# Crappier By the Dozen **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 26, 2003, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288 "2003-11-26T01:13:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![teleute12](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3d9bf3/32.png) [@teleute12](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teleute12)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/21 "2003-11-26T08:23:05Z")
I loved the “Cheaper by the Dozen” books. If I knew where my copies were, I’d probably still re-read them every few months. They filmed part of this movie in my town, and I could tell just from the description in the local paper that it would be nothing like the books were, but I didn’t know it was this bad. They were only filming a couple blocks away from my work, too - I should’ve gone over on a lunch break and bitched them out for it like I wanted to. ---
**Author:** ![Scarlett67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scarlett67/32/7387_2.png) [@Scarlett67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarlett67)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/22 "2003-11-26T12:29:11Z")
I once read a “behind-the-scenes” version of the Gilbreths’ story, written by Frank Jr. and Ernestine again, I think. The one thing I remember about it is that it told about what happened to the elusive Mary. Hmmm, might have to go track that one down. Our local small-town library had it many moons ago. ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/23 "2003-11-26T13:27:32Z")
I pretty much feel that way about anything with Steve Martin in it. I’ve never seen his appeal… ---
**Author:** ![Dragon\_Phoenix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@Dragon\_Phoenix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dragon_Phoenix)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/24 "2003-11-26T13:34:28Z")
All 12? Let’s see: Anne Ernestine Mary RIP Martha Frank Bill Lilian Fred Dan Jane Bah, I remember only 10. Loved the books, when I read them 30-35 years ago. ---
**Author:** ![Dragon\_Phoenix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@Dragon\_Phoenix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dragon_Phoenix)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/25 "2003-11-26T13:35:57Z")
Hmmm Jack and Bob? ---
**Author:** ![plnnr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@plnnr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/plnnr)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/26 "2003-11-26T13:44:35Z")
“The Shining, that veered significantly from their source material yet turned out to be fine films” The Shining…a “fine film?” Are we talking about the same movie? The one with Shelley Duval (aka The Piece of Lumber That Played The Mother in ‘The Shining?’)? Must be another version out there that I’m not aware of… ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/27 "2003-11-26T13:54:19Z")
If I recall, _Cheaper by the Dozen_ was authored by two of the twelve kids. (Haven’t read it since the early 1970’s.) Something that impressed me at the time was that they told the story in first person plural; the kids were referred to as “we”, but were each referred to individually by name, with no individual being the narrator. I’ve only seen this technique used a few times, once in a story by Ted Sturgeon. As you’ll recall, the parents’ shared career had a strong influence on their child-raising techniques; they pioneered time-motion studies in industry. I remember when one of the kids came down with tuberculosis and the dad decided to have all twelve operated on in the same day for the sake of efficiency. Why isn’t Steve Martin doing good movies? (Although sometimes a trailer can give a completely false impression.) ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/28 "2003-11-26T14:03:57Z")
See, that’s what’s so annoying—the source material _would_ make a terrific film! Nuanced, dark, edgy, funny, heart-warming . . . Twelve kids trying to deal with being a “number” in a house run by an efficiency expert and his wry, harried wife. “But, _noooooo!_” (OK, I think that was Belushi and not Martin . . .) They turn it into yet another cutsey-kid slapstick crapfest. That sound you hear is a dozen kids rolling in their graves. ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/29 "2003-11-26T14:09:34Z")
> [@](#): > > _originally posted by **Baldwin** :_ > > I remember when one of the kids came down with tuberculosis and the dad decided to have all twelve operated on in the same day for the sake of efficiency. Tuberculosis? Are you sure? Wasn’t it something more… operable, like tonsilitis? ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/30 "2003-11-26T14:40:15Z")
The maggots were eating in dead Ernest! ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/31 "2003-11-26T15:05:27Z")
I’m really suprised to find **Eve** starting a thread like this. I mean, oh wait a sec (Zebra checks his puter\*) Oh I’m back from the parallel univerise where **Eve** loves all things modern and pop culture and can’t stand anything older then two weeks ago. Carry on. \*parallel universe tracking device (nick name) ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/32 "2003-11-26T15:10:51Z")
_Hey!_ I’m over in another thread defending the _Hilton Sisters_, fer chrissakes! [Paris and Nikki, not Daisy and Violet] ---
**Author:** ![Chastain86](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Chastain86](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chastain86)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/33 "2003-11-26T15:18:53Z")
Let’s see… 1. A Steve Martin movie (he picks the absolute **worst** films these days…) 2. …loosely based on a classic book… 3. …mixed in with some concepts from “Daddy Day Care”… 4. …featuring a bumbling dad… 5. …getting into “wacky situations”… 6. …taking care of 12(!) precocious kids… 7. …one of which is Hilary Duff… 8. …and featuring Ashton Kutcher in a key role. Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you the “8 Simple Rules For Making a Successful Hollywood Movie That Really Sucks.” ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/34 "2003-11-26T15:21:48Z")
I also must add that to this day my standard shower routine is a modification of the father’s tub-efficiency model… ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/35 "2003-11-26T15:28:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eve \* > **_Hey!_ I’m over in another thread defending the _Hilton Sisters_, fer chrissakes!** Talk about out-of-touch: when I read that I thought about [these](http://phreeque.tripod.com/hilton_sisters.html) Hilton Sisters and wondering “who insulted them? They’ve been dead for more than 30 years and didn’t hurt anybody then…” ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/36 "2003-11-26T15:39:11Z")
_Cheaper By The Dozen_ was my introduction to the world of homosexuality and prostitution, although I didn’t realize it until years after the fact. There’s a bit where the family’s on vacation and they drive off without one of the sons and backtrack to a diner to look for him. Papa Gilbreth is wandering through peering into each booth when a woman says to him, “hey pops, looking for a naughty little girl?” Flustered, he responds “oh no, I’m looking for a naughty little boy.” To which the woman replies “Whoops dearie! pardon me!” Something like 15 years after the first time I read that it struck me, oh, she’s a hooker and she thinks Dad is gay and looking for trade. In my defense I was like 8 the first time I read it. As for the original, I have to confess I wasn’t as charmed by it as others have been. I liked it, but it didn’t resonate with me. Which doesn’t mean I’m pleased at the idea of a “remake” which seems to be so widely divergent from both the letter and the spirit of the source material. I imagine dear 95 year old Ernestine Gilbreth Carey is on her way out to the back garden to practice rolling over in her grave. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/37 "2003-11-26T15:53:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Otto \* > **_Cheaper By The Dozen_ was my introduction to the world of homosexuality and prostitution** I think CHEAPER BY THE DOZEN was everybody’s introduction to the world of homosexuality and prostitution.😕 ( **Cheaper by the Dozen** and prostitution being mentioned in the same sentence sounds like an ad for the new COSTCO/SAM’S CLUB BROTHEL. Clifton Webb, who played the father of a dozen in this movie and “The Amazing Mr. Pennypacker” (a bigamist with 17 kids) in another was, I understand, one of the earliest permanent fixtures on the Hollywood gay club scene even though he lived with his mother (or she with him) until he was 70. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/38 "2003-11-26T15:56:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sampiro \* > \*\*Clifton Webb, who played the father of a dozen in this movie and “The Amazing Mr. Pennypacker” (a bigamist with 17 kids) in another was, I understand, one of the earliest permanent fixtures on the Hollywood gay club scene even though he lived with his mother (or she with him) until he was 70. \*\* . . . And you _know_ his friends had a few comments about “The Amazing Mr. Pennypacker!” ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/39 "2003-11-26T17:42:57Z")
My favorite freaky Clifton Webb story talks about how he and Talullah Bankhead were competing for the affections of the same soldier. Supposedly, Talullah was in the lead so Clifton excused himself and came back naked with an armload of flowers and began dancing around the soldier pelting him with blossoms. Oddly, this _didn’t_ work and the soldier left with Talullah. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2003, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288/40 "2003-11-26T18:13:18Z")
I read the books years ago when I was in junior-high (I must be depraved because I figured out the prostitution/gay thing immediately). What is so annoying is that Steve Martin is slummin in yet another “wacky,” disposable piece of crap, yet he would shine if he played Frank Gilbreth in a faithful film version of the original book. 95-year-old Ernestine? I figured all the kids were dead by now. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crappier-by-the-dozen/215288.md?page=3)