# Curious about some criticisms that I've heard a lot **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 24, 2017, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055 "2017-01-24T18:57:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2017, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/61 "2017-01-27T14:15:32Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Michael Bay’s [take](http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/summer_movies/2005/06/the_bad_boy_of_summer.html) on things: “I make movies for teenage boys. Oh, dear, what a crime.” Made me chuckle. I’ve never heard this before and I love it. I’ve always wanted to go back in time to college (when YouTube was still young) and create a YouTube channel called “Really Real Reviews” where I would review movies and video games based in reality, and not in snooty industry terms. Going to see a Michael Bay film? I’ll review it as a Michael Bay film and not as an Oscar contender. Same with cartoons/kids movies. Sometimes they’re just silly, sometimes they’re serious, sometimes they’re a combination, but I’ll tell you the real review of it. I could be making money on this shit by now…sigh… ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2017, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/62 "2017-01-27T14:34:23Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > I’ve always wanted to go back in time to college Except you didn’t want to when you were _in_ college 😛 > [@](#): > > (when YouTube was still young) and create a YouTube channel called “Really Real Reviews” where I would review movies and video games based in reality, and not in snooty industry terms. Going to see a Michael Bay film? I’ll review it as a Michael Bay film and not as an Oscar contender. Same with cartoons/kids movies. Sometimes they’re just silly, sometimes they’re serious, sometimes they’re a combination, but I’ll tell you the real review of it. > > I could be making money on this shit by now…sigh… Well, why not do it though? You may not make money, but you could get views have people that appreciate your channel. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2017, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/63 "2017-01-27T14:56:16Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Everything Michael Bay does rules. That is all. Even his bowel movements. Which are indistinguishable from his films. :):eek: > [@RickJay](#): > > This is a really important point, and can be illustrated though a simple thought experiment; how would the movie play out if the twist didn’t happen? Imagine if Bruce Willis just reconciled with his wife. > > The movie would still be pretty good. The climactic scene in the movie isn’t REALLY the twist. It’s the scene with Cole and his mother in the car. This is a very good point. I never thought of it that way. It would be Crowe regaining his humanity, becoming less of a figurative ghost in his own life (instead of a literal one). Likewise, The Crying Game is nearly the same movie if Dil is a girl. Boy kills man, boy falls for man’s girlfriend, boy is redeemed. [Friend of the Deceased](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0119952/) is a similar movie (with no twist). ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2017, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/64 "2017-01-27T15:20:06Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > I’ve always wanted to go back in time to college (when YouTube was still young) and create a YouTube channel called “Really Real Reviews” where I would review movies and video games based in reality, and not in snooty industry terms. Going to see a Michael Bay film? I’ll review it as a Michael Bay film and not as an Oscar contender. Same with cartoons/kids movies. Sometimes they’re just silly, sometimes they’re serious, sometimes they’re a combination, but I’ll tell you the real review of it. First: Industry terms are not snooty. Industry terms are things like “net” and “gross” and “points” and other commercial concepts related to, yes, the _industry_ of _making money_ from film. That is utterly orthogonal to the _art_ and _craft_ of filmmaking, which is where the snooty film school terms come from. Second: Siskel and Ebert did precisely that. Many, many people are doing that on YouTube as we speak, and were doing it in text-only form on review sites before Web video was really feasible. Approaching films on their own terms is the mark of a competent reviewer. Not necessarily good, but _competent_. The only people who approach Michael Bay films as _objets d’art_ are either doing it for a laugh or are writing for an audience which does not include any of us, given that none of us are film school professors. Third: > [@](#): > > I could be making money on this shit by now…sigh… You’d have a better shot at winning the lottery. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2017, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/65 "2017-01-27T16:06:47Z")
> [@Aeschines](#): > > Except you didn’t want to when you were _in_ college 😛 > > Well, why not do it though? You may not make money, but you could get views have people that appreciate your channel. I didn’t have the idea for it until well after. And I don’t even have a YouTube channel, much less followers, so doing it now would be starting a large endeavor from scratch. I don’t care THAT much. > [@Derleth](#): > > First: Industry terms are not snooty. Industry terms are things like “net” and “gross” and “points” and other commercial concepts related to, yes, the _industry_ of _making money_ from film. That is utterly orthogonal to the _art_ and _craft_ of filmmaking, which is where the snooty film school terms come from. > > Second: Siskel and Ebert did precisely that. Many, many people are doing that on YouTube as we speak, and were doing it in text-only form on review sites before Web video was really feasible. Approaching films on their own terms is the mark of a competent reviewer. Not necessarily good, but _competent_. The only people who approach Michael Bay films as _objets d’art_ are either doing it for a laugh or are writing for an audience which does not include any of us, given that none of us are film school professors. > > Third:You’d have a better shot at winning the lottery. Again, given the parameters are doing it before hundreds of other people are doing it on Youtube gives me much greater chances of making money on it than winning the lottery. Also notice I said “make money” not “live off of”. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2017, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/66 "2017-01-27T16:43:32Z")
I do think that M. Night Shyamalan’s work is pretty terrible, but someone else once pointed out that he gets one unfair criticism, which is that ever since the Sixth Sense and some other movies, people expect a plot twist in a Shyamalan movie, and so when a Shyamalan movie doesn’t have a plot twist, people latch on to whatever could vaguely pass as a plot twist in his movie, and exclaim, “That was such a WEAK plot twist!” ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2017, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/67 "2017-01-27T16:50:45Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > I do think that M. Night Shyamalan’s work is pretty terrible, but someone else once pointed out that he gets one unfair criticism, which is that ever since the Sixth Sense and some other movies, people expect a plot twist in a Shyamalan movie, and so when a Shyamalan movie doesn’t have a plot twist, people latch on to whatever could vaguely pass as a plot twist in his movie, and exclaim, “That was such a WEAK plot twist!” A lot of people mention the “twist” of _The Happening_ being that “the plants did it,” but it was never a twist. The movie literally opens with shots of the wind blowing through plants, the whole thing gets revealed less than halfway through the movie, and the originally title was “The Green Effect.” ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2017, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/68 "2017-01-27T16:52:13Z")
[The Twist](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LGu1sOvxYs), M. Night Shyamalan on _Robot Chicken_. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2017, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055/69 "2017-01-28T00:07:19Z")
> [@Balance](#): > > I think Shyamalan is, on a technical basis, a decent director who once had a really good idea and executed on it very well. Unfortunately, it turned out that he didn’t quite get why it was a good idea, and his attempts to recapture that magic have made a mess of many of his subsequent projects. (Others were just doomed because he didn’t properly understand his subject matter.) Maybe he would have done better to distance himself more from _The Sixth Sense_ stylistically–or maybe it wouldn’t have helped, because people wouldn’t have let him, as **WOOKINPANUB** suggests. I’d rate him way higher than a decent director. He’s a great director. His ability to set tone and mood is masterful. It’s in the writing where his misfires fail, often spectacularly. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-about-some-criticisms-that-ive-heard-a-lot/778055.md?page=3)