# Cry me a fucking river, rich and/or famous people (re: privacy) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 8, 2013, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682 "2013-02-08T06:06:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/61 "2013-02-08T23:50:52Z")
> [@Shakes](#): > > I used to feel this way until I watched a documentary on celebs and depression. > > What you don’t realize is if these people decide to turn down a job ore take a couple of years to get their head together; that means lots of people don’t get to work as a result of that decision. People who actually need to work and can’t afford a two year vacation. And a lot of these people are people that the celeb personally knows and actually cares about. > > Think about it, would you be so quick to quit your job if it meant it would bring hardship to your best friend? > > The flip side to this, celebs never know who their real friends are. If you’re a celeb and you ask “So-n-so” should I take “Such-n-such” job? Well, of course they are going to say yes because to keep you working is to keep them working. If they are famous enough that they are being hounded by photographers, they are famous enough to have enough money not to have to work. If, by some odd circumstance, they haven’t made enough money doing whatever it was that made them famous, the fact that photographers are following them around means there’s money to be made in your celebrity status. And while I’m against classism, that doesn’t mean I think it’s ever wise to get into such an intense relationship with your employees. And you definitely should not be hiring people because they are your friends. Finally, I’m pretty sure it’s already illegal to stalk a celebrity and take a photo of them on private property. So what does this bill do? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/62 "2013-02-09T01:19:32Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Nope, sorry. “Celebrity” isn’t a special class of humans deserving of special protection under the law IMO. And trying to couch their arguments for special treatment as being something for the public’s safety just makes those particular celebs seem to be huge jackasses. I don’t think you get the point. It’s not that a class deserves special protection. The law should be the same for everyone, it’s just that only some people are going to be the subject of certain behaviour and need to take advantage of the protection of that law. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/63 "2013-02-09T01:22:56Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > If they are famous enough that they are being hounded by photographers, they are famous enough to have enough money not to have to work. I think you misunderstand my post. Of course the celeb has enough money to take time off. It’s the people that work for them that don’t > [@](#): > > And while I’m against classism, that doesn’t mean I think it’s ever wise to get into such an intense relationship with your employees. And you definitely should not be hiring people because they are your friends. Well, as much as you hate celebs, they’re still human. When I first started my job, I didn’t give a shit about anybody who worked there (Because I didn’t know them). Now that I’ve been there for a while I have developed relationships with some of these people. And I sure as hell don’t want to see them lose their job. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/64 "2013-02-09T02:20:02Z")
The bill is SB465, the [pdf copy](http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2013/Bills/SB465_.PDF) I found is seven pages long, apparently scanned from paper, it has six blank pages after page one. Do they have difficulty with portable document format in Hawai’i? ---
**Author:** ![shijinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@shijinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shijinn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/65 "2013-02-09T02:28:19Z")
isn’t stalking a crime? why doesn’t it apply to paparazzi? ---
**Author:** ![Krav\_Manga](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/krav_manga/32/3153_2.png) [@Krav\_Manga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Krav_Manga)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/66 "2013-02-09T02:34:25Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > Good retort, goat fucker. I’m not sure your mum would appreciate being referred to as a goat. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/67 "2013-02-09T02:41:24Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > I don’t think you get the point. It’s not that a class deserves special protection. The law should be the same for everyone, it’s just that only some people are going to be the subject of certain behaviour and need to take advantage of the protection of that law. So you’d be okay with my proposed law making it a special crime to steal a billion dollars from billionaires _or anyone else_? How about a law that makes it a special crime to cut a penis off a man _or anyone else_? This reminds me of Nevada’s Art Exemption Law (1997). I didn’t like that then and I don’t like this now. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/68 "2013-02-09T02:47:48Z")
Sorry, missed the edit window: **Princhester** , I agree that if the current laws are being violated, then yes, they should be applied and transgressors should be prosecuted. The fact that those laws are more likely to apply to celebs (or to women) doesn’t bother me. It’s the way that this proposed law was originally presented, as applying only to celebs, that got under my skin. And no, the new spin on the story doesn’t change my opinion of the proposal’s worth. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/69 "2013-02-09T02:56:34Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Nope, sorry. “Celebrity” isn’t a special class of humans deserving of special protection under the law IMO. And trying to couch their arguments for special treatment as being something for the public’s safety just makes those particular celebs seem to be huge jackasses. Yeah, I doubt Tyler and other celebs are crying “Won’t _someone_ think of the poor innocent public?” But I also found _ **shijinn** _’s question intriguing: > [@](#): > > isn’t stalking a crime? why doesn’t it apply to paparazzi? Why can’t a celebrity say “Hey, this guy’s been following me and my kids around, and harassing us. Oh, and my daughter learned a new word from him…” ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/70 "2013-02-09T03:00:51Z")
Wouldn’t it be nice if it passed? We’d all be spared photos of celebrity buttocks - or at least a link to such - while clicking on a link to a film review. Who would lose out on this, exactly? There’s also a consent issue. Saying you’re fine to have photos taken of you on the red carpet is manifestly not the same as saying it’s fine for them to follow you to the hospital. > [@shijinn](#): > > isn’t stalking a crime? why doesn’t it apply to paparazzi? It’d be hard to prosecute. Just which of these people in the line-up were in front of you with flashes blinding you? ---
**Author:** ![Furious\_Marmot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dfb087/32.png) [@Furious\_Marmot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Furious_Marmot)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/71 "2013-02-09T03:07:21Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > In this hullabaloo, one photographer knocked into a little girl (probably 5 or so) pretty hard, and another slammed into this old lady, making her drop her suit case. Another passenger said to the guy who bumped the old lady, “Sir, you need to be more car–” but he was cut off by the photographer who said, “Shut the fuck up. We’re trying to get pictures here!” Serious question. What happens to the photographers in this sort of situation? If me and 20 friends decided to take pictures of a bitchin’ luggage cart at LAX and in the process knocked over children and old people, blocked traffic, and damaged cars, we’d presumably have a long talk to the cops. Especially if we did it every day. So, are shit tons of disorderly conduct tickets being passed out? ---
**Author:** ![shijinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@shijinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shijinn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/72 "2013-02-09T03:09:32Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > … It’d be hard to prosecute. Just which of these people in the line-up were in front of you with flashes blinding you? wouldn’t the bill in the OP share the same problem? ---
**Author:** ![Furious\_Marmot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dfb087/32.png) [@Furious\_Marmot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Furious_Marmot)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/73 "2013-02-09T03:11:08Z")
> [@shijinn](#): > > Shut the fuck up. We’re trying to get pictures here! It’d be a shame if a shuttle bus backed over the lot of ya’. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/74 "2013-02-09T03:50:30Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > So you’d be okay with my proposed law making it a special crime to steal a billion dollars from billionaires _or anyone else_? > > How about a law that makes it a special crime to cut a penis off a man _or anyone else_? Sure. What’s the problem? You’re singling out a special time of _crime_ for extra legislation, rather than restricting the legislation to a special type of _victim_. Such legislation might be claimed to be _superfluous_ (e.g., you could argue that billion-thieving and forced emasculation are already prohibited by general laws against theft and assault, respectively), but I really don’t see how it can be called _unfair_. More analogously, consider a safety regulation saying “public building doorways have to be at least seven and a half feet high, to prevent head bumping for very tall people _or anyone else_”. Sure, that regulation is only going to benefit very tall people (disregarding rare situations like a short person walking on stilts), but that doesn’t mean it discriminates against others. If the **only** safety regulations put in place were those benefiting the very tall, then yes, that would be unfair. But there’s nothing unfair about simply acknowledging that some safety hazards affect some types of people more than others. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/75 "2013-02-09T03:54:03Z")
> [@shijinn](#): > > wouldn’t the bill in the OP share the same problem? I’m finding it hard to pin down exact what the bill says. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/76 "2013-02-09T04:02:45Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Nope, sorry. “Celebrity” isn’t a special class of humans deserving of special protection under the law IMO. And trying to couch their arguments for special treatment as being something for the public’s safety just makes those particular celebs seem to be huge jackasses. I think the point is that the paparazzi are going to rather absurd lengths to stay just a hair within the law, and yet get their photos or whatever. This may be technically legal, but I’m sure it’s annoying as hell to the celebrities themselves, and it’s just sketchy and wrong if you ask me. There’s another thing few have brought up- what about their families? Especially the ones where the spouse and children are not celebrities (like say… Dolly Parton’s husband). Do they lose the right to to have a private life just because a member of their family is famous? Think about it this way- if you were suddenly famous for something, would you want your spouse, children, parents, friends, relatives, etc… to be subjected to this bullshit just because you happen to be there? Of course not. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/77 "2013-02-09T04:05:29Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > You’re singling out a special time of crime for extra legislation Gah. “Special **type** of crime”. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/78 "2013-02-09T04:20:12Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Maybe if her driver hadn’t been grossly negligent, speeding thru the streets of Paris like a maniac, she’d be alive to have an opinion. > > Are you suggesting that the paparazzi somehow _made_ them drive that way? > > What other instances of “dangerous high-speed car chases” have involved attempting to elude paparazzi since that unfortunate incident 16 years ago? Maybe so, but the fucking scum then proceeded to take pictures of her dead body, IIRC. The EMTs had to push them out of the way. The paparazzi may not have killed her – but they ARE a bunch of sick fucks, and I don’t feel one bit sorry for them. And while celebrities themselves may have signed up for the spotlight, their families did not. It’s not just celebs themselves themselves being stalked, but their children as well. Say what you will about him and how weird he was, but I can’t say I blame Michael Jackson for wanting his kids to wear masks. Not to mention how many celebrities are much more likely to be victims of actual, stalkers – the fucked up kind. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/79 "2013-02-09T05:03:38Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Maybe so, but the fucking scum then proceeded to take pictures of her dead body, IIRC. The EMTs had to push them out of the way. The paparazzi may not have killed her – but they ARE a bunch of sick fucks, and I don’t feel one bit sorry for them. Sick fucks are people who buy mags after they print this shit. The type of paps you mention are the instruments of those who pay them. I don’t mean to suggest they are unblameworthy, but I always feel this sort of comment needs to be put in context. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682/80 "2013-02-09T06:14:17Z")
> [@digs](#): > > Yeah, I doubt Tyler and other celebs are crying “Won’t _someone_ think of the poor innocent public?” They are saying exactly that. I quoted the letter that was sent to the Hawaiian legislature in the OP. Perhaps you missed it. Here, I’ll quote it again: > [@](#): > > Providing a remedy to the often-egregious acts of the paparazzi is a very notable incentive to purchase property or vacation on the islands. Not only would this help the local economy, but **it would also help ensure the safety of the general public, which can be threatened by crowds of cameramen or dangerous high-speed car chases**. And I stand by the assertion that this bill is really about creating special privacy rights for celebs, and not for the general public: [ > [@Hawaii SB 465](#): > > The purpose of this Act is to encourage celebrities to visit and reside in our State by creating a civil cause of action for the constructive invasion of privacy. ]([http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2013/bills/SB465\_.htm](http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2013/bills/SB465_.htm)) > [@SciFiSam](#): > > I’m finding it hard to pin down exact what the bill says. The link above goes to the actual text of the bill, **Sam**. If you’d like to read [the testimony submitted about this bill, including multiple copies of the celebs’ form letter, it’s all online here](http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2013/Testimony/SB465_TESTIMONY_JDL_02-08-13.pdf). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cry-me-a-fucking-river-rich-and-or-famous-people-re-privacy/649682.md?page=5)