# Crime Kills 8, Mourning risks more (kinda long) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 21, 2008, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573 "2008-02-21T15:53:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Paragod22510](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b5ac83/32.png) [@Paragod22510](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paragod22510)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2008, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/1 "2008-02-21T15:53:31Z")
This very well could hit the pit, but I’m disgusted with these 2 stories. [ILLEGAL RACE KILLS 8](http://wjz.com/local/fatal.accident.accokeek.2.655854.html) 8 people were killed standing and watching a crime take place. Street racing is a crime. Would you stand around and watch a drug deal take place? Would you stand there and watch a robbery happen, cheering? OOH OOH. Better yet, cheer on the rapist. WHOO HOO! Oh wait…that’s wrong? So then the families of the 8 tragically killed crime supporters stand in the median of the same frickin HIGHWAY. [Mourning](http://www.wusa9.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=68787) Ok. So maybe the drug deal, rape, and robbery aren’t on the same level of law breaking as ILLEGAL street racing. But let’s be realistic. A crime was being commited and this poor unsuspecting (suspended lisence) driver plows through 8 people standing there watching it happen. If the crime of street racing hadn’t taken place, the suspended driver wouldn’t’ve killed 8 “law abiding” citizens. BUT if the suspended driver would’ve obeyed the law, the 8 would still be alive today to support more crime? Who is culpable for this tragedy? IMHO, it’s the 2 idiots that were racing. The crowd standing there supporting the crime. Cheering on the 2 criminals and not reporting it makes them responsible. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2008, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/2 "2008-02-21T22:22:52Z")
I’m thinking the victims deserve a Darwin. I mean, sure, Indian Head Highway doesn’t get much traffic in the middle of the night. But what traffic it gets is going pretty fast - not as fast as the illegal racers, but typically 70-80 mph. If you’re standing in a cloud of exhaust smoke in the middle of the road in the middle of the night - and looking down the road towards the drag racers, away from any oncoming traffic - you are _so_ on your own, IMHO. And fuck you, you dead and injured people, for having saddled the driver with a whole bunch of undeserved feelings of shock and guilt. Maybe I should drive down there with a bunch of Darwin fish, and leave them at any roadside memorials that have been put up. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2008, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/3 "2008-02-21T23:44:28Z")
Wow, I expected that the victims would be kids too young to really appreciate that they’re witnessing a crime. Only **one** of the victims is younger than I am, and most of them were middle-aged! ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Cymbeline](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_cymbeline/32/9244_2.png) [@Green\_Cymbeline](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Cymbeline)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/4 "2008-02-22T00:47:00Z")
Related thread here: [Something not quite right about that Crown Vic that plowed into the spectators in MD](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=456111) [Good coverage in today’s Washington Post,](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/02/20/ST2008022003052.html) and a good [online discussion](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/discussion/2008/02/20/DI2008022002383.html) on the Post site. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/5 "2008-02-22T01:07:38Z")
Moving thread from IMHO to The BBQ Pit. ---
**Author:** ![Ponch8](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponch8/32/9883_2.png) [@Ponch8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponch8)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/6 "2008-02-22T02:52:25Z")
These wantwits should have learned in kindergarten not to play in traffic. I fail to see what the tragedy is. Today’s Washington Post had a story about some of the people involved. What a bunch of bollocks. ---
**Author:** ![neutron\_star](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/51bf81/32.png) [@neutron\_star](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neutron_star)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/7 "2008-02-22T05:08:18Z")
[QUOTE=Paragod22510] Ok. So maybe the drug deal, rape, and robbery aren’t on the same level of law breaking as ILLEGAL street racing. [/QUOTE] Did you just equate a victimless drug sale with rape, then suggest that it’s actually _more_ dangerous than an activity that killed eight people? What the fuck is wrong with you? ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/8 "2008-02-22T15:46:58Z")
[QUOTE=Paragod22510] So then the families of the 8 tragically killed crime supporters stand in the median of the same frickin HIGHWAY. [Mourning](http://www.wusa9.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=68787) [/QUOTE] Where does it say that they were standing in the median? ---
**Author:** ![Paragod22510](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b5ac83/32.png) [@Paragod22510](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paragod22510)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/9 "2008-02-22T15:52:38Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] Where does it say that they were standing in the median? [/QUOTE] Actually it doesn’t. They were actually standing on the shoulder of the highway. Not the median. I stand corrected. Are we really gonna niggle over where the vigil was standing? ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/10 "2008-02-22T16:16:17Z")
[QUOTE=nyctea scandiaca] [Good coverage in today’s Washington Post](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/02/20/ST2008022003052.html) > [@](#): > > Days after the accident, witnesses and relatives are struggling to understand how such a tragedy could have occurred among a group of people who knew how important it was to stay out of the way of speeding vehicles, even on a dark, isolated highway a few hours before dawn. [/quote] Umm, No aparently they did not. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/11 "2008-02-22T20:54:55Z")
[QUOTE=Paragod22510] Actually it doesn’t. They were actually standing on the shoulder of the highway. Not the median. I stand corrected. Are we really gonna niggle over where the vigil was standing? [/QUOTE] Are we niggling? Is standing in the median of a highway the same to you as standing on the shoulder? Are you concerned with the accuracy of your accusations? ---
**Author:** ![Paragod22510](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b5ac83/32.png) [@Paragod22510](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paragod22510)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/12 "2008-02-22T22:47:31Z")
The point I was attempting to make was they were standing in the same dangerous area their family members were just days before. I’m not concerned about the accuracy of my statement, I am concerned about it’s intent. My OP was asking who do you think is culpable for this tragedy. But to serve the niggling question, the definition of median strip is found [here](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/median%20strip) and the area in question is found [here](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/graphic/2008/02/21/GR2008022100623.html?sid=ST2008022003052). While it may not “technically” be a median strip, it DOES divide two opposing lanes of traffic. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/13 "2008-02-22T23:17:14Z")
The area in question, where the victims were hit, is not the median nor the shoulder but the actual highway itself; the victims were standing in the middle of the road. Big difference. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/14 "2008-02-22T23:22:24Z")
[QUOTE=Paragod22510] The point I was attempting to make was they were standing in the same dangerous area their family members were just days before. I’m not concerned about the accuracy of my statement, I am concerned about it’s intent. My OP was asking who do you think is culpable for this tragedy. But to serve the niggling question, the definition of median strip is found [here](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/median%20strip) and the area in question is found [here](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/graphic/2008/02/21/GR2008022100623.html?sid=ST2008022003052). While it may not “technically” be a median strip, it DOES divide two opposing lanes of traffic. [/QUOTE] So? There’s nothing in any of your links that suggest that the behavior of the mourners was in any way equivalent to the behavior of the crash victims. They weren’t standing in the middle of the road; in fact, as far as anything you cited shows, they could be fifty yards from the road. They weren’t standing in a cloud of exhaust and burning rubber. To imply that the mourners are as irresponsible in their actions as the idiots who stood in the middle of a road at midnight or later is just stupid. And nowhere does any cite suggest that the median has anything to do with anything. ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2008, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/15 "2008-02-22T23:31:26Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] Are we niggling? Is standing in the median of a highway the same to you as standing on the shoulder? Are you concerned with the accuracy of your accusations? [/QUOTE] You made this same type of argument with regard to the number of helicopters present at the Britney Spears hospital trip. Even if his statement was inaccurate as to median vs. highway vs. shoulder, I think his question, asked in the last paragraph of the OP, as to who was culpable for the original incident has nothing to do with where precisely the mourners were standing during their mourning. ---
**Author:** ![Paragod22510](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b5ac83/32.png) [@Paragod22510](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paragod22510)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/16 "2008-02-23T00:06:09Z")
[QUOTE=Terminus Est] The area in question, where the victims were hit, is not the median nor the shoulder but the actual highway itself; the victims were standing in the middle of the road. Big difference. [/QUOTE] You are correct. The vigil wasn’t standing in the middle of the road. The were on the side of it. I personally don’t consider standing on a shoulder, median, etc. of a highway where the average speed is over 65mph as a brilliant thing to do. But I pose the question yet again, Who do you think is culpable for the death of the 8 victims? ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/17 "2008-02-23T00:12:12Z")
[QUOTE=Paragod22510] But I pose the question yet again, Who do you think is culpable for the death of the 8 victims? [/QUOTE] Hmm. ‘Culpable.’ _“Considered responsible for something bad.”_ Any person who stands in the middle of such a road in the dead of night (irrespective of any street racing) is placing themselves in clear and obvious danger. If they get hit, they’re culpable. How is that so difficult to grasp? ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/18 "2008-02-23T03:36:51Z")
The picture in the linked article clearly shows the mourners standing in the median. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/19 "2008-02-23T12:47:22Z")
[QUOTE=Asimovian] You made this same type of argument with regard to the number of helicopters present at the Britney Spears hospital trip. Even if his statement was inaccurate as to median vs. highway vs. shoulder, I think his question, asked in the last paragraph of the OP, as to who was culpable for the original incident has nothing to do with where precisely the mourners were standing during their mourning. [/QUOTE] Have you ever seen a grown man naked? ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2008, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/crime-kills-8-mourning-risks-more-kinda-long/438573/20 "2008-02-23T15:26:48Z")
[QUOTE=Contrapuntal] Have you ever seen a grown man naked? [/QUOTE] Just this week at the gym, and stop calling me Shirley.