# Cyclists who deliberately ride on dangerous roads **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 11, 2009, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436 "2009-02-11T22:14:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Roland\_Orzabal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c2a13f/32.png) [@Roland\_Orzabal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roland_Orzabal)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/21 "2009-02-12T06:40:28Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > Two tons of speeding steel can easily kill a car driver too. But why is it that we hardly ever hear complaints about car drivers on narrow roads? Or maybe you’re an exception, and tell car drivers they don’t belong on certain roads because they are not safe? Come on now. Do I really, truly need to argue that biking down a curvy, shoulderless mountain road is significantly more dangerous than driving down it? Okay, I’m game; I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. Number one, drivers drive more safely around other drivers than they do around cyclists. They’re more easily noticeable, and the protocols for dealing with them are more well-ingrained. Then, of course, there are the dickbags I’ve known who ACTUALLY feel that bicyclists have no business on the road – and there are plenty of real ones to bitch at; why people feel the need to throw this label at me I will never know – who deliberately drive \*more dangerously \*around cyclists “to scare 'em off”. Feel free to disagree, but if I took a poll of a thousand cyclists as to which sort of vehicle – two-wheeled or four – drivers afford more respect, I know where I’d put my money. Number two, the number of car-on-car (or truck, or SUV, etc.) accidents I’ve personally witnessed or heard about from firsthand sources that have resulted in no injury to anyone involved is well into the dozens. The number of car-on-bike accidents I’ve heard of from ANY source that ended the same way is zero. Think for a moment about why that might be, and get back to me. I have no problem with cyclists. I used to be one myself in my teenage years, though that was in upstate New York, where the traffic was lighter and the roads better equipped to handle it. I really, honestly, truly, absolutely, no bullshit WANT cyclists and drivers to be able to share the road respectfully. If I want cyclists off of certain roads, it’s not because I think they shouldn’t have the right to be there, or because they annoy me, or because my life would be in any way improved if they left. It’s because, in my opinion, given what I’ve seen of drivers around here and the respect they afford cyclists, the speed limit, lane divisions, and the rules of traffic in general…and what I know firsthand about what happens when a car collides with a bicycle…THEY ARE LIKELY TO DIE, and I would honestly prefer that that did not happen. Is that really so terribly hard to believe? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/22 "2009-02-12T06:54:52Z")
> [@Roland Orbazal](#): > > […]an endless stream of people telling me they have a right to the road, and that it’s MY responsibility to drive safely around them. And you know what? They’re absolutely right. > > The point that never seems to get across is that being right doesn’t count for a whole hell of a lot when two tons of speeding steel comes into contact with 150 pounds of flesh, bone and a teensy piece of aluminum…because while I may drive safely (and I do), not everyone makes the same considerations. If you don’t believe that, just check the numerous cyclist rants about crazy-ass drivers on this very board. Do I really have to argue that a non-insignificant number of drivers have as much concern for the safety of cyclists as they do for the average windshield-bound locust swarm? Not at all. But in that case, why are people like the OP pitting the _cyclists_ rather than the _drivers_? Seems like classic “blame the victim” reaction. > [@Roland Orbazal](#): > > Then, of course, there are the dickbags I’ve known who ACTUALLY feel that bicyclists have no business on the road – and there are plenty of real ones to bitch at; why people feel the need to throw this label at me I will never know – who deliberately drive more dangerously around cyclists “to scare 'em off”. Again, why should we use the existence of these murderous scofflaws as an excuse to complain about the (legal) behavior of _cyclists_? Violence against cyclists isn’t some unconquerable force of nature, any more than lynching black people used to be (if I may be excused for comparing a relatively trivial, though still scary and occasionally deadly, form of violence with something as vicious as lynchings). Some people bash bikers for the same reason some people used to lynch blacks: because they enjoyed it and could get away with it. If society condemns and punishes them strongly enough for it, and supports the rights of their law-abiding victims adamantly enough, they will change their behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Roland\_Orzabal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c2a13f/32.png) [@Roland\_Orzabal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roland_Orzabal)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/23 "2009-02-12T07:09:15Z")
Of course I support the right of the cyclists, and of course I take umbrage at the actions of the drivers who ignore them or willfully act malevolently toward them. (Incidentally, your tone hints that you think I’m exaggerating about this behavior. I never suggested that I know anyone who deliberately tries to kill cyclists. I have, however, heard more than one driver say the words “watch me freak this guy out”, or something to that effect, before pulling a boneheaded maneuver next to a cyclist.) Of course poor drivers are 100% at fault for their own behavior, and of course it’s entirely avoidable. Until they get around to fixing it, though, none of this means that I’m not going to say anything to the cyclists in the meantime. Let me put it this way: I could walk around the bad part of town waving a big ol’ stack of fresh hundreds, and I would have every right to be there and do that. If you saw that I routinely did this, would you voice your support of my legal rights, or would you call me a dumbass and tell me to knock it the fuck off? And if you did the latter, would it mean that you’re in favor of muggers? Same idea, less obvious risk (and I don’t think cyclists are idiots, just stubborn ;)). If there were a way to correct the behavior of all the drivers in the world, I’d absolutely be in favor of that. In the meantime, my advice is directed to the potential victims, in hopes of decreasing the actual harm done. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/24 "2009-02-12T07:20:41Z")
> [@Roland Orbazal](#): > > Incidentally, your tone hints that you think I’m exaggerating about this behavior. I never suggested that I know anyone who deliberately tries to kill cyclists. I have, however, heard more than one driver say the words “watch me freak this guy out”, or something to that effect, before pulling a boneheaded maneuver next to a cyclist. Sorry, I certainly didn’t mean to suggest that I thought you were exaggerating. I used terms like “murderous scofflaws” and “violence against cyclists” in all seriousness, and if anything, I expect your description understates the amount of anti-cyclist violence out there. > [@Roland Orbazal](#): > > Let me put it this way: I could walk around the bad part of town waving a big ol’ stack of fresh hundreds, and I would have every right to be there and do that. If you saw that I routinely did this, would you voice your support of my legal rights, or would you call me a dumbass and tell me to knock it the fuck off? “The bad part of town” is where I expect the rules of decent, law-abiding society not to operate reliably, because there are too many criminals and not enough protection. I’m not yet ready to give up on roads in general as being the cyclist’s equivalent of “the bad part of town”, where there’s simply no point in hoping to enjoy one’s legal rights in safety without being attacked by a criminal. ---
**Author:** ![Roland\_Orzabal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c2a13f/32.png) [@Roland\_Orzabal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roland_Orzabal)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/25 "2009-02-12T07:34:08Z")
Fair enough. There’s probably still a good fight to be fought there, I just don’t want anyone getting hurt while it’s still being fought. The anger in my posts is not toward cyclists in general, but toward the many who’ve presumed that my stake in the matter is pure self-interest. I know those types of assholes, I ain’t one of 'em, and I resent being accused of that by the very people my actual motives are intended to help. So, thanks for being reasonable about it, even if you did go and ruin a perfectly good head of steam that’s spent ten years or so in the brewin’. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Roland\_Orzabal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c2a13f/32.png) [@Roland\_Orzabal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roland_Orzabal)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/26 "2009-02-12T07:35:47Z")
… ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/27 "2009-02-12T13:31:11Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > Does the road come _from_ somewhere, maybe? > > Any chance you can post a Google Maps link to the location? I’m kind of curious what it looks like. As am I. Not to be too hostile here, but I’ve had plenty of occasions where someone who does not bike insists that that route ‘over there’ was much better for me and my bike (mostly because it wasn’t where they wanted to drive their car). More often than not…excuse me, almost always the ‘better route’ isn’t.\* - To give this some perspective here is what has been ‘suggested’ to me and others: 1. A river MUP full of pedestrians trying to enjoy a nice river walk 2. A poorly designed ‘bike path’ with a pair of tunnels that would decapitate a cyclist. 3. A limited access interstate. 4. A path that was 7 miles longer than the route I used. 5. A mud path ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/28 "2009-02-12T14:02:02Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Not at all. But in that case, why are people like the OP pitting the _cyclists_ rather than the _drivers_? Seems like classic “blame the victim” reaction. Because the cyclist is making the choice of a route where 99+% of the traffic is cars going 45mph on a twisty, narrow road. Because the cyclist has an alternate choice where it is far safer, a choice with a designated bike lane. Not to mention, but this cyclist isn’t a victim, yet. He’s making choices that are more likely to turn him into a victim, I’m not sure what to call that, but it’s not blaming the victim. > [@](#): > > By the way, I note that if the “twisty” road in question is 3 miles long and has a 45 mph speed limit, the shortest time it could take you to (legally) drive from one end of it to the other is 4 minutes. If you were driving 30 mph instead, covering that 3 miles would take you 6 minutes. Is this saving of 2 minutes—120 seconds—really such a big deal to you? > > Consider also that if the cyclist is going 15mph, going “a mile out of the way” to cover a 3-mile distance means that the cyclist’s trip takes 16 minutes instead of 12. If it’s reasonable to expect them to lose 4 minutes in order to ride on a safer road, why isn’t it reasonable to expect you to lose 2 minutes in order to comply with the law about safely sharing the road with slower vehicles? Two things about this calculation. First, there are probably 200 cars using the twisty road for every cyclist, and every single one of them has to lose 2 minutes to save one cyclist 4 minutes. Second, it’s not just this one twisty road, if you expect cars to drive at all times as though a cyclist may be around the corner, you have to add this type of time to multiple stretches of your route, 2 minutes on this stretch, 3 minutes on that stretch, etc, etc, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/29 "2009-02-12T14:10:16Z")
> [@Roland\_Orzabal](#): > > I have no problem with cyclists. I used to be one myself in my teenage years, though that was in upstate New York, where the traffic was lighter and the roads better equipped to handle it. But sadly this was not done with cyclists in mind but rather snowplows. If it had been done with cyclists in mind it probably would have been more dangerous than it is since the shoulder would be like 3 feet instead of 6 ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/30 "2009-02-12T15:05:39Z")
> [@Roland\_Orzabal](#): > > Every time I’ve complained (not on this board that I recall, but myriad times elsewhere) about cyclists riding on exactly this sort of road – and we have a billion of 'em around here – I’ve gotten bitched out by an endless stream of people telling me they have a right to the road, and that it’s MY responsibility to drive safely around them. And you know what? They’re absolutely right. > > The point that never seems to get across is that being right doesn’t count for a whole hell of a lot when two tons of speeding steel comes into contact with 150 pounds of flesh, bone and a teensy piece of aluminum…because while I may drive safely (and I do), not everyone makes the same considerations. If you don’t believe that, just check the numerous cyclist rants about crazy-ass drivers on this very board. Do I really have to argue that a non-insignificant number of drivers have as much concern for the safety of cyclists as they do for the average windshield-bound locust swarm? Exactly. The Motorcycle Safety Foundation (I know, we’re talking about bicyclists here, but it’s still relevant) has a saying – “‘I had the right of way’ will look great on your headstone.” ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/31 "2009-02-12T15:13:47Z")
Jesus, I’d never ride on such a road. I think what a lot of bikers forget, as others have said, in their huffing and puffing, is that dead is dead, whether you had the right to be there or not. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/32 "2009-02-12T15:19:35Z")
> [@Roland\_Orzabal](#): > > Come on now. Do I really, truly need to argue that biking down a curvy, shoulderless mountain road is significantly more dangerous than driving down it? I don’t know about “significantly,” but if it is more dangerous, so what? At what danger do you draw the line between “you should do it carefully” and “you shouldn’t do it”? Or is it based on more than just the (perceived) danger level? I’m sure there are at least a couple of intersections in your town where multiple fatal car crashes have taken place. Do you tell your family members to take a detour and avoid those intersections, or do you tell them to be careful when they go through there? > [@](#): > > Number one, drivers drive more safely around other drivers than they do around cyclists. They’re more easily noticeable, and the protocols for dealing with them are more well-ingrained. Then, of course, there are the dickbags I’ve known who ACTUALLY feel that bicyclists have no business on the road – Well, I do disagree, but only have my personal experience to back it up. I see more reckless behavior when I’m on the car than when I’m biking. Most drivers take extraordinary pains to pass me with enough clearance. There’s an occasional idiot who passes with less than 1 ft to spare, but I’ve never actually had to make evasive maneuvers. There are occasional drivers who fail to notice a cyclist, but the cyclist can do something about that (I use a 200-lumen flashing light at all times, for example). There are a few drivers who are obviously hostile to cyclists, but it’s usually limited to verbal insult. In the past 10 years I’ve only seen three drivers actively endanger a cyclist - two who threw empty soda cans at me, and one who drove through an organized bike ride screeching his brakes behind every group of cyclist. But neither of them was actually trying to ram a cyclist. > [@](#): > > Number two, the number of car-on-car (or truck, or SUV, etc.) accidents I’ve personally witnessed or heard about from firsthand sources that have resulted in no injury to anyone involved is well into the dozens. The number of car-on-bike accidents I’ve heard of from ANY source that ended the same way is zero. Think for a moment about why that might be, and get back to me. I think you have a skewed sample. I’ve been in two car/bike accidents in the past 10 years (i.e. I was the cyclist). One incident where I was rear-ended while waiting at a stop light: no injury. The second one where I hit a car coming out of a parking lot (driver didn’t see me, that was before the 200-lumen light) - that did cause a big bruise on my thigh, but nothing worse than that, I got back on the bike and rode home. Again, I’m not claiming that cycling is _safer_ than driving. I’m just saying both are potentially deadly forms of transport that should be used carefully. But neither is so dangerous that you should be advising other people not to use at all. ---
**Author:** ![BlinkingDuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/eada6e/32.png) [@BlinkingDuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlinkingDuck)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/33 "2009-02-12T15:29:12Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > I am trying to remain neutral and would like to ask about driving with cyclists. I understand that cyclists should act like vehicles in terms of following the rules of the road, and car should treat them like vehicles. Please correct me on this. > > But in this situation, where the speed limit is 45 and there’s no shoulder, and cars are coming in both directions most of the time, can a cyclist act like a car and go fast enough? And if not, and they can’t pull over into a separate bike lane or shoulder, aren’t they making themselves a hazard or impediment? > > ETA: It’s not as much of an issue here because traffic isn’t usually very heavy and there’s opportunity to go around a bike (or tractor, for that matter), but I wonder about busier areas? Don’t bother using logic. You see, a bike can use that road…even tool along at 5 mph and the cars are supposed to be pleasant and ‘share the road’ with the bike. Bikes on the road are fine…so long as they can keep up with the traffic speeds. However, this reasonable opinion makes you an asshole to many. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/34 "2009-02-12T15:31:49Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Violence against cyclists isn’t some unconquerable force of nature, any more than lynching black people used to be (if I may be excused for comparing a relatively trivial, though still scary and occasionally deadly, form of violence with something as vicious as lynchings). Some people bash bikers for the same reason some people used to lynch blacks: because they enjoyed it and could get away with it. If society condemns and punishes them strongly enough for it, and supports the rights of their law-abiding victims adamantly enough, they will change their behavior. People ENJOY bashing bikers? ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/35 "2009-02-12T15:44:45Z")
> [@BlinkingDuck](#): > > Bikes on the road are fine…so long as they can keep up with the traffic speeds. However, this reasonable opinion makes you an asshole to many. Well yeah, you _are_ a selfish asshole if you define “traffic speed” to be _your_ speed (neglecting the fact that bicycles, semi-trailers, farm tractors, etc. are also traffic), and expect all vehicles to match it. ---
**Author:** ![Jayn\_Newell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Jayn\_Newell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jayn_Newell)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/36 "2009-02-12T16:16:46Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > Well yeah, you _are_ a selfish asshole if you define “traffic speed” to be _your_ speed (neglecting the fact that bicycles, semi-trailers, farm tractors, etc. are also traffic), and expect all vehicles to match it. I’ve come across my share of forklifts and semis blocking traffic, but usually these are at relatively straight stretches of road (meanings I have plenty of time to slow down/stop) and they’re not there long. Bikes are far more annoying because I’m stuck behind them until they pull off–which is never–or until I decide to pass. And when you’re on a narrow, curvy road with no shoulder–which, where I grew up, is everywhere–it can be a good while before you hit a stretch straight enough to be safe to pass, especially at bike speeds. There are some areas where I can expect to need to slow down, but bikes are rare enough that I’m not going to drive extra slow on the very slim chance there might be one around the next corner. I’ve never had an issue slowing down for bikes, but I always hated it when the yearly cross-country group came through. Locals joy-riding would usually pull onto the gravel shoulder to let cars pass. These guys never did, and there could be a dozen of them at a stretch, spread out in groups of twos and threes. Fortunately, I rarely ran into them going the same way. Sure, they have every right to be there. As I have every right to be annoyed at being forced to drive at 25% of normal speed. ---
**Author:** ![Hunter\_Hawk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/50afbb/32.png) [@Hunter\_Hawk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hunter_Hawk)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/37 "2009-02-12T16:33:56Z")
GQ-ish question (I’m not trying to make a point; I’m actually curious about this): It’s pretty standard for there to be laws prohibiting motor vehicles from holding up too much traffic. Are there analogous regulations that apply to bicycles? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/38 "2009-02-12T16:36:52Z")
> [@BlinkingDuck](#): > > Don’t bother using logic. You see, a bike can use that road…even tool along at 5 mph and the cars are supposed to be pleasant and ‘share the road’ with the bike. > > Bikes on the road are fine…so long as they can keep up with the traffic speeds. However, this reasonable opinion makes you an asshole to many. Cars on several roads around me have slowed me down tons of times or kept me from going at a decent pace due to their poor driving skills or the limitations of their vehicles. By your standards, it is a reasonable opinion that cars should be removed from those roads. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/39 "2009-02-12T16:41:24Z")
> [@Hunter\_Hawk](#): > > GQ-ish question (I’m not trying to make a point; I’m actually curious about this): It’s pretty standard for there to be laws prohibiting motor vehicles from holding up too much traffic. Are there analogous regulations that apply to bicycles? There are laws about impeding traffic, which many hysterical folks have decreed must mean bikes have to move off the road. However, the courts have ruled that a bike making a reasonable effort to go at his/her full speed is not impeding traffic. Trotwood vs. Selz is one such case, there are a few others. This obviously only applies to the USA. ---
**Author:** ![Hunter\_Hawk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/50afbb/32.png) [@Hunter\_Hawk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hunter_Hawk)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2009, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436/40 "2009-02-12T16:43:19Z")
Cool, thanks. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/cyclists-who-deliberately-ride-on-dangerous-roads/485436.md?page=3)