. You own certain rights to your property to the extent the laws allow them but you are still subject to all laws including zoning laws, environmental laws, laws for the preservation of historical properties, etc.
You may buy a painting which is of historical value and it is yours but there are legal limits to what you can do with it. Maybe you cannot export it.
In some UK towns there are tight restrictions on what you can and can’t do to your property if doing so would diminish the essential character of the neighbourhood - a fried of mine who used to live on the Isle of Wight was unable to have satellite TV installed as it would entail fitiing the dish on the property in a position visible from the street.
[quote]
Originally posted by casdavethe hedge was demolished by one pair of petty selfish individuals despite the order of a court not to do so.
[/qoute]
You’re right. These irresponsible mongrels have absolutely no respect for the natural world and should be immediately thrashed and sent to live the rest of their days in the salt mines.
And that’s really the crux of it, isn’t it? The idea that you cannot even own your own property is such a disgusting testament to the state of corruption and disregard for personal rights it makes me want to cry on my copy of 1984.
Gorgon
Nah, I don’t think so.
Personal rights in a collective society are not absolute and they cannot ever be so, rights have to be balanced against those of either individuals or communities.
…or you are free to do what you want as long as it does not infringe upon the rights of others, in this case the court determined that the actions of this couple did infringe another persons rights unlawfully.
Why should some selfish git destroy what beauty there is merely because they happen to have the wealth to be able to do so?
We look at endangered species and approve laws to protect them, even if you have the money and could purchase an environment in which they live you would not be allowed to destroy it, so how would this be akin to 1984 big brother?
Why are so many species in danger of extinction, both plants and animals, in many cases it is only because there is a market value for them, perhaps we should repeal the laws intended to protect such things from the depradations of the wealthy, maybe they should be allowed to destroy anything they can purchase.
I seriously doubt that any major industrial nation does not have restrictions upon building, even if you own the land you may well not be allowed to use it in any way you see fit.
If I sounded heavy-handed I apologize. I just tend to get steamed about this sort of thing.
I am a big advocate of individual rights and to put my thoughts succinctly and with mild hyperbole, “Beaurocracy is evil.”
I am easily offended by red tape, samantics and litigiousness by parties who want nothing more than stand in the way of someone else who wishes to do something that’s really NBFD.
Sorry if I hyjacked here, folks.
You disagree that it’s a good thing to preserve historical buildings and maintain an ecological balance? Or just that there are regulations and enforcement of this?
I’m not sure you can expect people to follow the principle without some threat of enforcement.
I think the punishment is right in this case - warnings were given and society doesn’t work if some elements think that they are above the law - for whatever reason.
As regard being in the same prison as MH - just hype I’m afraid.
A) There aren’t loads of women’s prisons
B) She probably isn’t even in the same wing, as lifers and sex offenders tend to be segregated
C) The last time we had separate prisons for separate crimes was, I think, debtors prisons over 100 years ago.
Martiju
MH is a lifer and* a sex offender.
Sort of…
(this is what I do for a living).
A) Completely true.
B) MH isn’t on rule 43 (her choice) and has very little trouble with the other prisoners (in fact she’s very popular - go figure!).
Womens wings aren’t as segregated as mens as there are so few of them, and most are in for short sentences, often for non payment of fines or drug related crime eg shoplifting. Remand prisoners are seperated but other than that they’re pretty mixed
MH is the librarian at Highpoint as she has completed a OU degree and as such is the most highly qualified inmate. The Norfolk lady will certainly have some dealings with her. Incidentally she won’t recognise her as she looks nothing like her arrest photos (she looks like a 60 year well-fed librarian)
There are very few female lifers, they’re not good at murder! However 30% of the female prison population are drug mules (nigeraian and jamaican) who do have long sentences.
C) Yes we do. Well for different categories of crime anyway. Prisons are Category A-D depending on who they house.
Highpoint is a Cat A nick. The reason that this lady is in there is it’s the closest jail to Norfolk (its in Suffolk). If she were serving a longer term she would be moved to a more appropriate category probably Cookham Wood (although you could replace MH with Rose West in there). Rose does get a hard time from the other cons though…
Her best bet would to go “mad” and get put on the hospital wing (cheerfully known as “fraggle rock”) and see out her time there.
Owl…(not typing all that!!)
In referance to your reply on C
Prisons are A,B,C,D but this does not relate directly to categories of crime, though there is a tendency for certain types of offenders to be located in particular categories of prison.
I could look up the definitions of the types of inmates but I’d have to dig out my jailcraft course notes.
Roughly,
A , prisoners are those whose risk to the public is so great that they may either threaten the national interest or be of great risk to the public.
In determining public interest things like ability to maintain themselves whilst at large are taken into account, and the ability to leave the country.
These often include serious organised criminals, terrorists, spies, top level drug dealers and extreme unprovoked violent individuals
B prisoners, these may be abe to stay at large for extended periods, but although dangerous, they do not directly threaten the national interest.
These may be individuals who are not yet convicted, but are remanded in custody due to the serious nature of their alleged offence, it will include most types of murder at the earlier stages of their jail term.It will include those inmates who are disruptive and likely to assault staff or start priosn disorder from mutniy to full scale riot.
T
Owl…[sub](not typing all that!!)[/sub]
In referance to your reply on C
Prisons are A,B,C,D but this does not relate directly to categories of crime, though there is a tendency for certain types of offenders to be located in particular categories of prison.
I could look up the definitions of the types of inmates but I’d have to dig out my jailcraft course notes.
Roughly,
A , prisoners are those whose risk to the public is so great that they may either threaten the national interest or be of great risk to the public.
In determining public interest things like ability to maintain themselves whilst at large are taken into account, and the ability to leave the country.
These often include serious organised criminals, terrorists, spies, top level drug dealers and extreme unprovoked violent individual
(there are also the Special Security Units[SSU’s] or AA jails which house the really dangerous ones, but these are located as a prison within, but virtually separate to, a Cat A jail, extreme measures are taken when moving such prisoners, even if it is just for a meal)
B, prisoners, these may be able to stay at large for extended periods, but although dangerous, they do not directly threaten the national interest.
These may be individuals who are not yet convicted, but are remanded in custody due to the serious nature of their alleged offence, it will include most types of murder at the earlier stages of their jail term. It will include those inmates who are disruptive and likely to assault staff or start prison disorder from mutiny to full scale riot.
C, inmates are generally all the rest, there are killers of all shades, sex-offenders of most types, drug dealers, organised criminals at the far end of their sentance, burglars, possibly the widest variety of all the jails.
D inmates, often traffic offences, first time offenders for relatively light offences, fine defaulters, fraudsters, lifers very near their release -so this would include killers who need to be reintegrated especially if they have been inside twenty years or more.Inmates who have a proven record of good behaviour having completed all the courses set out for them etc
These inmates generally do not have the means to stay at large for long and are not considered a risk to the public, though sometimes they may be a risk to particular individuals such as informers.
What I am trying to point out is that most jails of all categories do house most types of offenders at some stage in their sentence.
Your comment about MH being in Highpoint rather than Cookham Wood, based on the length of her sentence doesn’t hold up, she will probalby remain in jail until she dies.
IIRC MH was in Cookham Wood(Cat D) not all that long ago, it is unusual to move any prisoner back up to a higher security prison just for outside family reasons, simply because it costs around one third to one quarter to keep them in Cat D jails as against Cat A.
Prisoners are usually moved back up the security rating of jails either because they are disruptive, have made escape attempts, they may face further charges which may prompt an escape attempt, or if they are being held at a lower category of jail they may wish to be released from a town jail in their own city.
Town or local jails, as they are called, are mostly Cat B with one or two Cat A’s.
Most Cat C jails are where most prisoners are released from and they tend to be away from towns altogether, and sometimes a prisoner may be held in a cat C jail many many miles away from their home town.