# Curious: Who do Dopers think will win the Democrat nomination? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 18, 2003, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438 "2003-09-18T19:01:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2003, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/121 "2003-10-29T22:49:52Z")
“to exciting” = “too excited” typed very sloppily ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 7:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/122 "2003-10-30T07:58:23Z")
I think it will be Deam. I think that moderation has been the Democrats biggest mistake. They’ve been trying to take on the Republicans on the Republican’s own turf. Theres nothing a moderate Democrat can offer than a moderate Republican can’t offer better. There s just no reason to vote for a moderate Democrat. The Democrats just don’t seem to stand for anything, except maybe beating the Republicans. But when they play that game, it’s always going to be the other sides’ ball. With Dean, we finally see someone who has something different to say. He proposes changes- Edwards Clark and Kerry just seem to offer the usual assortment of platitudes. And Dean isn’t afraid to say what he sees as wrong with the Democratic party. This will play well to people who- for whatever reason- see the Democratic party as weak. In short, Dean’s got people excited about an unexciting party. Dean is breaking the image (created by the likes of Gray Davis and Al Gore) that the Democrats are a party of the weak and dull political insiders. The idea that Dean is an extremist makes me laugh though. I’m a Kucinich girl myself, but I can’t believe I live in a country Kucinich’s rather sensible views are considered out in the statosphere and Dean’s fairly centerist views are considered part of the extreme left. When exactly did the center get shifted? ---
**Author:** ![IzzyR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/2acd7d/32.png) [@IzzyR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IzzyR)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/123 "2003-10-30T15:31:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by spoke- \* > I’m not sure how that necessarily refutes what I’ve said, **Izzy**. Incomes may be up across the board, but that doesn’t tell us how many people are _under_-employed. Say I’m an engineer now flipping burgers at McDonalds. Pardon me for not getting to exciting about the fact that burger-flippers are making more than ever. I believe you’ve misunderstood the data. The numbers don’t measure by job description (e.g. incomes of burger flippers) but by income of wage category (e.g. income of the top 20% of earners etc.) If a lot of people were making less money because they went from “low-paid” executives to “high-paid” burger flippers, for example, this would be reflected as a decrease in salary in the data. > [@](#): > > If you want to debate the implications of your cites, may I suggest you start a separate thread rather than hijack this one? OK, sorry for the hijack. But I will however take a parting shot: [Political journalist foresees Bush win](http://www.dailynorthwestern.com/vnews/display.v/ART/2003/10/30/3fa0bdef49b37) > [@](#): > > “It looks like we are coming out of the recession,” Stephanopoulos said. “Wages are starting to go up. Productivity is starting to go up. Generally if you look at polls across the country people respect President Bush even when people don’t agree with his policies. He has an amazingly strong hold on the Republican party. He’s not going to have a primary opponent. I think when you add all that up it puts President Bush in a very strong position going into the next election.” See also: [Economy Grew at 7.2% Rate in 3rd Quarter, Fastest Since 1984](http://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/30/business/30WIRE-ECON.html?hp) 😃 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/124 "2003-10-30T21:36:40Z")
Posted by **even sven:** > [@](#): > > The idea that Dean is an extremist makes me laugh though. I’m a Kucinich girl myself, but I can’t believe I live in a country Kucinich’s rather sensible views are considered out in the statosphere and Dean’s fairly centerist views are considered part of the extreme left. When exactly did the center get shifted? Hear, hear! As I mentioned above, I’m working for Kucinich – not because I expect him to get the nomination, but because I hope if he stays in the race through March with a creditable showing, he’ll get the running-mate spot. A Dean-Kucinich ticket would sew up the party’s left flank and forestall any Green challenge. The Greens have already announced they won’t run their own candidate if Kucinich gets the nomination – I’m hoping they’ll take the same position if he’s the running mate. And it really does make a difference! Kucinich as v.p. for at least four years would go some way towards making progressive ideas more acceptable in this country. But it’s a tough call. I think it’s more likely Dean will name Clark or Edwards or some other Southerner as his running mate, for obvious strategic reasons. As for the economy and how it helps Bush – who’s going to win the **election** is irrelevant to this thread. But remember, in politics a year is forever – Bush Sr. looked unbeatable in November '91 – and who can say what the economy’s going to be like a year from now? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/125 "2003-11-03T03:21:19Z")
More news from [Politics1.com](http://Politics1.com) ([http://www.politics1.com](http://www.politics1.com)): > [@](#): > > CLARK UP, EDWARDS DOWN IN S.C. A new independent tracking poll of likely South Carolina primary voters shows that John Edwards has lost his lead in the state. According to the American Research Group poll, Wesley Clark now leads the field there with 17%. Edwards is second with 10%, followed by Joe Lieberman at 8%, Dick Gephardt and Howard Dean tied with 7% apiece, Al Sharpton and Carol Braun each polled at 5%, John Kerry was next with 4%, and Dennis Kucinich was last with 1%. More than a third of the voters – 36% – said they were still undecided. Since the last ARG tracking poll last month, Clark has moved up 7% – while Edwards has dropped by nearly that same amount. Under their current strategies, Edwards, Clark and Lieberman each must score an early win in either South Carolina, Oklahoma or Arizona – all viewed as states populated by more “centrist” Democrats – or they will be forced from the race. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/126 "2003-11-03T03:35:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BrainGlutton \* > \*\*Posted by **even sven:** > > Hear, hear! As I mentioned above, I’m working for Kucinich – not because I expect him to get the nomination, but because I hope if he stays in the race through March with a creditable showing, he’ll get the running-mate spot. A Dean-Kucinich ticket would sew up the party’s left flank and forestall any Green challenge. The Greens have already announced they won’t run their own candidate if Kucinich gets the nomination – I’m hoping they’ll take the same position if he’s the running mate. And it really does make a difference! Kucinich as v.p. for at least four years would go some way towards making progressive ideas more acceptable in this country. But it’s a tough call. I think it’s more likely Dean will name Clark or Edwards or some other Southerner as his running mate, for obvious strategic reasons. \*\* A ‘anyone-and-Kucinich’ ticket has about as much chance of winning the Dem primaries as I do. Heck, I probably have a better chance than Kucinich. He may be a fellow Croat, but he is batshit insane. Not a quality to endear himself to the American electorate. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/127 "2003-11-03T04:27:27Z")
[nitpick] Posted by **Brutus:** > [@](#): > > A ‘anyone-and-Kucinich’ ticket has about as much chance of winning the Dem primaries as I do. There are no running mates in the primaries, **Brutus.** [/nitpick] ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2003, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/128 "2003-11-03T04:34:17Z")
I read your post as a ‘what-if’ Kucinich was a running mate in the primaries. I read wrong, it seems. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2003, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/129 "2003-11-06T17:13:50Z")
More news from [Politics1.com](http://Politics1.com) ([http://www.politics1.com](http://www.politics1.com)): > [@](#): > > DEAN TO LAND KEY UNION ENDORSEMENT TODAY. The powerful Service Employees International Union (SEIU) – the largest union in the AFL-CIO – will announce Thursday that they are endorsing Howard Dean for President. The move is a major blow to Dick Gephardt’s campaign, which was hoping to quickly lock-up the AFL-CIO endorsement. Nearly twenty unions have endorsed Gephardt to date – including the Steelworkers, the Teamsters, and the Machinists. Still, the SEIU endorsement of Dean is a sign that the former Vermont Governor’s campaign continues to gain powerful momentum in these final two months before the primary and caucus season starts. Gephardt, John Edwards and John Kerry came together this week in a united – but failed – effort to combine their support in the union to deny the SEIU nod for Dean. In related news, Dean announced Wednesday that he will let his supporters decided via online ballot whether or not he should accept federal matching funds (with the attached spending caps) or reject them (and have no spending limit). Dean continues to outraise all of his Democratic opponents by a massive margin. The decision, however, would also affect matching funds and spending for the general election. He wants hundreds of thousands of his supporters to vote by this Friday night. “Ballots” can be obtained at Dean’s [BlogForAmerica.com](http://BlogForAmerica.com) site [[[http://www.blogforamerica.com/](http://www.blogforamerica.com/)]. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/130 "2003-11-25T01:13:12Z")
More news from [Politics1.com](http://Politics1.com) ([http://www.politics1.com](http://www.politics1.com)): > [@](#): > > KERRY PROBLEMS GROWING. Most observers have already relegated Senator John Kerry (D-MA) back to the ranks of the “also-rans” in the P2004 contest. The latest news from his homestate, however, must be truly demoralizing for his campaign. According to a new Boston Globe/WBZ-TV poll out Sunday, the man who was once viewed as the frontrunner in the Democratic Presidential race now trails Howard Dean even in Massachusetts. The numbers: Dean-27%, Kerry-24%, Wesley Clark-6%, and all others trailing further behind. A Boston Herald poll released Monday also shows Dean defeating Kerry in Massachusetts by nine points (33% to 24%). These numbers confirm a University of Massachusetts poll last week that also showed Dean leading Kerry by six points in the state. Add to that the latest NH poll numbers (American Research Group): Dean-38%, Kerry-17%, Clark-7%, Joe Lieberman-5%, and all others with 4% or less. Those numbers reflect a 7% drop for Kerry in just the past two weeks since the last ARG tracking poll. In related news, Dean picked up the endorsements this weekend of two more “super-delegates”: Congressman Joe Crowley (D-NY) and Congresswoman Nydia Velazquez (D-NY). And, according to a new WHO-TV poll in Iowa, Dean has recaptured the lead there from rival Dick Gephardt. The new numbers: Dean-32%, Gephardt-22%, Kerry-19%, John Edwards-11%, and all others at 3% or less. Looks like we can already call it – Dean all the way. Anyone care to speculate on who drops out of the race next? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/131 "2003-11-25T02:05:16Z")
Probably Edwards. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/132 "2003-11-25T02:37:36Z")
My prediction of the Democratic ticket in the 2004 General election? Howard Dean, Prez / Sen. Evan Bayh of Indiana, Veep ---
**Author:** ![aahala](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a88e4f/32.png) [@aahala](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aahala)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/133 "2003-11-25T04:58:26Z")
I think if Dean gets the nomination, he should choose Bill Richardson as his running mate. ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/134 "2003-11-25T17:59:08Z")
Edwards made the most sense last night. Possible dark horse? I still like Kerry and Lieberman, but Lord knows who’ll still be on the ballot when I get to it ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/135 "2003-11-25T18:03:32Z")
…meaning that my state is part of Super Tuesday (March 2) but guys may have dropped out after Iowa and New Hampshire. Used to be June or so, so we seldom had a choice. Four states have cancelled their primaries outright. I wonder what it’ll mean. ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438/136 "2003-11-25T18:18:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by even sven \* > \*\*The idea that Dean is an extremist makes me laugh though. I’m a Kucinich girl myself, but I can’t believe I live in a country Kucinich’s rather sensible views are considered out in the statosphere and Dean’s fairly centerist views are considered part of the extreme left. \*\* They may or may not be wise, prudent and good, but they are not (in this country) centrist. If 90% of the population says you’re too liberal, you are, by very definition. I’m an extremist on several issues (in various directions) and I think my libertarian ideas eminently sensible and fair … but they are not mainstream, and I don’t kid myself in thinking my party will win an election. I see things about Dean I like. In some times and places, I could vote for him. But saying that “he’s centrist” won’t change the fact that to most of 'Merkins, he isn’t. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/curious-who-do-dopers-think-will-win-the-democrat-nomination/202438.md?page=6)