# couple of Lord of the Rings questions **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 4, 2012, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675 "2012-09-04T20:02:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sigene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df788c/32.png) [@Sigene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigene)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/1 "2012-09-04T20:02:40Z")
Its been too many decades since I read the books, but a couple things have stuck with me during my youthful camping days with my friends. One: There was some particularly healthful light weight food, that they had available. My friends reasoned that Pop Tarts were the closest thing to that food; so our most popular camping food was Pop Tarts. What was that food in LOTR? and can you point me to a couple of short entries where this food is featured? two: I think Sam Gamgee was fond of bringing string on adventures. SOmething about him getting ready to go on the trip and insisting on bringing string: because we can always use a bit of string. I’ve googled looking for quotes that might suggest this but have come up blank. DId I make this point up? or did I miscontrue it from years of misremembering? If you can also point me to a passage where Sam praises the value of a ‘bit of string’ on journeys, I would appreciate it. Thanks ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/2 "2012-09-04T20:10:22Z")
The food was Lembas, Elven pop-tarts. ---
**Author:** ![redtail23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/3e96dc/32.png) [@redtail23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/redtail23)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/3 "2012-09-04T20:11:58Z")
[Lembas](http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Lembas). I think you may be misremembering this. There is a section where he berates himself for forgetting to bring along “a bit of rope”. \*“Rope!” he muttered. “No rope! And only last night you said to yourself: “Sam, what about a bit of rope? You’ll want it, if you haven’t got it: Well, I’ll want it. I can’t get it now.” \* ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/4 "2012-09-04T20:12:34Z")
The bread was called _lembas_ and was given to the Fellowship as they left Lothlorien. Ditto the rope (not “string”), which Sam used at the start of Book Four (that is, the second half of _The Two Towers_) to get him and Frodo down a steep cliff in the Emyn Muil, and shortly after to tie up Gollum when they captured him. Both items feature in the chapter “The Taming of Smeagol” to emphasise Gollum’s corruption; the touch of the rope burns him painfully, so that he is willing to swear oaths in order to have it removed, and the _lembas_ tastes like dust and ashes to him even though it is delicious to hobbits (and others; when Gimli first saw it he thought it was just a type of _cram_, the waybread of the Men of Dale near the Lonely Mountain where he lived, and after the first crumb he gleefully nommed the whole piece, which was enough to feed him for a hard day’s travelling). ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/5 "2012-09-04T20:14:02Z")
1. [Lembas](http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Lembas) 2. String? Don’t recall Sam having a string fetish, but the elves of Lorien did gift him a length of [elven rope](http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Elven_rope). [On preview]: Ninja’d by **redtail23** , same link even! ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/6 "2012-09-04T20:24:15Z")
Hmm, when Gollum was playing the riddles game with Bilbo, Bilbo’s inadvertant riddle was “What have I got in my pocket?” Gollum’s guess was “String… or nothing.” Could that be what you’re thinking of? ---
**Author:** ![Sigene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df788c/32.png) [@Sigene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigene)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/7 "2012-09-04T20:30:42Z")
Well maybe it was a different character, of maybe even a different story…but somehow I don’t think so… We always seemed to be wanting to bring a bit of string (maybe it _was_ rope?). It may have been only a single line or two in the whole books, but I feel somewhat confident there was something about preparing for the trip and taking along a bit of string because you can always find a use for it. I don’t suppose there’s an electronic version somewhere to search for 'bit of string" ---
**Author:** ![Sigene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df788c/32.png) [@Sigene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigene)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/8 "2012-09-04T20:34:52Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#): > > 1. String? Don’t recall Sam having a string fetish, but the elves of Lorien did gift him a length of [elven rope](http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Elven_rope). Now that I’ve read this link; I’m getting more confident this is what I’m remembering. “Never travel far without rope” really seems to be the theme we had on our camping trips…even if I seem to misconstrued it into a ‘bit of string’. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/9 "2012-09-04T20:35:11Z")
I’d liken lembas more to soda bread than anything like a poptart. Yeah, the lembas was light a flaky, but you can live off a good heavy irish soda bread for days on end while hiking. ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/10 "2012-09-04T21:09:49Z")
I think you’re all misremembering this. Sam DOES want string, and he gets some from the elves. Not for anything as prosaic as climbing down a cliff, though; he, Frodo and Gollum use the string to perform a traditional Elvish dancing challenge, where two of them hold the string while the third attempts to bend backwards and shimmy beneath it. Eventually Gollum loses, and as a result he has to guide them to Mount Doom. That dance is called the lembas. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/11 "2012-09-04T21:37:58Z")
> [@Sauron](#): > > That dance is called the lembas. The previous poster is Not To Be Trusted in such matters. ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/12 "2012-09-04T21:50:07Z")
> [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > The previous poster is Not To Be Trusted in such matters. You WOUND me, sir! And here I started to give you the WHOLE backstory, which is that the name of the competition was actually “Lembadas: The Forbidden Dance,” and that Tolkien, wonderful man that he was, mistranslated it in his first draft and nobody ever caught it. Now, though, I’m GLAD I didn’t share that little tidbit of information! You’ll NEVER know about it now! So there! ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/13 "2012-09-04T22:28:26Z")
_Lembas_ by Duran Duran ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/14 "2012-09-04T23:07:40Z")
> [@Sauron](#): > > I think you’re all misremembering this. > > Sam DOES want string, and he gets some from the elves. Not for anything as prosaic as climbing down a cliff, though; he, Frodo and Gollum use the string to perform a traditional Elvish dancing challenge, where two of them hold the string while the third attempts to bend backwards and shimmy beneath it. Eventually Gollum loses, and as a result he has to guide them to Mount Doom. > > That dance is called the lembas. I thought this was how Frito and Sam got Goddam to fall into the lava at Mount Doom. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/15 "2012-09-04T23:09:47Z")
I decided to dig out my copy of _The Letters Of J.R.R. Tolkien_ for a little Lembas research, as I clearly have too much time on my hands… [QUOTE="J.R.R. Tolkien, Letter 210] _Lembas_, ‘waybread’, is called a ‘food concentrate’.[…] No analysis in any laboratory would discover chemical properties of _lembas_ that made it superior to other cakes of wheat-meal. In the book _lembas_ has two functions. It is a ‘machine’ or device for making credible the long marches with little provision, in a world in which as I have said ‘miles are miles’. But that is relatively unimportant. It also has a much larger significance, of what one might hesitatingly call a ‘religious’ kind. This becomes later apparent, especially in the chapter ‘Mount Doom’. [/QUOTE] This letter was written in response to an early attempt at a film script for LOTR, circa 1958. The reference to it having no chemical difference from ordinary bread, but some kind of religious significance is interesting, and an _extremely_ rare example of Tolkien linking his Catholicism to his work. In the chapter he cites, lembas is described as becoming more sustaining the longer one relies solely on it. > [@](#): > > The _lembas_ had a virtue without which they would long ago have lain down to die . . . It fed the will, and it gave strenth to endure, and to master sinew and limb beyond the measure of mortal kind. (Quote taken from the notes to the _Letters_ rather than from LOTR as I’m slightly lazy). Tolkien explicitly refers to the connection between lembas and the Host in Letter 213, and to it’s increasing power when fasting, as perhaps the only direct evidence in the book of his Catholicism. So, probably not a pop tart! It’s basically wheat bread, but imbued by the Elves with some sort of spiritual or magical power, the nature of which is not clearly defined - like almost all of the Elves powers. This is probably more than anyone ever wanted to know about lembas, but now you know it… ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/16 "2012-09-04T23:20:10Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > So, probably not a pop tart! It’s basically wheat bread, but imbued by the Elves with some sort of spiritual or magical power, Ah so more like this [this](http://www.keebler.com/product-keebler-sandies-cashew-shortbread-cookies-15933.aspx?category=cookies) then a pop-tart. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/17 "2012-09-04T23:28:13Z")
> [@wolfman](#): > > Ah so more like this [this](http://www.keebler.com/product-keebler-sandies-cashew-shortbread-cookies-15933.aspx?category=cookies) then a pop-tart. I suspect that’s exactly how Tolkien pictured it 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Satchmo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/satchmo/32/4223_2.png) [@Satchmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Satchmo)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/18 "2012-09-04T23:46:38Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > I suspect that’s exactly how Tolkien pictured it 😛 Well, it is made by elves. 😛 As far as string, maybe the OP was thinking of this: S: Good. Well I have this large quantity of string, a hundred and twenty-two thousand _miles_ of it to be exact, which I inherited, and I thought if I advertised it… W: Of course! A national campaign. Useful stuff, string, no trouble there. S: Ah, but there’s a snag, you see. Due to bad planning, the hundred and twenty-two thousand miles is in three inch lengths. So it’s not very useful. W: Well, that’s our selling point! ‘SIMPSON’S INDIVIDUAL STRINGETTES!’ Full script here: [http://www.montypython.net/scripts/string.php](http://www.montypython.net/scripts/string.php) or maybe it’s just me. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2012, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/19 "2012-09-04T23:59:37Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > I suspect that’s exactly how Tolkien pictured it 😛 I didn’t have the guts to post that earlier. 🙂 I was thinking more of the Host. I thought some guys had gone to great length to point out Catholic references in his works. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2012, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675/20 "2012-09-05T00:43:25Z")
> [@](#): > > …and an extremely rare example of Tolkien linking his Catholicism to his work. Or at least, of him doing so explicitly. The connections are all over the place, if you know to recognize them: For instance, the Elven reverence of Elbereth bears a strong resemblance to Catholic attitudes towards Mary. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/couple-of-lord-of-the-rings-questions/633675.md?page=2)