# Critique This \[re: Gospels\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 7, 2012, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795 "2012-08-07T22:34:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![chappy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@chappy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappy)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/81 "2012-08-09T18:36:11Z")
Skammer, metaphors are not “made up facts”, they are metaphors, period. Marley, You can make up a word for a name, yet other opinions of reality irritate you? Why so much emphasis on inconsequential seed-seat word games and disputed definitions of words that imply an obvious meaning? Surely no one here would use tactics like diversion, distraction or divide and conquer, would they? I thought this board could discuss anything in a civil manner, even when it’s disputed or dis-believed… Mangetout, yes I saw the moon. I also saw the sun as well as the stars change relative positions over a relatively short time. On another video I saw daylight in Mid-July Antarctica via NASA cameras as well as heard the testimony of several Inuit peoples in the far north explaining how the position of the setting and rising sun was migrating on a weekly basis. I also listened to Tom Brokaw broadcast information about the migration at increasingly greater speeds of the magnetic poles. None of these bits of information is proof of anything. It’s only when many of these bits along with complimentary historical data point to a common event, just like the scientific method would indicate… ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/82 "2012-08-09T18:42:55Z")
> [@chappy](#): > > Mangetout, yes I saw the moon. I also saw the sun as well as the stars change relative positions over a relatively short time. On another video I saw daylight in Mid-July Antarctica via NASA cameras as well as heard the testimony of several Inuit peoples in the far north explaining how the position of the setting and rising sun was migrating on a weekly basis. I also listened to Tom Brokaw broadcast information about the migration at increasingly greater speeds of the magnetic poles. None of these bits of information is proof of anything. It’s only when many of these bits along with complimentary historical data point to a common event, just like the scientific method would indicate… If the sun was rising and setting in weird places, it would be doing that for everyone on Earth, not just a few people here and there. The planet I live on is all joined together, you see. You can’t just tilt part of it. ---
**Author:** ![AndrewL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@AndrewL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AndrewL)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/83 "2012-08-09T18:43:16Z")
> [@chappy](#): > > Mangetout, yes I saw the moon. I also saw the sun as well as the stars change relative positions over a relatively short time. At what time specifically on the video does it happen? I watched the whole thing and didn’t see this. > [@](#): > > On another video I saw daylight in Mid-July Antarctica via NASA cameras Where exactly were the cameras? There are parts of Antarctica that do normally get sunlight in mid-July. Taking a look at [Day and Night World Map](http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/sunearth.html) I can see that there are parts of Antarctica that are sunlit at the moment I write this, and it’s the middle of summer. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/84 "2012-08-09T18:43:17Z")
If you like, I’ll go out tonight and take a long exposure star trail photo of the pole star not moving. Would that convince you? Because if Polaris doesn’t move in a long exposure shot, then the earth’s pole is still aligned exactly where it’s been (barring a motorized astronomy mount for the camera set to skew things, which I don’t possess). ---
**Author:** ![Freakenstein](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b782af/32.png) [@Freakenstein](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freakenstein)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/85 "2012-08-09T18:44:24Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > astronomers in Australia and New Zealand should have been seeing it for years now. No, no. There’s nobody, the people on the other side would fall down into the space. And Chappy, You are trying too hard. It’s obvious You are an MIB just trying to make conspiracy theorist look bad. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/86 "2012-08-09T18:44:47Z")
> [@chappy](#): > > I thought this board could discuss anything in a civil manner, even when it’s disputed or dis-believed… Again, word games: your theory is not “disputed,” it’s based on some very obvious mistakes. And it’s difficult to have a polite debate about nonsense, although even a discussion of nonsense is supposed to remain insult-free. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/87 "2012-08-09T18:48:08Z")
But maybe now would be a good time for you to describe which bits of that video you find odd-looking. Tell us what you’re seeing, and at what time points in the video, so we can take a proper look at whatever the hell it is you think you’re seeing. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/88 "2012-08-09T18:57:13Z")
> [@AndrewL](#): > > At what time specifically on the video does it happen? I watched the whole thing and didn’t see this. Did you view it through his Distort-O-Vision download? ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/89 "2012-08-09T19:03:37Z")
Hey, chappy, I’m still dying to hear your answers to the questions I posted over [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15358425&postcount=49) in your other thread. You seem to have missed it every time I’ve asked for a response. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/90 "2012-08-09T19:08:10Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > Hey, chappy, I’m still dying to hear your answers to the questions I posted over [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15358425&postcount=49) in your other thread. You seem to have missed it every time I’ve asked for a response. No need to badger him. You have made your point. He will avoid questions, restate bullshite, hint, accuse us of being small-minded, and generally not engage in debate while claiming to be persecuted. We’ve seen this show before. ---
**Author:** ![chappy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b3f665/32.png) [@chappy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappy)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/91 "2012-08-09T23:46:34Z")
I’m not trying to avoid questions, it’s just that my schedule only allows me a few minutes a day online. I’ll try and catch up Sat. or Sun. Meanwhile here’s an article about the position of the sun you may find interesting… [http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/49Degrees.HTM](http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/49Degrees.HTM) chappy ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/92 "2012-08-10T00:45:33Z")
> [@chappy](#): > > I’m not trying to avoid questions, it’s just that my schedule only allows me a few minutes a day online. I’ll try and catch up Sat. or Sun. Meanwhile here’s an article about the position of the sun you may find interesting… > > [http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/49Degrees.HTM](http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/49Degrees.HTM) Gee. An informed website that makes the exact same observation that several of us have already made that directly contradicts the nonsense to which you have pointed. How surprising! ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/93 "2012-08-10T00:47:39Z")
> [@chappy](#): > > I’m not trying to avoid questions, it’s just that my schedule only allows me a few minutes a day online. I’ll try and catch up Sat. or Sun. Meanwhile here’s an article about the position of the sun you may find interesting… > > [http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/49Degrees.HTM](http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/49Degrees.HTM) > > chappy Do you think this site supports your position? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/94 "2012-08-10T01:20:19Z")
Yes, it is interesting, your cite says that everything you’ve been saying is bullshit and nothing is going on. But we already knew that. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/95 "2012-08-10T01:48:13Z")
> [@chappy](#): > > I’m not trying to avoid questions, it’s just that my schedule only allows me a few minutes a day online. Care to guess how often that line’s been used here by someone who doesn’t understand science? A word of advice for you: if you don’t have that much time to be posting stuff online, you might consider ensuring that what you post is accurate and also supports your assertions. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/96 "2012-08-10T01:55:44Z")
Alternatively, spend the time trying to learn abut real science. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/97 "2012-08-10T02:21:43Z")
Concerning the scene in the video where the sun seems to rise for a moment: There is a bad interpretation of the data going on there. The video points out that the cameras are at a station at the very edge of Antarctica, almost as far as you can get from the pole without leaving the continent. Now take a look at this [map of Antarctica](http://www.geographicguide.com/antarctica-map.htm). Notice how some parts of the continent are a little bit outside the arctic circle? Well, the table about blackout days refers to points inside the arctic circle. The farther from the pole you get, the more inaccurate it gets. So. The fact that there was a minute or two of sunlight at the very edge of the continent in contradiction of the predicted blackout days isn’t so surprising. The station is a little outside the range of the chart for it to be perfectly accurate. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/98 "2012-08-10T04:19:55Z")
> [@chappy](#): > > I know several people in my home town who are spending all of their time looking for Jesus to come save the planet. This indicates a poor understanding of the Gospels. Jesus demonstrated generosity when he was here but he didn’t give everyone what they wanted. He gave them the tools (like a net to catch fish) that they needed to help themselves. Jesus may come help us, but we’re expected to do this ourselves. Bullshit. It’s pretty clear from the Gospels that Jesus expected the world to end soon. He wasn’t preaching a way for generations to live, he was preaching a way to get your soul prepared for judgment. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/99 "2012-08-10T06:04:29Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Concerning the scene in the video where the sun seems to rise for a moment: There is a bad interpretation of the data going on there. The video points out that the cameras are at a station at the very edge of Antarctica, almost as far as you can get from the pole without leaving the continent. Now take a look at this [map of Antarctica](http://www.geographicguide.com/antarctica-map.htm). Notice how some parts of the continent are a little bit outside the arctic circle? Well, the table about blackout days refers to points inside the arctic circle. The farther from the pole you get, the more inaccurate it gets. > > So. The fact that there was a minute or two of sunlight at the very edge of the continent in contradiction of the predicted blackout days isn’t so surprising. The station is a little outside the range of the chart for it to be perfectly accurate. The other thing that’s going on in that video is that on some days, the horizon is masked by a band of dense cloud, obscuring the rise of the sun above (what would be) the normal horizon - and thus, the sun, when it first becomes visible, is in a different horizontal co-ordinate than on a previous, day when the horizon was cloudless. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795/100 "2012-08-10T06:05:30Z")
> [@chappy](#): > > I’m not trying to avoid questions, it’s just that my schedule only allows me a few minutes a day online. I’ll try and catch up Sat. or Sun. Meanwhile here’s an article about the position of the sun you may find interesting… > > [http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/49Degrees.HTM](http://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/49Degrees.HTM) > > chappy Cite fail. You just need to work on your powers of observation, in general, I think. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/critique-this-re-gospels/630795.md?page=6)