# Damn you Avril Lavigne **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 7, 2003, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187 "2003-01-07T21:39:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/1 "2003-01-07T21:39:58Z")
I can live with your music-- it’s kinda poppy and juvenile. I can put up with the constant criticism of Sk8er Boi. I’ve never heard the song all the way through for some reason, but what I’ve heard sounds all right. I can live with you getting 5 Grammy nominations; they don’t mean anything anyway. But this morning, while making Grammy announcements, you mispronounced the name David Bowie. Bow-ee, you said. Bow-ee. You rhymed it with Cow. It’s Bowie you silly little twit! Go back to small town Ontario! Every bungalow in your home town has at least one of his LPs taking space on the music shelf! The man’s a music legend who’s put out more albums than you’ve accumulated years on this planet! I’m ashamed that you’re Canadian. ---
**Author:** ![japatlgt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df705f/32.png) [@japatlgt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/japatlgt)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/2 "2003-01-07T21:51:17Z")
Incredible! Where’s the outrage! I hope Avril picks up her ‘new kiddie artist’ award or whatever and goes away. Talk about somebody milking their 15 minutes. Ugh! It’s over already! I shudder to think what the record labels will morph her into over the next couple of years. Isn’t it laconic? ---
**Author:** ![evilskippy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@evilskippy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/evilskippy)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/3 "2003-01-07T21:57:31Z")
The good news is that she was nominated for ‘Best New Artist’, so if she wins you might never have to think about her again until she shows up on a VH1 “Where are they now?” episode. That has been the pattern for that award. ---
**Author:** ![kung\_fu\_lola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f4b2a3/32.png) [@kung\_fu\_lola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kung_fu_lola)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/4 "2003-01-07T22:00:51Z")
Oh _man_, don’t you know _anything_? Bow-ee is the _punk_ pronunciation. Averil is a _punk_. Shit, I mean, proper pronunciation is so, like, bourgeois. Eat the rich! ---
**Author:** ![Witch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/258eb7/32.png) [@Witch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Witch)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/5 "2003-01-07T22:14:49Z")
I’ve also heard tell she named Joe Perry as her main guitar influence. I know it’s all a vicious, evil lie, that some record exec told her to say that, but I haven’t been the same since. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/6 "2003-01-07T22:16:46Z")
Oy! Righto! See, she can pronounce it any way she wants to, cause she’s punk and has mad _attitude_. Sheeeit. Punk’s been dead for 20 years. I thought that Green Day and their ilk violated Punk’s corpse enough. Now, along comes this silly bit of fluff who digs up the corpse, pisses on it, and reburies it upside down. Punk, being what it was, doesn’t mind this treatment. It just wishes somebody else were doing it. Was that enough mixed tenses for you? ---
**Author:** ![jack\_ss](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c77e96/32.png) [@jack\_ss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jack_ss)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/7 "2003-01-07T22:23:04Z")
I hate her damn email virus. ---
**Author:** ![I\_can\_t\_believe\_that\_s\_butter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8edcca/32.png) [@I\_can\_t\_believe\_that\_s\_butter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_can_t_believe_that_s_butter)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/8 "2003-01-07T22:24:08Z")
The funny thing about her is that she was singing country back in Napanee. Groomed to be a punk through-and-through. The “bough-ee” thing just might be a matter of dialect, but I hear you nonetheless. He certainly is famous enough… I don’t have much respect for her musically. ---
**Author:** ![SpasticKitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@SpasticKitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpasticKitty)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/9 "2003-01-07T22:46:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Witch \* > \*\*I’ve also heard tell she named Joe Perry as her main guitar influence. I know it’s all a vicious, evil lie, that some record exec told her to say that, but I haven’t been the same since. \*\* Well, she picked a hell of a guitarist as an influence. I love Joe Perry! I don’t know much about her, so correct me if I’m wrong, but…does she even play the freaking guitar? All I’ve seen her do on TV is run around screaming and crashing malls. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/10 "2003-01-07T22:56:54Z")
What the hell does Joe Perry have to do with punk again? Gregg Ginn, sure. Joe Piccioto and Ian MacKaye, yeah. Steve Jones? Johnny Ramone? Captain Sensible? Hell yes. Joe Perry? Um, no. ---
**Author:** ![glarGH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/76d3ee/32.png) [@glarGH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glarGH)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/11 "2003-01-07T23:23:41Z")
avril needs to go straight to hell. . . if for no other reason than “sk8er boi”… WTF!!! DIE YOU DIRTY DUMBWHORE! ---
**Author:** ![Kamandi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5daacb/32.png) [@Kamandi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamandi)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/12 "2003-01-07T23:38:33Z")
I liked “Skater Boy”. No, really. Stop laughing. It’s cute and fluffy and has a singable chorus. My wife bought her album. The whole thing’s pretty good, considering her age and experience. Is she any worse than any ten other pop princesses? Is it because of the manufactured “punk” thing? To be honest, I had no idea she was supposed to be punk until you guys brought it up. I thought she was just, y’know, singing. …and isn’t Bowie pronounced “Jones”? ---
**Author:** ![DadWagonDriver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/edb3f5/32.png) [@DadWagonDriver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DadWagonDriver)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2003, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/13 "2003-01-07T23:49:49Z")
Sorry **Ogre** , I have to disagree. Bands like NOFX, AFI and (to an extent) Pennywise ARE punk. The difference is, commercial radio, in all of its suckyness, won’t add any of these bands to their 4-song playlists. This is why I love going to a large university. We have a radio station that plays _music_. Sorry about the hijack. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2003, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/14 "2003-01-08T00:08:00Z")
This may be a disagreement in definitions rather than substance. Sure, NOFX has much in common with classic punk rock, but in my mind, the moniker can only be applied to bands and music from a specific cultural situation and time-frame…namely, the late seventies and early eighties. Phish has much in common with hippie bands, but are they really a hippie band? I don’t think so, personally. I generally think that the cultural values of the fans of the latter bands tend to be wholly different than those of the earlier bands…more watered-down. The real cultural force of both these types of music, I would argue, was expended fairly quickly, as more casual fans and scenesters infiltrated the movements. This is especially true of punk rock, where the scene was built strictly as an underground phenomenon…and its very nature was antithetical to being raised into the light of mainstream attention. In other words, once the suburban kids started ripping their jeans and using safety pins to hold them together, it became High Fashion, which placed punk in the Mainstream…the one place it couldn’t survive. Sure, there are still underground bands, but I don’t think they are “punk,” simply because they are now divorced from the cultural, political, and economic circumstances that led to Punk Rock’s ascendancy. Moreover, I tend to find NOFX, AFI, and Pennywise (ESPECIALLY Pennywise) boring, repetitive, and extremely unoriginal. Guys, please. It’s been done, thousands of times. And better. [/pedantic music rant] YMMV, of course, and I expect it does. ---
**Author:** ![Witch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/258eb7/32.png) [@Witch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Witch)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2003, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/15 "2003-01-08T01:10:58Z")
I love Joe Perry too **Spastic Kitty.** That’s why it cut me so deep. Ack. Gee **Ogre** I dunno. What the hell does Bowie have to do with punk again? ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2003, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/16 "2003-01-08T01:47:47Z")
Attitude, and his influence. He, Iggy Pop, the New York Dolls, T. Rex, the Velvet Underground, and other early-70’s glam rockers sort of gave punk rock a push, because of their rebellion against mainstream AOR-style music. They were proto-punks…true rebellious rock n’ rollers. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2003, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/17 "2003-01-08T01:57:58Z")
How would you feel, **Ogre** if I declared you dead? Awww…I won’t worry about it. It only makes us punk rockers feel even cooler that people feel compelled to fight about how dead or not dead punk is. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2003, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/18 "2003-01-08T02:04:57Z")
Eh, whatever, **even sven**. I don’t really care if you call yourself punk or not. As I said, YMMV. Ogre, veteran of quite a few “punk” bands ---
**Author:** ![Witch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/258eb7/32.png) [@Witch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Witch)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2003, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/19 "2003-01-08T03:22:20Z")
All true **Ogre** , as far as influence and such. But glam still aint punk, only a precursor to it. So don’t try to snow me. I was alive then too. All I was doing was adding an ON TOPIC addition of AVRIL’s other ridiculous forays into the world of “real” music. Gee, sorry if that offended you. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2003, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187/20 "2003-01-08T03:34:07Z")
Ziggy Stardust, just call him Ziggy. It’s hard to mispronounce Ziggy Stardust. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/damn-you-avril-lavigne/147187.md?page=2)