# Criminals who got what they deserved...or precious snowflakes tragically murdered? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 26, 2012, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209 "2012-11-26T22:45:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/321 "2012-11-30T16:57:34Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > They were burglars. They got shot. Case closed. This has been another exciting 10-second episode of _Clothahump, P.I._! ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/322 "2012-11-30T17:06:32Z")
> [@](#): > > Several minutes later, he heard more footsteps and saw Kifer coming down the stairs. He waited until he saw her hips, then fired. She also fell down the stairs, but then his rifle jammed and Kifer laughed. > > That angered Smith. “If you’re trying to shoot someone and they laugh at you, you go again,” he told police.He then pulled out the .22-caliber, nine-shot revolver that he was wearing, and fired “more shots than I needed to.” He dragged Kifer into the workshop, placed her next to Brady and noticed she was still gasping for air. > > “Smith stated at this point he placed the handgun under the woman’s chin and shot her … up into the cranium … a good clean finishing shot.” She laughed at his non-functioning rifle. Putting the bodies on the tarp and not calling the police and people are OK with this? This guy is so clearly a murderer. I have doubt that the kids even broke in to his house based on the fact that this guy is clearly a psychopath. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/323 "2012-11-30T17:20:08Z")
Yes, I am ok with people not acting in a rational or reasonable manner after a traumatic experience, in fact i think it is pretty delusional to expect otherwise. It is very easy to question someone’s actions when you weren’t the one put in a deadly circumstance. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/324 "2012-11-30T17:25:29Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Murder and I don’t believe I ever said otherwise. Remember, though, that at this point all we are talking about is emotional response to the events. I don’t think that whose feelings are right and whose are wrong is going to be an avenue of discussion that will produce much but negative emotional response to each other. Killing someone in cold blood is going to elicit a negative emotional response from me. I guess it’s the human in me. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/325 "2012-11-30T17:27:31Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Yes, I am ok with people not acting in a rational or reasonable manner after a traumatic experience, in fact i think it is pretty delusional to expect otherwise. It is very easy to question someone’s actions when you weren’t the one put in a deadly circumstance. Cold. Blooded. Murder. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/326 "2012-11-30T17:28:02Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Killing someone in cold blood is going to elicit a negative emotional response from me. I guess it’s the human in me. Yeah, that must be it. You’re just a better person than anybody who disagrees with you. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/327 "2012-11-30T17:30:58Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Yeah, that must be it. You’re just a better person than anybody who disagrees with you. I believe I am a better person for thinking that cold blooded murder is wrong. Do you think differently? ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/328 "2012-11-30T17:32:44Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I believe I am a better person for thinking that cold blooded murder is wrong. Do you think differently? Dio is that you? ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/329 "2012-11-30T17:36:31Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I believe I am a better person for thinking that cold blooded murder is wrong. Do you think differently? I completely agree that you believe yourself a better person than those who disagree with you. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/330 "2012-11-30T17:40:41Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Yes, I am ok with people not acting in a rational or reasonable manner after a traumatic experience, in fact i think it is pretty delusional to expect otherwise. It is very easy to question someone’s actions when you weren’t the one put in a deadly circumstance. Does that mean everyone who shoots their wives after finding them in bed with other men should get a free pass? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/331 "2012-11-30T17:41:00Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > I completely agree that you believe yourself a better person than those who disagree with you. I don’t know who the hell you are agreeing with, since that isn’t what I said. I would appreciate it if you didn’t put words in my mouth. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/332 "2012-11-30T17:41:21Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > I completely agree that you believe yourself a better person than those who disagree with you. It is wonderful that we live in such an understanding world that we cannot judge those who don’t have a problem with unjustified murder. I mean, killing people for no legal reason is one thing; but thinking ill of someone who is fine with unjustified murder? Why, we just can’t stand for that! ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/333 "2012-11-30T17:43:39Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > It is wonderful that we live in such an understanding world that we cannot judge those who don’t have a problem with unjustified murder. > > I mean, killing people for no legal reason is one thing; but thinking ill of someone who is fine with unjustified murder? Why, we just can’t stand for that! Sometimes it isn’t what is said-it is who says it. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/334 "2012-11-30T17:43:52Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Does that mean everyone who shoots their wives after finding them in bed with other men should get a free pass? No, only people defending themselves do. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/335 "2012-11-30T17:44:51Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > No, only people defending themselves do. When he made that “finishing shot”, was he defending himself? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/336 "2012-11-30T17:45:08Z")
> [@](#): > > No, only people defending themselves do. Right, and this guy does - right up until the point where he was no longer defending himself and was executing someone instead. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/337 "2012-11-30T17:47:36Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > When he made that “finishing shot”, was he defending himself? Yup. I don’t see how “live criminal in my house = danger” is such a strange concept to understand. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/338 "2012-11-30T17:49:45Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I don’t know who the hell you are agreeing with, since that isn’t what I said. I would appreciate it if you didn’t put words in my mouth. Do try to keep up. I was agreeing with you that you believe yourself to be better than others. You said so yourself, and how could I possibly know otherwise? Just taking you at your word, dude. _Were_ you lying? Incidentally, you were the one who, rather awkwardly, tried to pull a fast one by twisting the conversation through this gambit: _Not feeling sad at the murder of two criminals by a third criminal = not thinking coldblooded murder is wrong_ Thereby setting the stage to make everybody who doesn’t have the right feelings i.e the same as yours into a supporter of coldblooded murder. Clumsily done, I must say. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/339 "2012-11-30T17:50:29Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Yup. I don’t see how “live criminal in my house = danger” is such a strange concept to understand. You seem to be having trouble with “live criminal so helpless old guy can walk up and shoot her under the chin = no longer dangerous,” though. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2012, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209/340 "2012-11-30T17:52:27Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Yup. I don’t see how “live criminal in my house = danger” is such a strange concept to understand. “gutshot and dying unarmed criminal at my feet in no condition to do jack shit = danger?” I don’t _think_ so. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/criminals-who-got-what-they-deserved-or-precious-snowflakes-tragically-murdered/642209.md?page=18)